# Stuff and Things > HISTORY, veterans & science >  The tragedy of Covid victims who said no to the vaccine

## Neo

They didn't have to die.This is the terrible truth of America's new pandemic battlefront, as the malicious, highly infectious Delta variant surges, targeting millions who sadly left it too late to protect themselves with safe, free and effective vaccines.
Michael Freedy, a Las Vegas father of five, could still be the light of his kids' lives. Instead, they will be always haunted by one of his wrenching final texts before he died on Thursday: "I should have gotten the damn vaccine."
Kim Maginn, a 63-year-old Arkansas grandma and fitness enthusiast, should still have years to watch her family grow. Instead, her daughter, Rachel Rosser, a nurse, is left to ask why she couldn't convince her late mom to get her shots.
"I'm angry that she didn't get vaccinated. And I personally feel guilty that I didn't try harder," Rosser said. 
Unfortunately, Maginn had reasoned that if she was going to come down with Covid she would have gotten it by now.
https://edition.cnn.com/2021/08/03/p...ine/index.html

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## Oceander

> They didn't have to die.This is the terrible truth of America's new pandemic battlefront, as the malicious, highly infectious Delta variant surges, targeting millions who sadly left it too late to protect themselves with safe, free and effective vaccines.
> Michael Freedy, a Las Vegas father of five, could still be the light of his kids' lives. Instead, they will be always haunted by one of his wrenching final texts before he died on Thursday: "I should have gotten the damn vaccine."
> Kim Maginn, a 63-year-old Arkansas grandma and fitness enthusiast, should still have years to watch her family grow. Instead, her daughter, Rachel Rosser, a nurse, is left to ask why she couldn't convince her late mom to get her shots.
> "I'm angry that she didn't get vaccinated. And I personally feel guilty that I didn't try harder," Rosser said. 
> Unfortunately, Maginn had reasoned that if she was going to come down with Covid she would have gotten it by now.
> https://edition.cnn.com/2021/08/03/p...ine/index.html


Oh goodie.  More pro-vaxxer fear pron, to go along with the anti-vaxxers' fear pron.  

Point/counterpoint.

Let's all get gaslit.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Camp (08-03-2021),Canadianeye (08-03-2021),Fall River (08-03-2021),FNguy (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),Kodiak (08-03-2021),Mainecoons (08-03-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-03-2021),patrickt (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## Conservative Libertarian

Big assed guilt trip and hit piece from the Commie News Network.

The CDC is admitting that the vaccines aren't working and that many vaccinated people are catching COVID. I realize that the BBC and their CNN Komrads probably aren't reporting that.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Big Bird (08-03-2021),Big Dummy (08-03-2021),Fall River (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),Kodiak (08-03-2021),Mainecoons (08-03-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-03-2021),patrickt (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021)

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## St James

Neo, Neo, Neo.............. This is the same anecdotal story that has been burning its way across the internet. There is some doubt about the veracity of this story. I tried to do some backstory research, and their names don't even appear in my People Search.
Take the shot. Wear your mask, because it is the people who have gotten the jab are the ones creating the problems.
Be a lab rat without complaint. It wouldn't do you any good because if you perished from COVID after getting the jab, you have zero legal recourse. Biden has granted the vaccine producers total exemption from legal actions.
And, you have no Right to demand anything of your neighbors.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Big Bird (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),Fall River (08-03-2021),Kodiak (08-03-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021)

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## Old Tex

To me the big question is: Why do humans seem to have a need to get others to agree with them on any topic under the sun. Politics, religion, lack of religion, or covid. So why not just agree here & do what you want. 

1.Want me to take a covid shot, Ok I got one yesterday.

2. Think they are dangerous & don't want to get one. Ok, me to so I haven't gotten one.

Take your pick, either 1 or 2.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),donttread (08-03-2021),Fall River (08-03-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-03-2021),patrickt (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021),Thom Paine (08-03-2021)

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## Canadianeye

> Neo, Neo, Neo.............. This is the same anecdotal story that has been burning its way across the internet. There is some doubt about the veracity of this story. I tried to do some backstory research, and their names don't even appear in my People Search.
> Take the shot. Wear your mask, because it is the people who have gotten the jab are the ones creating the problems.
> Be a lab rat without complaint. It wouldn't do you any good because if you perished from COVID after getting the jab, you have zero legal recourse. Biden has granted the vaccine producers total exemption from legal actions.
> And, you have no Right to demand anything of your neighbors.


The governments have granted themselves the same legal recourse protection - which is WHY they haven't mandated everyone to be vaccinated.

This of course produces a legal recourse option if one happens to be employed, and your employer demands you to be vaccinated. That however, will then have to go to the courts, which, are stacked and marching in lockstep with their employers... the government.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),FirstGenCanadian (08-04-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

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## St James

> To me the big question is: Why do humans seem to have a need to get others to agree with them on any topic under the sun. Politics, religion, lack of religion, or covid. So why not just agree here & do what you want. 
> 
> 1.Want me to take a covid shot, Ok I got one yesterday.
> 
> 2. Think they are dangerous & don't want to get one. Ok, me to so I haven't gotten one.
> 
> Take your pick, either 1 or 2.


It is the urge of the Collective, nay, the WILL. They cannot stand Individualism in any form.
You do not have the right to be an individual. They are literally the Borg. 
If they cannot have group-think, they will be forced into becoming individuals.
"What me do something for myself, for my self? I never learned how. _(I ignored the lessons)_"

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),donttread (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## donttread

> They didn't have to die.This is the terrible truth of America's new pandemic battlefront, as the malicious, highly infectious Delta variant surges, targeting millions who sadly left it too late to protect themselves with safe, free and effective vaccines.
> Michael Freedy, a Las Vegas father of five, could still be the light of his kids' lives. Instead, they will be always haunted by one of his wrenching final texts before he died on Thursday: "I should have gotten the damn vaccine."
> Kim Maginn, a 63-year-old Arkansas grandma and fitness enthusiast, should still have years to watch her family grow. Instead, her daughter, Rachel Rosser, a nurse, is left to ask why she couldn't convince her late mom to get her shots.
> "I'm angry that she didn't get vaccinated. And I personally feel guilty that I didn't try harder," Rosser said. 
> Unfortunately, Maginn had reasoned that if she was going to come down with Covid she would have gotten it by now.
> https://edition.cnn.com/2021/08/03/p...ine/index.html


Their choice. You can find tear jerker stories on any topic when your sample size is 330,000,000.   Besides aren't we being told now that the vaccines aren't enough? that we still need mask? I mean I agree that the vax is the best route for most , but most who refuse will be fine.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),Oceander (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

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## Kodiak

> Neo, Neo, Neo.............. This is the same anecdotal story that has been burning its way across the internet. There is some doubt about the veracity of this story. I tried to do some backstory research, and their names don't even appear in my People Search.
> Take the shot. Wear your mask, because it is the people who have gotten the jab are the ones creating the problems.
> Be a lab rat without complaint. It wouldn't do you any good because if you perished from COVID after getting the jab, you have zero legal recourse. Biden has granted the vaccine producers total exemption from legal actions.
> And, *you have no Right to demand anything of your neighbors.*



Exactly!  Some are just way too caught up in the fear mongoring over something with a relatively very small death rate.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

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## UKSmartypants

Well theres a complicating factor-  Herd Immunity. If thers enough non immune, then Herd Immunuty fails and everyone ius in danger then.



If you were the only car on the road, its entirely up to you, then, whether you obey road signs.   However, when there are other road users, its a good plan to start observing road signs, in case you crash into someone else.

Antivaxxers take the position  "I know there are other road users, but  im still going to ignore roads signs, cos i dont believe anyone will ever crash into me".

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Neo (08-03-2021)

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## Rutabaga

The tragedy of the covid vac. labrats that died due to the covid vac.

1 coin
2 sides

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

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## patrickt

A text? You know whose phone it came from but how do you know who sent it? Amazingly, these anecdotes all support the dictators. I wonder why the media doesn't print any stories from those who had had adverse reactions or died from the vaccine? Oh, wait, we all know the answer to that, don't we.

