# Stuff and Things > Guns and Self Defense >  Quartzite AZ..............WTF?

## St James

Quartzite AZ..............WTF?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=1zHOlbYWHdo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=8C6uQ1O6dTk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=xRpLQtzKbdQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=WJ2bviOgjv8

The Chief of Police has deposed the Mayor with a little help from his friends..... Folks, there is so much going  on that it takes all day to watch and collect information aout this................

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## Trinnity

Watching the first viddy now....

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## St James

> Watching the first viddy now....


 @Trinnity..........there's about 30 vids about this. I posted these to pique the curiousity level

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## Trinnity

Well, I'm about to listen to the second viddy and I can tell you I'm very interested in this. People are pissed at the govt and rightly so. The majority should have demanded more limited and accountable govt long before now and that's why people are on a short fuse. This is what happens when govt gets abusive and stays that way AND the people do not seek or percieve they have no redress. It's dangerous  to us all. 

I don't blame people for being angry. I am too. But I'm not a violent person. I still hope we can rein govt in without a civil war or revolution. But time is running out, what with the economy being so bad and people are lacking jobs. There WILL be an accounting for the abuses taking place in Washington DC and I'm afraid it's more than likely going to be deadly and traumatic. It could have been avoided if we all had worked harder to keep THEM in line. The greed, power lust, power misplaced within regulatory agencies,and complacency with business-as-usual in Washington has led to this and it's BAD.

It's not just Obama either. Pelosi and Reid are evil and belong in prison. The Rs are accountable too for their parts in all of this but I maintain the progressive/liberal left and it's greed/authoritarian core is what led us here.
Roosevelt (both), Wilson (gave us the federal reserve, bill introduced by Carter Glass D-VA), LBJ, Obama, Nixon (took us off the gold standard),  - all these men are hugely responsible, imo.

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## St James

almost everyone of today's politico are corrupt. If not, it doesn't take time to get them in line with threats and coercion from other forces. Rand Paul is seeing the beginnings of such a movement to either chastise him, or find fault with everything he does. I sure hope he can weather out the storm better than we are going to.
Thanks Trin, for taking the time to look at these.

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## Canadianeye

Watched all 4. The Sheriff is under investigation by the AZ Attorney General. 10 officers have come forward and cited various forms of corruption by the sheriff during his pursuits to take over the town. Part of the problem is that the council (except for Mayor) seems to be falling in lockstep or cahoots with the sheriff.

As disturbing as their actions are...it is just the tip of the iceberg. These shitstains don't care about We the People, the constitution, law...or anything else beyond their "ends justify the means" mentality for what "they" decree upon "their" subjects.

As an edit: Alex Jones was correct. Why not just put a crown on their heads and be done with it.

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St James (03-15-2013)

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## St James

another Quartzite "piss you off" video




Jones gets arrested for exposing the "Martial Law" order

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## St James

*Published on Aug 31, 2012*Former appointed Police Chief Gilbert is on administrative leave. He was being served legal process at home. Gun drawn on process server. Gilbert had just pulled into his driveway. He accused server of trespassing. Server remained well off the property.  August 31 2012, 7:16 pm. Full Blue Moon tonight.

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## Fearandloathing

All this is pretty old.

The town meetings were three years ago.

I've been surfing but can't seem to come up with anything in the last year...sure as shit SOMEBODY had to go to jail....

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## Canadianeye

> All this is pretty old.
> 
> The town meetings were three years ago.
> 
> I've been surfing but can't seem to come up with anything in the last year...sure as shit SOMEBODY had to go to jail....


Just listening to Rodriguez (the muscle for the sheriff) being questioned by internals probably. Old....meh. I find it interesting.

Power tripping scab of a police chief and those that allow it...is amazing.

