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Thread: Does anyone else think that it is time for conservatives to talk about healthcare?

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    Does anyone else think that it is time for conservatives to talk about healthcare?

    The ACA covered a good 1/3rd of previously uncovered Americans and provided a means to get healthcare without tying it to employment. Leaving healthcare tied to employment has several major disadvantages and if you are nearing retirement age but not yet Medicare eligible you may be trying to figure out how to deal with these disadvantages.
    Traditionally college students, people temporairly out of work and those close to retirement and their spouses are not well served by the way we accquire healthcare coverage. Add to that those who would rather work 2 or 3 part time jobs not having their entire income tied to one company.

    Don't get me wrong I am not a fan of Medicare for all because well government control and ineffectiveness.
    But IMO, we as conservatives have to offer a viable alternative or "join em". Medicare for all will happen and will help some but cause crippling debt unless we devise a better system to address modern healthcare needs and address these gaps as other countries have done.

    Any related ideas?

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    We do have a viable alternative in health savings accounts.

    They mean nothing to someone at or near retirement but to a young person contributing to them for a lifetime up until they really need it suddenly they have money in hand to shop around with which has the effect of lowering costs.

    There's no competition in healthcare other than how to further inflate prices because whenever a third party pays the person performing the service will bump things up just a little which then gets passed on to the users because to me "insurance is for people who arent rich enough to not need insurance" and they know that so they have you over a barrell.

    When Dave Letterman or Dave Thomas had thier heart bypasses, did they use insurance? I bet they had cash in hand and paid top doctors for their services, HSA's would give people that same type of shopping around ability, at 55 they have $1.5 million or so in an HSA, hospitals will be falling all over themselves to do that operation.
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    You're kidding, right? How much did it cost us to provide "insurance" to "1/3 of previously uncovered" people? Now you think we should double or triple down?

    ACA was not about providing healthcare. It was a government takeover of healthcare. Communism, Marxism, collectivism, socialism, nanny state, call it whatever you want, but call it a downgrade. And unfortunately, like everything else government takes over, once done, it never gets undone. All the doctors have already abandoned their "private practices" and sold out to the hospitals and networks and created a system of less competition, rather than more competition. It's gone, already. Any more cooking and we will have blackened ash.

    Health savings accounts might have worked, but forcing people to save ... hardly freedom. But now, just lining the pockets of a bloated industry with it's own set of oligarchs for sub standard care.

    Maybe some of you are healthy and not using health care, but go for a simple MRI ... the entity performing the MRI sends you a bill. Then, you get a bill from some far away place that read and interpreted the MRI, and then you get a bill from some lab that did the pre lab work for the MRI, and then you get a bill from some doctors group you never heard of who was subcontracted by the hospital performing the MRI. And oh, you thought the MRI was done in a hospital within your "network", but then insurance won't pay because all those sub contracted people were out of network, when it was not you that subcontracted any work! They charge you $1000 for something insurance says should cost $100, and insurance sends you a flyer about "how to avoid overbilling".

    There is a law of diminishing returns. That last 5% of Americans without any healthcare coverage, getting them covered will cost you dearly. As I learned it, Communism was Socialism by force. Welcome to the collective, comrade. Oh, and one vote, by one RINO, sealed our fate.
    Last edited by dinosaur; 06-19-2021 at 08:25 AM.

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    Medicare for all will happen and will help some but cause crippling debt unless we devise a better system to address modern healthcare needs and address these gaps as other countries have done.

    I have to laugh at the above sentence. Yes of course let's follow what other countries do. Just wondering have you checked the cost that "other countries" pay? I doubt it. You see I lived in several of those "other countries" with FREE healthcare. So why don't people that make these kind of statements actually check the cost? Oh sure 40 to 60 percent of your paycheck doesn't sound to bad unless you really think about it. But that isn't all of the cost. They tack on LOTS of extra taxes to pay for free socialized stuff.

    Haven't you ever wondered why Americans going overseas are looked at as rich Americans? The answer is that we ARE RICH compared to those over taxed suckers. They save all year long to take a vacation that we could afford to do by saving for 1 month (if that). How often have I pointed out that the second time I was there I had more extra spending money that their middle class. And that's after a divorce that left me stone cold broke & paying child support. When I left I could have gotten my son free meals because I made so little. What the F*** is wrong with people now days pushing something that is just a dream without researching it in any way? Check rent prices, check grocery price, check transportation prices (because most of you won't be able to afford a car), & for those that can afford a car check gas prices (remember 4 liters is less than a gallon. But why should I say anything because people now days are clueless & want to stay that way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Frankenvoter View Post
    We do have a viable alternative in health savings accounts.

    They mean nothing to someone at or near retirement but to a young person contributing to them for a lifetime up until they really need it suddenly they have money in hand to shop around with which has the effect of lowering costs.

    There's no competition in healthcare other than how to further inflate prices because whenever a third party pays the person performing the service will bump things up just a little which then gets passed on to the users because to me "insurance is for people who arent rich enough to not need insurance" and they know that so they have you over a barrell.