My sister got vaccinated as quickly as possible. She said she would have immunity to COVID. She was not happy when the same people who said she would have immunity and could  return to a normal life said, "Ooopsie. You're not immune but if you get sick you're less likely to die." Of course, few of the infected under age 75 died anyway. Now they're telling her to wear a mask and avoid other people. Her life is not returning to normal. Damn good thing she got the vaccine in which the pharmaceutical companies have so much confidence they demanded and got total immunity from civil actions before they'd put out the vaccine.

That's my anecdote. It will never make CNN.


I'll be 80 this month and I would rather die this year than live under tyranny.

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12icer (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

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## patrickt

> To me the big question is: Why do humans seem to have a need to get others to agree with them on any topic under the sun. Politics, religion, lack of religion, or covid. So why not just agree here & do what you want. 
> 
> 1.Want me to take a covid shot, Ok I got one yesterday.
> 
> 2. Think they are dangerous & don't want to get one. Ok, me to so I haven't gotten one.
> 
> Take your pick, either 1 or 2.


The same reason that pedophiles and Democrats are convinced everyone does what they do. Roman Polanski in an interview said the judge, the district attorney, and the men on the jury wanted to do what he did which was drug a 13-year-old girl so he could have anal sex with her. Sorry Roman, you're on your own. Well, maybe with Bill Clinton and Joe Biden.

Every pedophile I arrested was convinced he was the norm and every crooked cop I dealt with was convinced all cops were crooked. It's what deviants do. Now you know why people knock on your door to tell you you'll be sorry if you don't join their church.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

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## GaryAnderson

Why do anti vaxxers believe that vaccines contain a tracking chip?
And what is the purpose of this tracking chip? To track your movements from bedroom to living room to supermarket ?

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Neo (08-03-2021)

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## ruthless terrier

this article brought to you by Stephen Collinson .. another Trump hating globalist virus monger.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Captain Kirk! (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

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## Captain Kirk!

> They didn't have to die.This is the terrible truth of America's new pandemic battlefront, as the malicious, highly infectious Delta variant surges, targeting millions who sadly left it too late to protect themselves with safe, free and effective vaccines.
> Michael Freedy, a Las Vegas father of five, could still be the light of his kids' lives. Instead, they will be always haunted by one of his wrenching final texts before he died on Thursday: "I should have gotten the damn vaccine."
> Kim Maginn, a 63-year-old Arkansas grandma and fitness enthusiast, should still have years to watch her family grow. Instead, her daughter, Rachel Rosser, a nurse, is left to ask why she couldn't convince her late mom to get her shots.
> "I'm angry that she didn't get vaccinated. And I personally feel guilty that I didn't try harder," Rosser said. 
> Unfortunately, Maginn had reasoned that if she was going to come down with Covid she would have gotten it by now.
> https://edition.cnn.com/2021/08/03/p...ine/index.html

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),memesofine (08-03-2021)

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## memesofine

omg
omg omg omg omg omg omg omg omg omg omg

remember folks it's ok to say, MY BODY MY CHOICE only when it come to killing ones offspring with ABORTIONS. 

But you will die die die if you refuse this vaccine. 

57rc0t.jpg

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12icer (08-03-2021),Captain Kirk! (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),JustPassinThru (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

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## memesofine

I do believe we have a Guberment tool who gets paid to post all this Guberment says, crap on here. I'm about to put them on IGNORE.

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12icer (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

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## 12icer

> Why do anti vaxxers believe that vaccines contain a tracking chip?
> And what is the purpose of this tracking chip? To track your movements from bedroom to living room to supermarket ?


Why are you pushing this poison? You must believe that the dimshits actually took the stuff they are giving to everyone else. 
Since I got the vaccine, I have lost a lot of my former energy, I have developed some symptoms of an overactive immune system including some symptoms of RA including a couple of joints beginning to have a red knot on them. 
People like you apparently think it is okay to tell people that they need to take a shot of poison without knowing the FACTS about what it will do to them. 
Just the immunity from lawsuits should be enough to deter most from taking the shot. 
My doctor told me to take it when the info was ALLL GOOD, he also said that he and his staff had all had it and that it would make you feel a little different after your last one. 
He did not know how different AND NEITHER DO YOU!!! 
I have had a dozen friends have serious problems from blood clots to pericardial infection from the poison along with energy loss and immune responses being out of control. 
I have had three friends die within two or three days of taking the poison. 

So get off the soapbox and think "it is okay to murder babies with the my body my choice" that ends up in death for someone 999,999,999 times out of 1,000,000,000; so it is okay for people to decide not to take a damn vaccine.

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Captain Kirk! (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),memesofine (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## JMWinPR

> Well theres a complicating factor-  Herd Immunity. If thers enough non immune, then Herd Immunuty fails and everyone ius in danger then.
> 
> 
> 
> If you were the only car on the road, its entirely up to you, then, whether you obey road signs.   However, when there are other road users, its a good plan to start observing road signs, in case you crash into someone else.
> 
> Antivaxxers take the position  "I know there are other road users, but  im still going to ignore roads signs, cos i dont believe anyone will ever crash into me".


Cudn't be more wrong. I drive carefully all of the time. Regardless of whether or not there are cars, pedestrians, animals etc. As for the VAX, welll please 'splain to me why I shud getta vax for something that has a 99.9856 survival rate for my age group. Can be treated with OTC meds, and still must wear a mask? If you feel the need to be maskified get urself an N95 and leave the rational pipples alone. You might even want to consider the device with "Face Shield" written on it. Mebbee even 4 of 'em to keep fourply safe. Recall the famous phrase of Mr Miagi "Mask On, Mask Off".

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Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),memesofine (08-03-2021),patrickt (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## MrMike

Sorry, I'm not buying the narrative they're trying to sell.  And yes, I'm vaccinated (pfizer) and not by choice.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),patrickt (08-03-2021)

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## Captain Kirk!

> Why do anti vaxxers believe that vaccines contain a tracking chip?
> And what is the purpose of this tracking chip? To track your movements from bedroom to living room to supermarket ?


If they believe that it's because they don't trust the government and with good reason.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## patrickt

> Why do anti vaxxers believe that vaccines contain a tracking chip?
> And what is the purpose of this tracking chip? To track your movements from bedroom to living room to supermarket ?


Why do some people believe, "Hi, we're from the government and we're here to help you." I am not vaccinated. I'm not planning on getting vaccinated. I don't think there is a tracking chip in the vaccine. When you have to report in every six months for a booster shot, why have a chip? When you live in a permanent state of pandemic hysteria, why have a chip? When you actually think the government cares and you are obedient, why have a chip?

And keep in mind, the same people who released over 20,000 convicted felons iain Californ to commit more crimes care so much for your health and safety they want to mandate the vaccine. The same people who told you that you can't go to church but you can go to a Democrat-led BLM riot and you can't go to an AA meeting but liquor stores are an essential business care about you. The same people who said you couldn't go to work are now saying you can only go to work if you get this shot.

I don't trust them.
And, when you can shoot and kill an unarmed woman for, at worst, trespassing and keep all information concerning the killing a secret, why have a chip?

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Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## Authentic

> Well theres a complicating factor-  Herd Immunity. If thers enough non immune, then Herd Immunuty fails and everyone ius in danger then.
> 
> 
> 
> If you were the only car on the road, its entirely up to you, then, whether you obey road signs.   However, when there are other road users, its a good plan to start observing road signs, in case you crash into someone else.
> 
> Antivaxxers take the position  "I know there are other road users, but  im still going to ignore roads signs, cos i dont believe anyone will ever crash into me".


If the vaccine is effective then vaccinated have nothing to fear from unvaccinated.

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Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),donttread (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## Old Tex

When you have to report in every six months for a booster shot, why have a chip?

Just an interesting thought. Is that going to be a booster shot? How exactly would you know what the "booster shot" is? Also we saw a lot of politicians on the news getting the shot. How do we know what was in the syringe?  Just a tin foil observation. 