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St James (03-15-2013)

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## St James

> All this is pretty old.
> 
> The town meetings were three years ago.
> 
> I've been surfing but can't seem to come up with anything in the last year...sure as shit SOMEBODY had to go to jail....


http://www.quartzsitenews.tv/

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## St James

one last thought to offer before this takes a backseat...............I'm gonna register my guns with someone like this???????????  :Hello:  :Middle Finger: 
can ya hear me now?

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Fearandloathing (03-17-2013)

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## garyo

Quite the fascist little city, is goose stepping part of the school football half time show?

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## St James

.......hahahahaha prolly with an "armed" escort....................

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## Irascible Crusader

> *Published on Aug 31, 2012*Former appointed Police Chief Gilbert is on administrative leave. He was being served legal process at home. Gun drawn on process server. Gilbert had just pulled into his driveway. He accused server of trespassing. Server remained well off the property.  August 31 2012, 7:16 pm. Full Blue Moon tonight.


Setting aside that he's a former police chief, I don't know that using a gun to keep somebody off your property is inappropriate.

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## Irascible Crusader

> another Quartzite "piss you off" video
> 
>  Jones gets arrested for exposing the "Martial Law" order


Yeah, it didn't get past me that the police chief said they have to talk to him if he's investigating a crime.  I would note the following:
1. Police more and more are called to be baby sitters.  They shouldn't have to come out because one neighbor doesn't like another neighbor yelling at them, but they're thinking that they better intervene before words turn into actions.  Police largely have become what society has made them become, caretakers of people who act like children and can't resolve issues themselves without calling the cops on each other.
2. The cops are human too. I think you're all giving them way too much grief. They get angry and frustrated when people can't behave themselves and get into petty squabbles.  In a semi-heated exchange, they're going to say some things that can be seized upon as legally inaccurate and adverse to the Bill of Rights.
3.  Police officers are peace officers. They don't dispense perfect justice, and it's often all they can do just to keep the peace.  More importantly, they are just as human as the people they're dealing with. They aren't heartless oppressors and they care about the community they served and the people in it and try day to day to do the right thing.  They have a conscience and a sense of moral rectitude not unlike anyone else, and most have a deep respect for the Constitution, civil liberties, and the preservation of our liberal republic.  Put more shortly, give them a friggin' break!

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## St James

It is a LEO thing, Mike. A peace officer doesn't go around threatening people, arresting them for being on a sidewalk or filming him in action. A peace officer doesn't go around threatening political candidates. A peace officer doesn't arrest someone for exposing behind the door meetings establsihing martial law in an attempt to cover up proof of his tyranny. Seriously, a journalist doing their job? 
It's about corruption, Mike, corruption and this bastard is as corrupt as it gets. 
I take it from your tone that it is ok for a LEO to suspend your personal liberties just because he can? These fucks, the chief, a few of his minions, the town council (except for the mayor) can levy all kinds of taxes just to line their own pockets, deny due process, and threaten people just in a weak assed attempt to hide their own misdeeds? A jury will put this fuck behind bars, and maybe a few of the town council as well. They don't deserve your accolades or applause.But then again, you might be ok with tyranny and martial law under color of law.
I don't care what state you are in, it is illegal to shoot an unarmed court-appointed process server, regardless. That is an act of murder! Or is that good with you as well?

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## St James

> Yeah, it didn't get past me that the police chief said they have to talk to him if he's investigating a crime.  I would note the following:
> 1. Police more and more are called to be baby sitters.  They shouldn't have to come out because one neighbor doesn't like another neighbor yelling at them, but they're thinking that they better intervene before words turn into actions.  Police largely have become what society has made them become, caretakers of people who act like children and can't resolve issues themselves without calling the cops on each other.
> 2. The cops are human too. I think you're all giving them way too much grief. They get angry and frustrated when people can't behave themselves and get into petty squabbles.  In a semi-heated exchange, they're going to say some things that can be seized upon as legally inaccurate and adverse to the Bill of Rights.
> 3.  Police officers are peace officers. They don't dispense perfect justice, and it's often all they can do just to keep the peace.  More importantly, they are just as human as the people they're dealing with. They aren't heartless oppressors and they care about the community they served and the people in it and try day to day to do the right thing.  They have a conscience and a sense of moral rectitude not unlike anyone else, and most have a deep respect for the Constitution, civil liberties, and the preservation of our liberal republic.  Put more shortly, give them a friggin' break!