    When Dave Letterman or Dave Thomas had thier heart bypasses, did they use insurance? I bet they had cash in hand and paid top doctors for their services, HSA's would give people that same type of shopping around ability, at 55 they have $1.5 million or so in an HSA, hospitals will be falling all over themselves to do that operation.
    There is a lot of competition for Medicare recipients. Even though it isn't open enrollment time there are ads every 10 minutes looking to sign people up for advantage plans. Which indicates to me that Medicare is very lucrative for health care providers. Medicare and Medicaid, your are probably either doing it wrong or getting your coverage for virtually free.
    Parnellforsenate.com

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    Honestly this subject piss's me off. People complain how much our medical care costs all the F time. And how about how expensive our drugs are? Yes they are expensive but you & I have them because of our tax system & those higher prices. Did you know that 70% of all new medications are developed here in America. That's because it's EXPENSIVE to develop new drugs & to test them. American's pay the bulk of that cost because those places with "free" healthcare can't afford the drugs at a normal price. As in, they will let their people die to save on money. I'll say that again..They will let their people die to save on money.

    So the next time you have to pay a high price for a drug just think about this. If the price was low in the past then very probably that drug wouldn't have been developed & you couldn't buy it AT ANY PRICE.

    We complain about the younger generation that takes everything for granted & wants more & more free stuff. Yet here we are doing the same with basically the same lack of knowledge that they have about cost & why. I look around & wonder (I may check it out later) how long did Rome rule before interbreeding & stagnation turned them into losers who lost their empire? Somehow from what I'm seeing lately I think that our leadership in the world will end soon & I bet they were leaders longer than we were.

    Now I think I'm going to have 5 or 6 beers because I've just gotten tired of people lately.

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    Bottom line, do people need healthcare insurance? In my 70 years I have never NEEDED health care insurance. I have paid into the various systems of heath care much more then I have ever received back. But it was always nice to know I was covered "IF" it happened.

    As for the cost, employee health care isn't free. A person pays with lower wages and or co-pays/primiums. So what if we took the huge pile of money spent by private companies and put it into a Medicare for all? It's not like Medicare is free. Right now if a person is on Medicare they pay 144.90/ month, plus if they work they also pay Medicare tax. So the wife and I pay, directly, 289.80 to Medicare every month. Which is a whole lot cheaper then we paid for crappy Obamacare. Three years ago I was paying for her and a plan not as good as Medicare cost over 1000 per month.

    So we as a nation spend a whole lot of money on healthcare it is just a matter how it is spent.

    If the legislature is serious about Medicare for all then it is simple what their step should be, put all government employees, including themselves, on Medicare. But we all know that isn't going to happen.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Old Tex View Post
    Honestly this subject piss's me off. People complain how much our medical care costs all the F time. And how about how expensive our drugs are? Yes they are expensive but you & I have them because of our tax system & those higher prices. Did you know that 70% of all new medications are developed here in America. That's because it's EXPENSIVE to develop new drugs & to test them. American's pay the bulk of that cost because those places with "free" healthcare can't afford the drugs at a normal price. As in, they will let their people die to save on money. I'll say that again..They will let their people die to save on money.

    So the next time you have to pay a high price for a drug just think about this. If the price was low in the past then very probably that drug wouldn't have been developed & you couldn't buy it AT ANY PRICE.

    We complain about the younger generation that takes everything for granted & wants more & more free stuff. Yet here we are doing the same with basically the same lack of knowledge that they have about cost & why. I look around & wonder (I may check it out later) how long did Rome rule before interbreeding & stagnation turned them into losers who lost their empire? Somehow from what I'm seeing lately I think that our leadership in the world will end soon & I bet they were leaders longer than we were.

    Now I think I'm going to have 5 or 6 beers because I've just gotten tired of people lately.
    A little story about drug cost games played. As everyone should know what insurance companies pay for a medicine is dictated by formulary charts that they create. They say it is pharmacists and doctors who create the charts, they never mention the accountants that obviously must have input.

    I take some maintenance type drugs and when I signed up for my new advantage plan I called and asked one question, what would be the cost. I was told they were tier 1 drugs so no co-pay. I told them I think them wrong but I was condescendingly told I was wrong.

    So I signed up with the plan only to find out I was correct and these were tier 2 drugs. I also had to now pay GWB's penalty for not having a prescription drug plan. So I called and complained that they told me the wrong information. Since they record every conversation they came back and said, I was right but tough luck. I filed formulary exception paperwork and grievances all denied.

    I wondered how the woman got the information wrong. I also wondered why I believed her. Turns out the company has 8 advantage plans seven of which use one formulary chart and the one I chose used another. On the 7 the drugs are tier 1. Yet when I asked for an exception I was told that they couldn't change the formulary charts because Medicare regulations say they can't because there was no drugs on that tier that treated my condition. Which I showed them was pure BS. Didn't matter. I can only assume that the reason they are tier 2 on my plan is because it is popular.
    Parnellforsenate.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Freewill View Post
    There is a lot of competition for Medicare recipients. Even though it isn't open enrollment time there are ads every 10 minutes looking to sign people up for advantage plans. Which indicates to me that Medicare is very lucrative for health care providers. Medicare and Medicaid, your are probably either doing it wrong or getting your coverage for virtually free.
    I'm sure it's lucrative for health care providers, actual quality of service as well as wait time and death panels are a definite downside to the consumer.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frankenvoter View Post
    I'm sure it's lucrative for health care providers, actual quality of service as well as wait time and death panels are a definite downside to the consumer.
    I don't go to the doctor often but none of the bolded has ever really been a problem for me. Death panels is unfortunately a fact of life. If you don't think they kill people today, check yourself into a Hospice, good luck with that.
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