Something that I saw "somewhere" the other day. Might have been here or might have been a video on U-tube. Anyway they were pushing getting the shots & one of the main reasons was that it had been tested & was proven safe. And also point out that there were millions of people out there that had gotten the shots & they were examples of how harmless it was. 

Well I'll skip over all the adverse reactions that we have heard about. Forget them for a moment. Let's talk about it being "tested" & "trial period". My question is does the general public really believe that from start to sales a drug can be developed, tested & sold in 2, 3 or even 5 years? I ask because that doesn't happen. Even fast tracked drugs that "might" be life saving to treat something that has a 90% death rate don't hit the market in less than 3 or 4 years. The only way to get those drugs are if your in the clinical trial, which is part of the testing process. So when I hear that these drugs have been tested & found safe a little voice in my head screams BULLSHIT.  

I'll come back & throw this out there. If you have had the shot then YOU are taking part in the clinical trial.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021)

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## St James

> Why do anti vaxxers believe that vaccines contain a tracking chip?
> And what is the purpose of this tracking chip? To track your movements from bedroom to living room to supermarket ?


It has nothing to do with any chip, so, there's that ........a fed herring if you will.....
query: What all is in the shot? 
One alters your mRNA, the other is now calling for a booster every 6 months ........and some are calling for weekly shots..........
If it works as well as Joe said it would, in the beginning, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
Make sure you wear your mask, maybe two, when you go to bed at night.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021)

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## UKSmartypants

> Cudn't be more wrong. I drive carefully all of the time. Regardless of whether or not there are cars, pedestrians, animals etc. As for the VAX, welll please 'splain to me why I shud getta vax for something that has a 99.9856 survival rate for my age group. Can be treated with OTC meds, and still must wear a mask? If you feel the need to be maskified get urself an N95 and leave the rational pipples alone. You might even want to consider the device with "Face Shield" written on it. Mebbee even 4 of 'em to keep fourply safe. Recall the famous phrase of Mr Miagi "Mask On, Mask Off".



Well lest be clear

1. im opposed to mandatory shots but 2. its in everyone's interest we achieve herd immunity, if the immune drop below about 75% then the virus fires up again and starts killing people prematurely. 

So whilst i agree it should not be compulsory, its also morally indefensible to say "I refuse consider the potentially lethal consequences of my actions on other people"

Heres the thing about 'rights'. You can only have Rights if you take Responsibility to exercise those rights  equitable, and accept the Obligations to other people  having those rights places on you. This is the flaw in your post above. The air starts out clean and virus free. I have a right to breathe that air, but you dont have a right to pollute it with a potentially lethal virus. In your example the status quo (clean air) prevails.

This is the essential difference between a society that says "Is everyone OK?" and one that says "Fuck you jack, Im all right". I know which one i prefer.

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## donttread

> Well theres a complicating factor-  Herd Immunity. If thers enough non immune, then Herd Immunuty fails and everyone ius in danger then.
> 
> 
> 
> If you were the only car on the road, its entirely up to you, then, whether you obey road signs.   However, when there are other road users, its a good plan to start observing road signs, in case you crash into someone else.
> 
> Antivaxxers take the position  "I know there are other road users, but  im still going to ignore roads signs, cos i dont believe anyone will ever crash into me".



How or to what extent do non vaccinated people put you in danger? You are probably in far more danger on the roads then you are from COVID as a vaccinated person. 
BTW although I disagree  but I deeply appreciate post like this which keep us from being an echo chamber.

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12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## Authentic

How do we know that what is in the vials is even a vaccine? CNN says so? Fauci says so?

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12icer (08-03-2021),Captain Kirk! (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021)

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## donttread

> To me the big question is: Why do humans seem to have a need to get others to agree with them on any topic under the sun. Politics, religion, lack of religion, or covid. So why not just agree here & do what you want. 
> 
> 1.Want me to take a covid shot, Ok I got one yesterday.
> 
> 2. Think they are dangerous & don't want to get one. Ok, me to so I haven't gotten one.
> 
> Take your pick, either 1 or 2.



Exactly. Someone with medical anxiety might chase the absolute assurance that there is nothing seriously physically wrong with them. But such assurances are not possible and there is no guarantee that any of us make it through today although for most it is VERY likely that we will. Chasing that absolute that doesn't exist can wreck people just as surely chasing the highs you used to get can. 

On the other hand the anti-vaxxers could also relax a bit. No need to save the world from what you believe ( without proof) to be a menace in disguise. 

In truth the vast majority of both vaccinated and non vaccinated will see 2022 even 2023!

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12icer (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## donttread

> Why do anti vaxxers believe that vaccines contain a tracking chip?
> And what is the purpose of this tracking chip? To track your movements from bedroom to living room to supermarket ?


It's fear. Media fed anxiety just like that experienced by vaccinated people who feel they should be able to force vaccination upon others. For starters the government already knows where you are ( if they want to know)

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Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

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## Authentic

Don't get the chip.

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## donttread

> Well lest be clear
> 
> 1. im opposed to mandatory shots but 2. its in everyone's interest we achieve herd immunity, if the immune drop below about 75% then the virus fires up again and starts killing people prematurely. 
> 
> So whilst i agree it should not be compulsory, its also morally indefensible to say "I refuse consider the potentially lethal consequences of my actions on other people"
> 
> Heres the thing about 'rights'. You can only have Rights if you take Responsibility to exercise those rights  equitable, and accept the Obligations to other people  having those rights places on you. This is the flaw in your post above. The air starts out clean and virus free. I have a right to breathe that air, but you dont have a right to pollute it with a potentially lethal virus. In your example the status quo (clean air) prevails.
> 
> This is the essential difference between a society that says "Is everyone OK?" and one that says "Fuck you jack, Im all right". I know which one i prefer.



Have you actually looked up how few vaccinated people have died of COVID?




About 99.999% of fully vaccinated Americans have not had a deadly Covid-19 breakthrough case

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JMWinPR (08-03-2021)

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## Old Tex

> Have you actually looked up how few vaccinated people have died of COVID?
> About 99.999% of fully vaccinated Americans have not had a deadly Covid-19 breakthrough case


So now we know where the election officials that counted the votes for the election have moved to. They are compiling covid stats.

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Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021)

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## 12icer

The chip thing is a quandry, My son works with someone who took an android phone and held it up to some vaccinated people and it found a signal that was trying to bluetooth connect to his android phone each person had a different number attached to the signal. There were others there who saw all of this. 
They walked away from the group, no cell phone or watch or anything and he tried it on four or five and got a signal on every one. 
I don't know the reason, but the ones he tried it with that were not vaxxed had nothing. 
These people work with electronics and radio electronics all day every day sometimes twelve hours a day so they are not some group of know nothing dimshits.

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Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> The chip thing is a quandry, My son works with someone who took an android phone and held it up to some vaccinated people and it found a signal that was trying to bluetooth connect to his android phone each person had a different number attached to the signal. There were others there who saw all of this. 
> They walked away from the group, no cell phone or watch or anything and he tried it on four or five and got a signal on every one. 
> I don't know the reason, but the ones he tried it with that were not vaxxed had nothing. 
> These people work with electronics and radio electronics all day every day sometimes twelve hours a day so they are not some group of know nothing dimshits.


Hmmpf.  Well, I had two doses of the Moderna vaccine, and so far, none of the three phones - two iPhones, one android - in my immediate vicinity have been able to pick up squat of a bluetooth signal coming from me.

Maybe my chips just weren't activated properly?

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),donttread (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## Canadianeye

> The chip thing is a quandry, My son works with someone who took an android phone and held it up to some vaccinated people and it found a signal that was trying to bluetooth connect to his android phone each person had a different number attached to the signal. There were others there who saw all of this. 
> They walked away from the group, no cell phone or watch or anything and he tried it on four or five and got a signal on every one. 
> I don't know the reason, but the ones he tried it with that were not vaxxed had nothing. 
> These people work with electronics and radio electronics all day every day sometimes twelve hours a day so they are not some group of know nothing dimshits.