*Published on Apr 29, 2012*Quartzsite Notary Keith Douglas affirms that the truck illegally "appropriated" by Dennis Hegeman at the behest of Quartzsite Police officers Fabiola Garcia and Rick Patterson was legally transferred to Dana Stadler.

so, it's ok for cops to act like criminals, Mike? I think you're backing the wrong horse here


don't believe this go here and watch them all:
youtube Quartzsite corrupt police chief   in your tool bar.

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## Irascible Crusader

> It is a LEO thing, Mike. A peace officer doesn't go around threatening people, arresting them for being on a sidewalk or filming him in action. A peace officer doesn't go around threatening political candidates. A peace officer doesn't arrest someone for exposing behind the door meetings establsihing martial law in an attempt to cover up proof of his tyranny. Seriously, a journalist doing their job?


  I was commenting on the video I quoted.



> It's about corruption, Mike, corruption and this bastard is as corrupt as it gets.


  There are some people (some right here in this forum) who see all enforcement of the law as corrupt or at least suspect.



> I take it from your tone that it is ok for a LEO to suspend your personal liberties just because he can?


  Nope. You misread that entirely.




> These fucks, the chief, a few of his minions, the town council (except for the mayor) can levy all kinds of taxes just to line their own pockets, deny due process, and threaten people just in a weak assed attempt to hide their own misdeeds? A jury will put this fuck behind bars, and maybe a few of the town council as well. They don't deserve your accolades or applause.But then again, you might be ok with tyranny and martial law under color of law.


  Nope. You're reading things that I didn't say.  You should get some help for that.




> I don't care what state you are in, it is illegal to shoot an unarmed court-appointed process server, regardless. That is an act of murder! Or is that good with you as well?


You can't seem to get past the fact that this guy is an off duty police officer. If he were just Joe Citizen, you would gladly defend his right to protect his property.  People have been pointing guns at trespassers to get them off of their property in this country for well over 2 centuries.  Is this new to you?  I think your cop-hate is queering your assessment of this situation.

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## Fearandloathing

> one last thought to offer before this takes a backseat...............I'm gonna register my guns with someone like this??????????? 
> can ya hear me now?


I have to admit that it is alarming and rather strange.


And you do make a point.

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## Fearandloathing

> Yeah, it didn't get past me that the police chief said they have to talk to him if he's investigating a crime.  I would note the following:
> 1. Police more and more are called to be baby sitters.  They shouldn't have to come out because one neighbor doesn't like another neighbor yelling at them, but they're thinking that they better intervene before words turn into actions.  Police largely have become what society has made them become, caretakers of people who act like children and can't resolve issues themselves without calling the cops on each other.
> 2. The cops are human too. I think you're all giving them way too much grief. They get angry and frustrated when people can't behave themselves and get into petty squabbles.  In a semi-heated exchange, they're going to say some things that can be seized upon as legally inaccurate and adverse to the Bill of Rights.
> 3.  Police officers are peace officers. They don't dispense perfect justice, and it's often all they can do just to keep the peace.  More importantly, they are just as human as the people they're dealing with. They aren't heartless oppressors and they care about the community they served and the people in it and try day to day to do the right thing.  They have a conscience and a sense of moral rectitude not unlike anyone else, and most have a deep respect for the Constitution, civil liberties, and the preservation of our liberal republic.  Put more shortly, give them a friggin' break!




Well, now, there's several cans been opened there.  The subject of righteous policing is near and dear to my heart; I administrated and moderated a forum on policing in Canada during the outfall from this little bit of business:




Pick it up at the 4:50 mark and you get to witness an assassination by taser; from arrival to death in 24 seconds.

