The burden of proof is still on the state to prove the money was gained unlawfully. The problem is even getting into court since it's a civil matter rather than criminal. Most people can't afford an attorney and if they can, the amount seized will usually be less than what it would cost to win it back in court.Originally Posted by patrickt
It's a really shitty deal.
The FBI is an arm of the dimshit cartel. As for forfeiture, the best thing to do if they ask you to get out of the car is tell them "Take me to jail if you have probable cause to stop me because I committed a crime. OR let me go. My family has plenty of money to get someone here in short order to straighten it out".
In some places they have a law called implied consent. They use it to search your car because the courts have decided that driving a car on their road implies you will consent to search you and your car.
Last edited by 12icer; 12-01-2021 at 08:12 PM.
Without freedom there is no life, I will not be ruled by any man!! THERE IS ONLY ONE KING
Rutabaga (12-01-2021)
Achievements:
those laws do NOT override your 4th amendment against unlawful search and seizures...
that wont stop them from violating your rights, but it will give ground for denying the arresting officers immunity, and suing the city/town for a violation of your civil rights.
Achievements:
NOTHING should be done without DUE PROCESS! Charge, indictment, trial by jury.
Achievements:
Even before they came up with the Implied Consent horseshit, they would put you through the wringer.
In 1992, Christmas, I was driving up from San Diego to Cleveland - military leave; had three weeks off. I don't like flying.
I was in my Dodge minivan, a panel variety. I used it in California to camp in the outback or on the beach when I could and had the time.
Even then, I wasn't a hard driver. I was 33 years old. So, I made it all the way from California to Missouri, no problems.
In Missouri, I got stopped...three, count 'em, THREE times. In the space of an hour. First time, three miles over the speed limit. Warning. Yeah, whatever.
Second time, failure to hold lane. On the white line...once, I guess. Warning. Different state cop, I should add.
Third time...I don't even remember, because it turned into a nightmare. Pulled over. The same blather. What are you doing here? Your license is Ohio and the truck is registered in California.
And then, "Would you mind if we looked through the back of the truck? Just procedural, of course."
I was hauling some stuff up for a friend on my ship, who also lived in the Cleveland area. He had bought a Jeep in California and wanted some personal stuff and the parts of his Jeep softtop up to Ohio. He was getting out in the spring. That would make moving easier for him.
And I sure didn't want to be framed or set up. This is how it's done...
So, I said, "Got a warrant?"
"No, but we can get one."
"Get me a valid warrant, and you can look all you like."
This was about 1600. Not optimal time to find a judge, but they weren't going to hurry, anyway. I just made their shift very easy.
So I got put in the back of their cruiser...and we waited. And waited. It's fortunate that I didn't have any coffee with lunch, because no one spoke of any kind of break.
Two hours later, another cruiser pulls up - the supervisor - with his warrant. And then, the three of them DUMP my van out, into the shoulder of the road, soaking from a cold rain. Just dump everything. Rip apart my duffle. Cut open my camping mattress (I'd stolen it when our ship threw out a number of them remodeling. Took my shaving kit apart - fortunately, back then, I wasn't on any medicines the way I am now.
An hour later, after examining my spare, taking it out from under the van (and not putting it away) they come back and let me out.
"You're free to go....why didn't you just let us search?"
I wasn't going to say anything because what I wanted to say would probably get them provoking me to strike one of them. Which was what they wanted. So I just threw the whole gooey mess into the back of the van, and resolved to keep driving until I got to Cleveland. I would be two days getting that stuff cleaned and folded, and throwing out the mattress (should have left it on the side of the road, those scumbags.
Anyway, I was not going to spend ONE PLUG NICKEL in that state. A promise I've kept.
Point of this is: They can make your life very, very miserable. I get what that was about: ultra-clean-cut driver; car that doesn't fit the driver; registration different from the driver's license. They were taking me for a drug mule.
Maybe no law could have prevented this; but there should have been some REASONABLE way to prevent it. Instead, we've gone from abusive searches to lawless seizures of property.
Last edited by JustPassinThru; 12-01-2021 at 09:39 PM.
Rutabaga (12-03-2021)
I was clearly talking about a search request...
Who made Who!?
Rutabaga (12-03-2021)
Civil forfeiture without due process is armed robbery, pure and simple.
Marxists, Socialists, Democrats, Russians, and the legacy media.
They lie all the time. They lie about everything.
They know they are lying. We know they are lying. They know we know they are lying.
They lie anyway. It's what they do.
Hillofbeans (12-02-2021),Rutabaga (12-03-2021),Wildrose (12-02-2021)
You do however have to provide them with your name, address, etc upon demand in many states.
If you are under arrest then you must provide ID upon demand.
The key word here is "Prior" due process. Your property or cash should never be taken without first at least some sort of hearing prior.
Institute for Justice exist to combat these types of abuses, but they can't keep up
Civil Forfeiture - Institute for Justice
Rutabaga (12-03-2021)
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