Interesting. @FirstGenCanadian

He's pretty savvy on this kind of stuff.

----------


## Rutabaga

> Sorry, I'm not buying the narrative they're trying to sell.  And yes, I'm vaccinated (pfizer) and not by choice.



you travel...you should have bought a blank "covid-19 passport" on ebay for 5 bucks...

nobody's business but your own...

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

> The chip thing is a quandry, My son works with someone who took an android phone and held it up to some vaccinated people and it found a signal that was trying to bluetooth connect to his android phone each person had a different number attached to the signal. There were others there who saw all of this. 
> They walked away from the group, no cell phone or watch or anything and he tried it on four or five and got a signal on every one. 
> I don't know the reason, but the ones he tried it with that were not vaxxed had nothing. 
> These people work with electronics and radio electronics all day every day sometimes twelve hours a day so they are not some group of know nothing dimshits.


you mean my cell phone signal jammer works on the "chip"?

 :Smiley20: 
who knew?

----------

12icer (08-03-2021)

----------


## Canadianeye

> Hmmpf.  Well, I had two doses of the Moderna vaccine, and so far, none of the three phones - two iPhones, one android - in my immediate vicinity have been able to pick up squat of a bluetooth signal coming from me.
> 
> Maybe my chips just weren't activated properly?


AH HA!! You said in your immediate vicinity. That is code for - you withheld information about outside of your immediate vicinity.

snekciht tolp ehT

----------

Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

> Hmmpf.  Well, I had two doses of the Moderna vaccine, and so far, none of the three phones - two iPhones, one android - in my immediate vicinity have been able to pick up squat of a bluetooth signal coming from me.
> 
> Maybe my chips just weren't activated properly?



have you tried picking up wifi?

where do you put the usb cord?

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),Oceander (08-03-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> Hmmpf.  Well, I had two doses of the Moderna vaccine, and so far, none of the three phones - two iPhones, one android - in my immediate vicinity have been able to pick up squat of a bluetooth signal coming from me.
> 
> Maybe my chips just weren't activated properly?


Just in case this comes up. 
For a short time many years ago, I received radio signals on one of my tooth fillings. Vaccines were not not involved.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),St James (08-03-2021)

----------


## Authentic

It's a chip off of the old vaccine block.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> Just in case this comes up. 
> For a short time many years ago, I received radio signals on one of my tooth fillings. Vaccines were not not involved.


Hello, Lucille!

----------

12icer (08-03-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> have you tried picking up wifi?
> 
> where do you put the usb cord?


(a) I'll try with my wifi scanner when I get home,

(b) Nunya!

 :Smiley ROFLMAO:

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

> (a) I'll try with my wifi scanner when I get home,
> 
> (b) Nunya!



can i get your password?

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Oceander (08-03-2021)

----------


## Neo

> Why do anti vaxxers believe that vaccines contain a tracking chip?
> And what is the purpose of this tracking chip? To track your movements from bedroom to living room to supermarket ?


The people who believe the vaccine has a chip are the same ones that believe in alien abductions, aliens probing their anus,  and wear tin foil hats..I kid ye not.

----------

GaryAnderson (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

> The people who believe the vaccine has a chip are the same ones that believe in alien abductions, aliens probing their anus,  and wear tin foil hats…..I kid ye not.


i dont know about any chip or tin foil hats,,,but aliens will probe your butthole if you show it to them... :Thumbsup20:

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),Lone Gunman (08-03-2021),Oceander (08-03-2021)

----------


## Authentic

I'd like to see a statistical breakdown showing percentages of people dying from COVID in hospitals as opposed to at home.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## Authentic

> The people who believe the vaccine has a chip are the same ones that believe in alien abductions, aliens probing their anus,  and wear tin foil hats…..I kid ye not.


I forgot to make a tin foil hat this week. Thanks for the reminder!

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021)

----------


## Captain Kirk!

> Have you actually looked up how few vaccinated people have died of COVID?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> About 99.999% of fully vaccinated Americans have not had a deadly Covid-19 breakthrough case


Why on Earth do you believe anything they say? All they do is lie.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021)

----------


## Brat

This thread belongs in the conspiracy theory forum.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> Well theres a complicating factor-  Herd Immunity. If thers enough non immune, then Herd Immunuty fails and everyone ius in danger then.
> 
> 
> 
> If you were the only car on the road, its entirely up to you, then, whether you obey road signs.   However, when there are other road users, its a good plan to start observing road signs, in case you crash into someone else.
> 
> Antivaxxers take the position  "I know there are other road users, but  im still going to ignore roads signs, cos i dont believe anyone will ever crash into me".


Ridiculous analogy. Safe driving does not require an experimental injection that has proven to be dangerous and ineffective.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Brat (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> The chip thing is a quandry, My son works with someone who took an android phone and held it up to some vaccinated people and it found a signal that was trying to bluetooth connect to his android phone each person had a different number attached to the signal. There were others there who saw all of this. 
> They walked away from the group, no cell phone or watch or anything and he tried it on four or five and got a signal on every one. 
> I don't know the reason, but the ones he tried it with that were not vaxxed had nothing. 
> These people work with electronics and radio electronics all day every day sometimes twelve hours a day so they are not some group of know nothing dimshits.


The nanoparticles they use to encase the mRNA so they can survive and slip into any cell in the body have the ability to be electrically charged or triggered to emit and receive radio frequency. There are experiments being done to have injectable substances act like chips in the body. This is not science fiction. These are deep state / deep military projects. These mRNA vaccines are just the tip of the iceberg. There is a reason that the powers that be are so very adamant that EVERYONE get the injection.

*The Government Is Serious About Creating Mind-Controlled Weapons*

By Edd GentMay 23, 2019
DARPA, the Department of Defense's research arm, is paying scientists to invent ways to instantly read soldiers' minds using tools like genetic engineering of the human brain, nanotechnology and infrared beams. The end goal? Thought-controlled weapons, like swarms of drones that someone sends to the skies with a single thought or the ability to beam images from one brain to another.

This week, DARPA (Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency) announced that six teams will receive funding under the Next-Generation Nonsurgical Neurotechnology (N3) program. Participants are tasked with developing technology that will provide a two-way channel for rapid and seamless communication between the human brain and machines without requiring surgery.

https://www.livescience.com/65546-da...d-weapons.html

----------

Brat (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> This thread belongs in the conspiracy theory forum.


Today's conspiracy theories are tomorrow's truths.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Brat (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> Hmmpf.  Well, I had two doses of the Moderna vaccine, and so far, none of the three phones - two iPhones, one android - in my immediate vicinity have been able to pick up squat of a bluetooth signal coming from me.
> 
> *Maybe my chips just weren't activated properly?*


Don't feel rejected just because the government is not interested in you. Feel lucky.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-03-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

> The people who believe the vaccine has a chip are the same ones that believe in alien abductions, aliens probing their anus,  and wear tin foil hats..I kid ye not.


The people who believe that Jab is a vaccine...many of them are dead-dead-dead.

And people who believe the lying government...after all the lies they've been caught in...are fools.

Here's something to think about.

https://ncrenegade.com/pastor-speaks...inst-vaccines/

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Brat (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-03-2021),QuaseMarco (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> The people who believe that Jab is a vaccine...many of them are dead-dead-dead.
> 
> And people who believe the lying government...after all the lies they've been caught in...are fools.
> 
> Here's something to think about.
> 
> https://ncrenegade.com/pastor-speaks...inst-vaccines/



This Pastor is spot on! He's flat out telling his flock not to get the vaccine and backs it up with truth and common sense.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Brat (08-03-2021),JustPassinThru (08-03-2021),Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## FirstGenCanadian

@Quark, does any of this sound familiar?  Nanobots? Resistance is futile.

Nanites, require information to do what's required.  I have also heard (skuttlebutt) that iron is collecting at the injection site, where people can use a magnet to the skin at the injection site, and the magnet stays when placed on skin.

Since I have not tested any of this, I will remain skeptical.  