Needless to say, in Canada where we're still not comfortable with police having guns at all yet, you could say this touched off some controversy.  Shit storm would be a more apt description.  The prime minister had passed a special commission to allow the province of British Columbia to call a public hearing [with binding recommendations] into the actions of federal police, the alleged boys who "always get their man", the Royal Canadian Mounted Police.

Disregarding what it was like moderating such a forum with cops logging on and threatening mods with "i know where you live" [that gets exciting], know that a lot of what you say I have heard before, 'police are people too' etc.

Yes they are.  They are people who also have been given a tremendous amount of power and influence.  They have also received, at taxpayers expense, a lot of training in order to ensure that their actions do not create more harm, that their powers are not abused, and that their actions are as fair and balanced as possible.

To excuse the actions of the four mounties in the video with anything near that reason would be like saying doctors are human too, to the surgeon who forgot to sew up the patient.

I don't know about Texas, but if ANY cop pulled a gun in those circumstances anywhere in Canada, he would cease being a cop about three hours later...and I like it like that.

Having said that, I will close by saying the Police in the city of Vancouver are the best I have seen in any of my travels, they are professional, friendly and so polite they will say "sorry" as you are wondering how you ended up face down, in the middle of the street after not doing what a 105 lb female officer of perhaps Asian or Indian descent, had just instructed you to do.

Cops are like every profession.  There will always be a percentage that are bad eggs, but sometimes the problem is systemic, like the RCMP, where they are now facing a couple of dozen law suits over sexual harassment and, next summer, a God-knows-how long Royal Commission of Inquiry.

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St James (03-17-2013)

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## St James

> I was commenting on the video I quoted.
>   There are some people (some right here in this forum) who see all enforcement of the law as corrupt or at least suspect.
>   Nope. You misread that entirely.
> 
>   Nope. You're reading things that I didn't say.  You should get some help for that.
> 
> 
> You can't seem to get past the fact that this guy is an off duty police officer. If he were just Joe Citizen, you would gladly defend his right to protect his property.  People have been pointing guns at trespassers to get them off of their property in this country for well over 2 centuries.  Is this new to you?  I think your cop-hate is queering your assessment of this situation.


I consider several things when I take such a stance. 
*One,* there's a lot of people looking to take my guns away and one of these might try to do it. Illegal and unlawful.
*Two*, people like this are becoming more common, there is no decrease in police operating Under Color of Law, but to your credit, not all of them are this way, but it's becoing a crap shoot what'll end up in your face. 
*Three,* every last one of them treats the person they meet as a suspect of some kind. All of them. 
*Four*, they kick doors in on innocent Citizens and relish the opportunity to shoot some one.
They have Rights we do not have. They have the Right to shoot anyone they "feel" is a threat to them. They can arrest, but you cannot. They are part of a sysytem that is so broken and corrupt, you cannot tell the good ones from the bad. 
Tis better to be cautious, than ignorant. I trust no one who is here to help keep me safe, especially when they are tazering me, demanding I stop jeking around like a fish at the end of a cattle prod, or pushing me out of my wheel chair while others look and laugh.
What's to trust? Hell, Mike, they aren't here to serve and protect, they are here to enforce whatever law they want.

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## St James

> Well, now, there's several cans been opened there.  The subject of righteous policing is near and dear to my heart; I administrated and moderated a forum on policing in Canada during the outfall from this little bit of business:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pick it up at the 4:50 mark and you get to witness an assassination by taser; from arrival to death in 24 seconds.
> 
> Needless to say, in Canada where we're still not comfortable with police having guns at all yet, you could say this touched off some controversy.  Shit storm would be a more apt description.  The prime minister had passed a special commission to allow the province of British Columbia to call a public hearing [with binding recommendations] into the actions of federal police, the alleged boys who "always get their man", the Royal Canadian Mounted Police.
> 
> ...