However, the reason I find it familiar, is the same thing happens during assimilation with Borg.  Granted, sci-fi.  But, in the show, it happens a lot faster.  What if this was the beginning of assimilation.  It would be plausible to control a world of 7.8 billion people, with a one world government.  Again, just something familiar.  This is not what I believe, or can prove, and therefore is conjecture, or conspiracy theory, if you will.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),Brat (08-03-2021),Quark (08-03-2021)

----------


## Conservative Libertarian

> I forgot to make a tin foil hat this week. Thanks for the reminder!


You can get one at this link.

Aluminum Foil Deflector Beanie

----------

12icer (08-03-2021),JMWinPR (08-03-2021)

----------


## Brat

> Today's conspiracy theories are tomorrow's truths.


Sorry, I should have said the TITLE of this thread belongs in the conspiracy theory forum.

----------

12icer (08-03-2021)

----------


## JMWinPR

> Have you actually looked up how few vaccinated people have died of COVID?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> About 99.999% of fully vaccinated Americans have not had a deadly Covid-19 breakthrough case


And those who did had under /over lying health issues.

----------

Rutabaga (08-03-2021)

----------


## Quark

> @Quark, does any of this sound familiar?  Nanobots? Resistance is futile.
> 
> Nanites, require information to do what's required.  I have also heard (skuttlebutt) that iron is collecting at the injection site, where people can use a magnet to the skin at the injection site, and the magnet stays when placed on skin.
> 
> Since I have not tested any of this, I will remain skeptical.  
> 
> However, the reason I find it familiar, is the same thing happens during assimilation with Borg.  Granted, sci-fi.  But, in the show, it happens a lot faster.  What if this was the beginning of assimilation.  It would be plausible to control a world of 7.8 billion people, with a one world government.  Again, just something familiar.  This is not what I believe, or can prove, and therefore is conjecture, or conspiracy theory, if you will.


I was just talking to a young lady this weekend who telling the same thing. She said that people had showed her that magnets were sticking to their injection site. Also putting a cell phone near the person injected and the cell phone did crazy things.

I've said right a long that something is very smelly with this vaccine craze and doing everything possible to get everybody vaccinated. Yup the Borg politburo wants everybody to be good and obedient drones.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (08-04-2021),FirstGenCanadian (08-04-2021),St James (08-04-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

i want to be part of the collective...i think i'll jab myself and lie about it to everybody...



[yea, like i wanna be a part of their collective]

 :Smiley ROFLMAO:

----------

Brat (08-04-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021),St James (08-04-2021)

----------


## 12icer

> And those who did had under /over lying health issues.


I know some who had no problems before the vaccine just as I had no problems BEFORE THE VACCINE. THEY ARE NOT TELLING ALL OF THE SIDE EFFECTS they are getting. 

As for the "SIGNAL" I have tried to bluetooth with a wireless receiver, I do not have an android phone, I have also tried with an I phone and have not yet picked up a signal to pair with. 
I have had some return of the injection site pain a couple of times and the arm muscle stiffness that was associated with it even a couple of weeks ago. and it has been about four months since the first shot.

----------

Brat (08-04-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-04-2021)

----------


## Wilson2

A guy at work got the vaccine.   Afterwards his arm would hurt when he was near a phone or computer that was using WiFi or Bluetooth.   His arm would also get hot when he was near a working microwave oven.  This weekend he went to the RC car track and his arm was jerking all over the place in response to the rc controllers so he had to leave.    After a lot of experimentation he found that wrapping his upper arm with 2 layers of aluminum foil with a layer of American cheese slices between the aluminum layers solved the problem.

----------

Oceander (08-04-2021),Rutabaga (08-04-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> Sorry, I should have said the TITLE of this thread belongs in the conspiracy theory forum.


Well it isnt, because its demonstrably true some people who refused the vaccine have died. Its only a conspiracy theory, while its unproven.  In this case is provably true.

----------


## UKSmartypants

> I was just talking to a young lady this weekend who telling the same thing. She said that people had showed her that magnets were sticking to their injection site. Also putting a cell phone near the person injected and the cell phone did crazy things.
> 
> I've said right a long that something is very smelly with this vaccine craze and doing everything possible to get everybody vaccinated. Yup the Borg politburo wants everybody to be good and obedient drones.



Well me and my wife are both fully vaxxed, we have no such magnetic predilection.  Neither do we notice any effect on any of the 4 mobile phones we own covering old 3G to new 4G smart  models.

You really are making this stuff up now.* I call BS on  your entire post*.  Its what known in conspiracy theory circles as a "FOAF" story - "friend of a friend" - "I have a friend , her friend says she was abducted by faries"

----------

Oceander (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> Ridiculous analogy. Safe driving does not require an experimental injection that has proven to be dangerous and ineffective.


Thus demonstrating you utterly failed to grasp the relevance and point of the analogy.

This really is like trying to teach nuclear physics to a donkey.

----------


## QuaseMarco

> Thus demonstrating you utterly failed to grasp the relevance and point of the analogy.
> 
> This really is like trying to teach nuclear physics to a donkey.


I disagreed with you so here come the insults.

----------

Brat (08-04-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021)

----------


## St James

> Well me and my wife are both fully vaxxed, we have no such magnetic predilection.  Neither do we notice any effect on any of the 4 mobile phones we own covering old 3G to new 4G smart  models.
> 
> You really are making this stuff up now.* I call BS on  your entire post*.  Its what known in conspiracy theory circles as a "FOAF" story - "friend of a friend" - "I have a friend , her friend says she was abducted by faries"


Do you absolutely know what's in the shot? 
You know what they tell you, but somehow I find it questionable when all vaccine producers have been granted a pass for any legal actions?
Why would they have been given government protection from litigation, fines, and possible jail time?
Do you buy a new car, sight unseen, with no investigation from reviews? Or do you buy a car because your neighbor bought one......

----------

12icer (08-04-2021),Brat (08-04-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021),QuaseMarco (08-04-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> Do you absolutely know what's in the shot? 
> You know what they tell you, but somehow I find it questionable when all vaccine producers have been granted a pass for any legal actions?
> Why would they have been given government protection from litigation, fines, and possible jail time?
> Do you buy a new car, sight unseen, with no investigation from reviews? Or do you buy a car because your neighbor bought one......


No i  check it out, using reliable  sources, not some friend of a bloke down the road's  daughters' boyfriend who claims those cars arent safe cos he heard someone crashed in one, which is your approach to covid.



and im confident I know whats in the jab, because after 65 years of asking 'why' i have a supreme ability to get to the truth of a subject, because Ive checked the provenance, the patents and the scientific papers on it to my satisfaction, and the reason i use the name UKsmartyPants, is cos Im never usually wrong when it comes to science, ask @nonsqtr, whose's by far smarter than me, and whos only ever caught me out once....

----------


## UKSmartypants

And it turns out the subject of the thread wasnt an urban myth after all


UK Home | Daily Mail Online

----------


## St James

> No i  check it out, using reliable  sources, not some friend of a bloke down the road's  daughters' boyfriend who claims those cars arent safe cos he heard someone crashed in one, which is your approach to covid.
> 
> 
> 
> and im confident I know whats in the jab, because after 65 years of asking 'why' i have a supreme ability to get to the truth of a subject, because Ive checked the provenance, the patents and the scientific papers on it to my satisfaction, and the reason i use the name UKsmartyPants, is cos Im never usually wrong when it comes to science, ask @nonsqtr, whose's by far smarter than me, and whos only ever caught me out once....


Scientists have been predicting the end of all mankind since they were telling stories around fires. Remember. "scientists" used to think the world was flat, and the stars revolved around this ball of dirt.
Most "scientists" claimed man would never fly and chastised those who thought to the contrary.
These shots have been rushed through pending review by the government. It takes years of testing under other circumstances to get FDA approval. They fast tracked it through the FDA as a preliminary "treatment. "It took 5 years to get a cure for polio. Notice "cure" and "treatment."
Some scientists are calling for bi-annual shot, some are calling for weekly injections in some cases. 
You don't make money on a cure.............
Think of where the money ends up, while you're at it

----------

12icer (08-04-2021),Brat (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021),QuaseMarco (08-04-2021),Rutabaga (08-04-2021)

----------


## patrickt

> And it turns out the subject of the thread wasnt an urban myth after all
> 
> 
> UK Home | Daily Mail Online


I never thought it was an urban myth but if it was reported by CNN the chances that it's fraudulent in it's details is almost absolute.

Recently, I got a text message from a friend. When I responded I got another text that said, "Oh, I'm not Lupita. I'm Maria. Lupita loaned me her phone." Would CNN check a source, even a real one, for veracity? Not a chance if the story followed the party line. Would CNN make a story up from whole cloth? They have, often.

So, if you want to get vaccinated, please do. However it comes out it's your choice. And watch the leftists as they now try to force everyone to get their vaccine, and the booster shots every six months, and the happy little blue pill that makes you enjoy tryanny.


Only a fool thinks the government cares.

----------

12icer (08-04-2021),Brat (08-04-2021),Oceander (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021),Rutabaga (08-04-2021),St James (08-04-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

> A guy at work got the vaccine.   Afterwards his arm would hurt when he was near a phone or computer that was using WiFi or Bluetooth.   His arm would also get hot when he was near a working microwave oven.  This weekend he went to the RC car track and his arm was jerking all over the place in response to the rc controllers so he had to leave.    After a lot of experimentation he found that *wrapping his upper arm with 2 layers of aluminum foil with a layer of American cheese slices between the aluminum layers solved the problem.*




common knowledge...[craft cheese, not that cheap gubment cheese]

----------

12icer (08-04-2021),Wilson2 (08-04-2021)

----------


## Neo

> Neo, Neo, Neo.............. This is the same anecdotal story that has been burning its way across the internet. There is some doubt about the veracity of this story. I tried to do some backstory research, and their names don't even appear in my People Search.
> Take the shot. Wear your mask, because it is the people who have gotten the jab are the ones creating the problems.
> Be a lab rat without complaint. It wouldn't do you any good because if you perished from COVID after getting the jab, you have zero legal recourse. Biden has granted the vaccine producers total exemption from legal actions.
> And, you have no Right to demand anything of your neighbors.


Actually I just checked how many deaths from Covid19
in America.latest figures.
619,000  Covid19 attributed deaths.  Thats a hell of a lot people, and do you know what, only half of America is vaccinated, it will probably go way past a million.

----------


## Canadianeye

Fact check: Medicare pays hospitals more money for COVID-19 patients

_Our ruling: True

We rate the claim that hospitals get paid more if patients are listed as COVID-19 and on ventilators as TRUE.

Hospitals and doctors do get paid more for Medicare patients diagnosed with COVID-19 or if it's considered presumed they have COVID-19 absent a laboratory-confirmed test, and three times more if the patients are placed on a ventilator to cover the cost of care and loss of business resulting from a shift in focus to treat COVID-19 cases.
_
I'm astonished that someone in this political and economic climate of fraud, corruption and collusion - with a healthy dose of pure greed...would believe the 619,000 number.

----------

12icer (08-04-2021),Brat (08-04-2021),patrickt (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021),Rutabaga (08-04-2021),St James (08-06-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

covid=$ to some.

----------

12icer (08-04-2021),Brat (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021),St James (08-06-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> Actually I just checked how many deaths from Covid19
> in America….latest figures.
> 619,000  Covid19 attributed deaths.  That’s a hell of a lot people, and do you know what, only half of America is vaccinated, it will probably go way past a million.


And that number is almost certainly inflated, given that (a) the CDC has stated that COVID-19 can be assigned as the cause of death if the examining Dr. just "thinks" it was probably the cause, without the need for a test to confirm or refute, and (b) hospitals get a hell of a lot more money if the patient is a COVID-19 patient, rather than just some poor schmuck with a bad case of the flu.

----------

Brat (08-04-2021),patrickt (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021),St James (08-06-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> covid=$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ to some.


Sorry @Rutabaga, had to fix that typo for ya!

----------

12icer (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021),Rutabaga (08-04-2021)

----------


## Quark

> Well me and my wife are both fully vaxxed, we have no such magnetic predilection.  Neither do we notice any effect on any of the 4 mobile phones we own covering old 3G to new 4G smart  models.
> 
> You really are making this stuff up now.* I call BS on  your entire post*.  Its what known in conspiracy theory circles as a "FOAF" story - "friend of a friend" - "I have a friend , her friend says she was abducted by faries"


The information is certainly anecdotal but any time the government pushes this hard to get everyone vaccinated and the oligarch is the force behind the funding of a vaccine I smell something really really fishy. I have no faith in governments especially the national government nor their henchmen the oligarchs, plutocrats, and the technocrats.

----------

12icer (08-04-2021),St James (08-04-2021)

----------


## Quark

> No i  check it out, using reliable  sources, not some friend of a bloke down the road's  daughters' boyfriend who claims those cars arent safe cos he heard someone crashed in one, which is your approach to covid.
> 
> 
> 
> and im confident I know whats in the jab, because after 65 years of asking 'why' i have a supreme ability to get to the truth of a subject, because Ive checked the provenance, the patents and the scientific papers on it to my satisfaction, and the reason i use the name UKsmartyPants, is cos Im never usually wrong when it comes to science, ask @nonsqtr, whose's by far smarter than me, and whos only ever caught me out once....


Are you sure you can trust the information you are given? I certainly do not trust the national government, the oligarchs, the plutocrats, or the technocrats.

----------

12icer (08-04-2021),St James (08-04-2021)

----------


## Quark

> Actually I just checked how many deaths from Covid19
> in America.latest figures.
> 619,000  Covid19 attributed deaths.  Thats a hell of a lot people, and do you know what, only half of America is vaccinated, it will probably go way past a million.


With or without the Jab it could go pass a million. However, all is not what it seems. A good many of those 619,000 did not died of COVID related illness but died from other causes like auto accidents who just happened to have the virus in them. See under our socialized medicine right now if a hospital can show a death or illness is connected to COVID in any form or shape the hospital will get extra loot from Uncle Sugar also known as the national government.

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12icer (08-04-2021),St James (08-04-2021)

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## Quark

> Fact check: Medicare pays hospitals more money for COVID-19 patients
> 
> _Our ruling: True
> 
> We rate the claim that hospitals get paid more if patients are listed as COVID-19 and on ventilators as TRUE.
> 
> Hospitals and doctors do get paid more for Medicare patients diagnosed with COVID-19 or if it's considered presumed they have COVID-19 absent a laboratory-confirmed test, and three times more if the patients are placed on a ventilator to cover the cost of care and loss of business resulting from a shift in focus to treat COVID-19 cases.
> _
> I'm astonished that someone in this political and economic climate of fraud, corruption and collusion - with a healthy dose of pure greed...would believe the 619,000 number.


Yup that's what I just posted. I've gotten my facts directly from the horse mouth as it were. The hospital and doctors have said so. Tie the death or illness to COVID and the loot from Uncle Sugar flows right in.

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12icer (08-04-2021),St James (08-04-2021)

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## St James

> Actually I just checked how many deaths from Covid19
> in America.latest figures.
> 619,000  Covid19 attributed deaths.  Thats a hell of a lot people, and do you know what, only half of America is vaccinated, it will probably go way past a million.


You give zero attributes to the human condition. 40-60% of all of the population is immune to this.
What you are not saying is that over 300,000,000 are surviving without government intrusion.
This is not an ELE event...............

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12icer (08-04-2021),Brat (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021)

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## UKSmartypants

> Are you sure you can trust the information you are given? I certainly do not trust the national government, the oligarchs, the plutocrats, or the technocrats.


Absolutely.  I go back to the original peer reviewed scientific papers, and articles  in publications like Nature, Scientific American and papers in depositories like https://arxiv.org/  . You can check the patents too they cant lie , and the orginal clinical trials.