Policing varies from area to area, country to country. Here in the States, they are more brutal than some of the larger gangs.
They have placed themselves above the law and are acting with impunity against everyday folks. If they don't like the job, then they need to take up basket weaving. But you don't see alot of them quitting, as a matter of act, you often see their misdeeds swept under the rug and covered with a coat of denial. I cannot speak for other police departments, but here in the US, it's about as bad as Hitler's or Mao's regime.

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## Fearandloathing

> Policing varies from area to area, country to country. Here in the States, they are more brutal than some of the larger gangs.
> They have placed themselves above the law and are acting with impunity against everyday folks. If they don't like the job, then they need to take up basket weaving. But you don't see alot of them quitting, as a matter of act, you often see their misdeeds swept under the rug and covered with a coat of denial. I cannot speak for other police departments, but here in the US, it's about as bad as Hitler's or Mao's regime.


And that, sir, is one of the reasons I live here, and not there.  Even the guys at the border crossing I used on a weekly basis for four years, knew me well, and ALL of them treated my like a suspect every time I crossed; attitude.

Not here dude.  Recently I saw them in action with a homeless guy who had wandered drunk into my supermarket.  Cops got called right away and they sit him down on the sidewalk and call RideSafe and kept him "company" while they waited; he was not cuffed, he was given water to drink and treated with the same respect I was given when I spoke to them afterward.

That video I posted has changed the whole country's attitude toward "use of force."

However, do not look upon that as weakness.  Remember we are known to a be a polite people who reign supreme in the only professional sport that allows bare knuckled fighting.

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## Irascible Crusader

> One, there's a lot of people looking to take my guns away and one of these might try to do it. Illegal and unlawful.


I've found most cops to be friendly to the 2nd Ammendment.



> Two, people like this are becoming more common, there is no decrease in police operating Under Color of Law, but to your credit, not all of them are this way, but it's becoing a crap shoot what'll end up in your face.


  A crap shoot where the odds are you win.



> Three, every last one of them treats the person they meet as a suspect of some kind. All of them.


  Except when they don't.



> Four, they kick doors in on innocent Citizens and relish the opportunity to shoot some one.


Now that's a load of crap.  How many cops do you know wh want to kick in doors (knowing they could get shot) and "relish the opportunity to shoot someone?"  Holy crap!  You cop haters act like these are alien beings from another planet instead of members of the community they serve with a strong sense of justice, compassion, and moral rectitude.  Many cops retire immediately after killing somebody because they couldn't take it and didn't want to be in a position to do it again.  Cops are human beings, not heartless monsters. They are no different than you and I. And they are Americans who respect and revere our Constitution.  While there will always be badged bullies, most don't sign up to be cops just to oppress people.  Let's get real!



> They have Rights we do not have. They have the Right to shoot anyone they "feel" is a threat to them.


  No they can't.  This is what you cop-haters do, exaggerate all the excesses of law enforcement while ignoring their restraints.  You won't start threads about police officers being charged with murder after a review board because you don't think it happens.  In your surreal alter-reality, cops do whatever they want and don't face consequences.  Here in Realville, we call that bullshit.



> They can arrest, but you cannot.


  Wrong-o!  The power to arrest is even greater for a citizen on his own property than for a police officer.  I remember as a security officer I had one cop harrassing patrons in a bar and making it intolerable to be there.  Because I was security for that bar, I told the cop to leave the premises immediately.  When he refused, I told him I would arrest him for tresspassing if he didn't.  When he saw I was serious, he left.  In California, a citizens arrest is a serious issue, so serious that if you make an arrest and a cop refuses to take custody of the person you arrested, he can be charged with a felony.  So having made multiple arrests in my time as a security officer, I call bullshit on your claim.