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## Call_me_Ishmael

> I was just talking to a young lady this weekend who telling the same thing. She said that people had showed her that magnets were sticking to their injection site. Also putting a cell phone near the person injected and the cell phone did crazy things.
> 
> I've said right a long that something is very smelly with this vaccine craze and doing everything possible to get everybody vaccinated. Yup the Borg politburo wants everybody to be good and obedient drones.


When I got the first phizer, I was looking at my cell phone to distract from the painful shot.  As soon as the fluid went into my arm, and for about 2 seconds after that, my cell phone displayed a few pages of hexadecimal data, filling the screen and then my own picture appeared with some other symbols. 
I went home and connected a UHF spectrum analyzer ( with scattering matrix calculations) to see if I could detect any unusual impedance (passive or active)  of my body at any band. To my amazement, the s11 parameter indicated a low impedance resonance at several discrete frequencies in the bands that are being used for 5G. And although lasting for just a fraction of a second, those same fields of hexadecimal characters and my picture appears. I went.."uh oh".

I have a Faraday shielded room at home because of my previous research into CDMA spread spectrum modifications to standard CB radio.  ( yes it was expensive but a previous customer paid for it and then declared it to be expendable after my contract with them ended.) So I went into the room, pulled the shielded door closed and repeated the measurement.  Yep..... it was the same.... proving it was not some external interference that I was measuring. I am not radiating actively but when probed with the 5G frequencies, my body now has a series of resonances that would show up as a coded reflection on any sensitive receiver... similar to what an RFI device would do. 

I was planning on writing this up and sending to the IEEE but I have a friend who is an IEEE fellow, who advised me just to say nothing because the last person who told him of a similar experience, was killed "in a a car accident" shortly after he submitted the paper in May of this year.

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12icer (08-04-2021),Brat (08-04-2021)

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## patrickt

> Actually I just checked how many deaths from Covid19
> in America….latest figures.
> 619,000  Covid19 attributed deaths.  That’s a hell of a lot people, and do you know what, only half of America is vaccinated, it will probably go way past a million.


And we know, for a fact, the number of deaths attributed is bogus or you're lying. The numbers will be going up because people who had relatives die from something else go have a doctor "amend" the death certificate to show COVID and they can collect up to $5,000. We've also read that COVID deaths average over two "co-morbidities".  That's like the Colorado case in Grand County. These two people tested positive for COVID, had bullets to their heads, and were listed as COVID deaths.

Get the vaccine or don't, Neo, but carrying water for the fraudsters is futile. Since millions recognize the lying you'll play hell keep the hysteria going no matter how hard you try and how much the "authorities" lie.

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12icer (08-04-2021),Brat (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021)

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## Canadianeye

> Yup that's what I just posted. I've gotten my facts directly from the horse mouth as it were. The hospital and doctors have said so. Tie the death or illness to COVID and the loot from Uncle Sugar flows right in.


People are willfully blind, and occasionally just dumb and lazy. I'll give an example, not too far off of the OP...just a bit of thread drift.

This what they call the Sunshine List in Ontario Canada. Public Sector employees making $100,000+ a year. (not including premium all inclusive benefit package). Averaging out those on the list to $130,000 because some are higher than that, and some are flat $100,000.

So, if you look at the amount of the Sunshine List, you will see the number is 205,660 employees, which totals out to roughly $27,000,000,000 billion. Pretty good for mostly teachers.

However, there are other lists which are not shown. Surely there is $99,000 to $70,000 list somewhere. Full benefits as well not included in that, and a $70,000 to $50,000 list of course, again, full benefits.

Now, factoring in that every year (for decades upon decades) are people retiring with extremely generous pensions. I'd guess about $3,500 a month (I know a Ford retiree and he gets about $4,000 a month). Okay, so $3,500 x 12 is $42,000 a year, with full premium benefits as well, until they die - and then the surviving spouse gets (both pension and benefits) until they drop dead.

Obviously they do not short themselves on employees upon retirement, so a new employee enters at a lower pay scale, while of course others move up to the Sunshine List.

Following me my friend? On to the next part.

These people vote for the gravy train, along with other "pretend and hidden" public sector employees, like the Posties. As well, the household will vote on the straight gravy train ticket as well. If this guys wife is a teacher, with high salary, premium pension enroute and exemplary benefits - then he is voting her way, and, so will their kids if they have any.

These people will do or say or conflate anything they are told to conflate in the public sector universal health system - by their employers, who feed them the gravy train and comically portray them on the government propaganda airwaves as some sort of heroes.

They aren't heroes. They are full of shit. Unionized shit...and they will fudge or work or alter any bloody numbers they want, that they can get away with.

https://www.ontario.ca/page/public-s...ary-disclosure

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12icer (08-04-2021),Brat (08-04-2021),FirstGenCanadian (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021),St James (08-06-2021)

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## Quark

> Absolutely.  I go back to the original peer reviewed scientific papers, and articles  in publications like Nature, Scientific American and papers in depositories like https://arxiv.org/  . You can check the patents too they cant lie , and the orginal clinical trials.


So you go back to the new saying, "All degrees, no knowledge." I don't trust or have confidence in the national government, the oligarchs, the plutocrats, nor the technocrats. All peer review means to me is the pollicization of science to serve the ends of the national government, the oligarchs, the plutocrats, and the technocrats.

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12icer (08-04-2021),Authentic (08-04-2021),QuaseMarco (08-04-2021)

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## UKSmartypants

> So you go back to the new saying, "All degrees, no knowledge." I don't trust or have confidence in the national government, the oligarchs, the plutocrats, nor the technocrats. All peer review means to me is the pollicization of science to serve the ends of the national government, the oligarchs, the plutocrats, and the technocrats.



Neither do I, until ive checked. But I have consummate confidence in my own ability to find the approximate truth as near as you can get to my own satisfaction.

The process of Peer Review mean before you discovery or work is published its passed round lots of other random scientists , none of whom  have a vested interest in anything other than finding out if your work is correct or a pile of doggy do. And every scientist has plenty of rivals willing to pick holes in their work.

When Andrew Wiles, a British mathematician, circulated a solution to a 274-year-old problem known as Fermats Last Theorem, it was peer reviewed  for 7 years and corrected twice before it was officially published. Thats how peer review science works. its nothing to do with politicians.

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Oceander (08-04-2021),Quark (08-04-2021)

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## 12icer

Well I say "YOU ARE WRONG ABOUT THE SHOT AND DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT!!!" if you are saying that a person that died of covid would not have died if they had the shot, There is absolutely NO way to prove that statement. Just as there is no way to prove a person with a gunshot wound to the head who just happened to have covid would NOT have died if he did not have covid.

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Quark (08-04-2021)

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## donttread

> Neither do I, until ive checked. But I have consummate confidence in my own ability to find the approximate truth as near as you can get to my own satisfaction.
> 
> The process of Peer Review mean before you discovery or work is published its passed round lots of other random scientists , none of whom  have a vested interest in anything other than finding out if your work is correct or a pile of doggy do. And every scientist has plenty of rivals willing to pick holes in their work.
> 
> When Andrew Wiles, a British mathematician, circulated a solution to a 274-year-old problem known as Fermats Last Theorem, it was peer reviewed  for 7 years and corrected twice before it was officially published. Thats how peer review science works. its nothing to do with politicians.



Peer review no longer works well in social science, hopefully concerning COVID independent review of data was the norm. As for me I've seen enough to form the opinio that:
The vaccine is the best choice for most but it's still their choice and I do not believe pressure should be applied as the vaccine is quite effective and the COVID death rate is under what .5 % to begin with? If you add an effective vaccine to that the death rate for vaccinated people is close to statstically meaningless.As I said before live and let live.

As for social science it is so loose and trendy that two guys created papers based upon fairy bullshit and buzz phrases like social justice, systemic racism , diversity or others and not only were a lot of the papers well received but some were published despite being full of vettable bullshit.
See below similar stuff including a paper that claimed men should be trained like dogs to prevent rape. LOL Apparently it has in the past even worked in Physics somehow. Or more accurately a physicist writing a cultural article


https://phys.org/news/2018-10-real-f...-journals.html

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Quark (08-04-2021)

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## 12icer

What is this about the cdc saying the vaccine wont prevent you from getting covid and 346 of 469 being fully vaccinated 274 were symptomatic when they tested.? What is that UHHUHHHUHH 73% of them fully vaccinated? AND the vaccine is supposed to trigger for a basic marker in all covid viruses WE WERE TOLD! Yeah sol joe I believe you wouldn't lie to us and I believe you are as bad as Joe Warren too HEHEHEHEHEH.

CDC Delta variant report (fox8.com)

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## Quark

> Neither do I, until ive checked. But I have consummate confidence in my own ability to find the approximate truth as near as you can get to my own satisfaction.
> 
> The process of Peer Review mean before you discovery or work is published its passed round lots of other random scientists , none of whom  have a vested interest in anything other than finding out if your work is correct or a pile of doggy do. And every scientist has plenty of rivals willing to pick holes in their work.
> 
> When Andrew Wiles, a British mathematician, circulated a solution to a 274-year-old problem known as Fermats Last Theorem, it was peer reviewed  for 7 years and corrected twice before it was officially published. Thats how peer review science works. its nothing to do with politicians.


I can't say about Great Britain but in the USA ALL science now has been pollicization. Any contrarian views are censored and ridiculed for misinformation or disinformation and the contrarian scientists are dismissed from their position or censored.

So all I have is the politically correct and sanitized orthodox opinion of the national government, oligarchs, plutocrats, and technocrats.

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12icer (08-04-2021),Authentic (08-04-2021),FirstGenCanadian (08-04-2021),phoenyx (08-04-2021)

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## UKSmartypants

> Well I say "YOU ARE WRONG ABOUT THE SHOT AND DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT!!!" if you are saying that a person that died of covid would not have died if they had the shot, There is absolutely NO way to prove that statement. Just as there is no way to prove a person with a gunshot wound to the head who just happened to have covid would NOT have died if he did not have covid.


well based on the recent figures regarding infections and deaths, on the balance of probabilities I judge its likely he would have survived, since the death rate amongst vaccinated persons who catch covid  has dropped to virtually nothing. Covid only kills the  non-immune

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## 12icer

Well Lets see the virus apparently does not survive as well in warmer climates, And it is apparently also unprovable that it is not as deadly to those who have the protections of YOUTH. Same also are the idea it's not as deadly to those who use the TRUMP formula of prevention. That all means absolutely NOTHING unless you can prove the person would have died without the vaccine and it is a generalized assumption that leads to NON FACTS. 

To believe all of the things you hear, you must believe the people who have been responsible for hiding the FACT that the US taxpayers at the request of biden, fauci, obama, and other parties too numerous to list MOST LIKELY PAID for part of the process that led to the manufacture of this virus that has killed mostly exactly who they want dead, the largest group of opponents and financial burden to their NWO society.

I am no conspiracy nut, but when there is as much evidence as there is of election fraud, and planned worldwide population control, fake climate theology, and division of the world populace into small easily manipulated sects, what is a conspiracy and what does it take?


As a PS If they want everyone to take the vaccine then lets see obama, pelosi, biden, harris, and the majority of dimshits take a shot that is brought to Wal-Mart and is watched from the time it leaves the drug company, then switched at the last minute to a lot set aside for customers of the day.
If they are so sure of the vaccine then let them grant a million dollars to anyone not protected by it, five million to anyone it harms or their family if they die using the same burden of proof they use of the deaths being from covid to get their money. Easy fix.

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Brat (08-05-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-05-2021)

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## UKSmartypants

See its becomign clear a nasty culture war is brewing, a modern twist on the old feud between positive and negative liberty. In one camp are the freedom lovers who hope that we can “learn to live with the virus” and roll back the Covid state. In the other camp are those who believe that the Prime Minister’s new emphasis on the individual is dangerous; that he should be seeking to “liberate” society from risk and provide the ultimate “freedom” of living without the coronavirus by aiming for a Zero Covid utopia instead. 

The philosopher Isaiah Berlin gave a groundbreaking lecture at Oxford University on the subject of liberty. There were two kinds, he said. “Positive” liberty – in which freedom is usually only achieved through a collective, utopian quest – would always lead to tyranny, as epitomised by communism. The antidote, he contended, was for the West to champion “negative” liberty instead – the individual’s freedom to do what they want without interference.

Some years later, however, Berlin wavered. By defining “negative” liberty as a person’s ability to do what they want (rather than what other people deemed by they ought to want) the scholar could not get around the paradox that, in certain circumstances, people may genuinely not wish to be free at all. They might adapt to unfree situations by no longer desiring their own autonomy. A society might even “liberate” itself from the terrors of freedom, with its daunting emphasis on personal responsibility.

Face masks look set to become the symbolic focal point for this ideological battle, as they become optional. What should have been a matter for personal choice, based on mutual respect, is gearing up to become a sort of tribal signal.With many scientists and commentators proclaiming that they will continue to wear one for the greater good, the dividing lines are clear: sceptic vs non-sceptic; rugged individualist vs cuddly communitarian; selfish vs caring. Individual liberty threatens to become fetishised as a daring danger to society – a selfish value in competition with health.   Cultural Marxism triumphs again.

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## 12icer

There is NO ABSOLUTE FREEDOM, even a dictatorial monarch or party of criminals do not have absolute freedom there is only personal freedom with the associated responsibility it requires. 
FREEDOM IS CHOICE. 
Personal freedom is limited to the area that ends where another persons personal freedom begins and their choices are in effect. Therefore you may choose to enter a store with unmasked people OR you may stay out of the store. 
You may take a vaccine or you may NOT. 
Those are personal choices.

The US Constitution starts with a preamble long picked apart by the ruling class politicos of the country. 
It begins "WE THE PEOPLE" and that is has been redefined as anyone or thing the ruling class needs it to mean a dozen times.
When penned it meant "WE THE CITIZENS OF THIS COUNTRY". 
As of now it means something different daily to cover those the ruling dictators want. 
Apparently for the time being it means "we the dimshit criminals and those we want to help us turn this into a dimshit dictatorial state". 

Now with a government that has remade itself into a political party's empire, it will be hard to even attain even the most meager personal freedoms. 
For example the freedom of a young girl to enter a publicly provided bathroom to do a personal task without being afraid of some predator.

As the vaccine fight continues, it comes down to personal vs collective. 
There ARE either PERSONAL RIGHTS or there ARE NOT PERSONAL rights.

THE BREAKING POINT IS WHERE THE RIGHTS COME FROM, THE CURRENT GROUP OF CRIMINALS SAY THEY CONTROL ALL RIGHTS.
THE CONSTITUTION SAYS THEY ARE GIVEN BY GOD AND THE GOVERNMENT DOES NOT CONTROL THEM.

The preamble defines the tasks of the government AS>> To "establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to US and OUR POSTERITY". 
The current politicos who are holding positions from janitor to president are doing none of these tasks and have actively done the exact opposite.

Tell me again why we should do anything they want!!!!

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Brat (08-05-2021)

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## UKSmartypants

sellby.jpg

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## valley ranch

That's interesting ~ there's a split on having the juice shot into you arm is a good idea or not, I haven't gotten it, I have been  visiting family ~ they hear only the mass media side of the story, 

Looks like they're going to keep this virus, new virus, another virus, changed virus thing going right into the next election ~ are those that think: Yes get the shot new members or are some of the long time members into the taking the shot ~ I'll go have a better look ```

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Quark (08-05-2021)

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## squidward

> Well theres a complicating factor-  Herd Immunity. If thers enough non immune, then Herd Immunuty fails and everyone ius in danger then.


uh, ....In case  you haven't been keeping up, the vaccinated are not "immune", and are spreading it. 
Convalesced patients however have durable immunity, even to variants. So much for your fourth grade argument.

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JustPassinThru (08-06-2021)

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## patrickt

The tragedy of COVID hysterics looking to the government for salvation.

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