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## Fearandloathing

> I've found most cops to be friendly to the 2nd Ammendment.
>   A crap shoot where the odds are you win.
>   Except when they don't.
> 
> 
> Now that's a load of crap.  How many cops do you know wh want to kick in doors (knowing they could get shot) and "relish the opportunity to shoot someone?"  Holy crap!  You cop haters act like these are alien beings from another planet instead of members of the community they serve with a strong sense of justice, compassion, and moral rectitude.  Many cops retire immediately after killing somebody because they couldn't take it and didn't want to be in a position to do it again.  Cops are human beings, not heartless monsters. They are no different than you and I. And they are Americans who respect and revere our Constitution.  While there will always be badged bullies, most don't sign up to be cops just to oppress people.  Let's get real!
>   No they can't.  This is what you cop-haters do, exaggerate all the excesses of law enforcement while ignoring their restraints.  You won't start threads about police officers being charged with murder after a review board because you don't think it happens.  In your surreal alter-reality, cops do whatever they want and don't face consequences.  Here in Realville, we call that bullshit.
>   Wrong-o!  The power to arrest is even greater for a citizen on his own property than for a police officer.  I remember as a security officer I had one cop harrassing patrons in a bar and making it intolerable to be there.  Because I was security for that bar, I told the cop to leave the premises immediately.  When he refused, I told him I would arrest him for tresspassing if he didn't.  When he saw I was serious, he left.  In California, a citizens arrest is a serious issue, so serious that if you make an arrest and a cop refuses to take custody of the person you arrested, he can be charged with a felony.  So having made multiple arrests in my time as a security officer, I call bullshit on your claim.




I suggest you may want to look a little deeper into citizen's arrest powers.  I am not doubting you, but I do know that in most jurisdictions such actions are rife with difficulty.  I would ask 'what specific provisions' the law gives in use of force and what level of restriction you can use and where there may be conflict with kidnapping and unlawful restriction laws.

Here, yes, we do have the power to arrest anyone we believe to have committed an offense under the law, that does not include civil matters.  You can't arrest a tenant for non payment of rent.  But, if you injure him in making that arrest?  You're fucked.  It's called assault with circumstances, same as if you sicked a dog on him.

Be real careful there.


BTW, I forgot to mention this, but if the guy in the original video is an officer of the court?  The cop is screwed and liable for obstruction of justice charges.  Judges take a very dim view of people waving guns at their delegated servants; by law an officer of the court cannot be charged with trespass in the serving of a writ, and no person "shall restrain, restrict, threaten or otherwise impair" the efforts ..or words to that effect and it's one of those things where you go directly to jail, no passing go.

In closing, I am not likely to ever try to arrest someone who is carrying a gun and whose version of the story will carry more weight than mine in court.  Me, I just stand there recording it with my phone and we'll see if the guy is still a cop a month down the road.

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## Irascible Crusader

> I suggest you may want to look a little deeper into citizen's arrest powers. I am not doubting you, but I do know that in most jurisdictions such actions are rife with difficulty. I would ask 'what specific provisions' the law gives in use of force and what level of restriction you can use and where there may be conflict with kidnapping and unlawful restriction laws.


  Citizens arrest and jury nullification are two subjects on which the public is largely ignorant on.  Suffice to say, people believe that both are impossible and that perception causes it to be a rare occurrence.




> Here, yes, we do have the power to arrest anyone we believe to have committed an offense under the law, that does not include civil matters. You can't arrest a tenant for non payment of rent. But, if you injure him in making that arrest? You're fucked. It's called assault with circumstances, same as if you sicked a dog on him.


  I've injured people making arrests, mostly sprained rotator cuffs and that sort of thing.  The law regarding citizens arrest is the same as for a police officer. A person can use "reasonable force" in effecting an arrest.  I've had people threaten to sue me, it never happened though.  The more weighty point is that citizens arrest powers are tied up in property rights, whether we're talking about your home or your business.  Bouncers forcefully remove people who refuse to leave PRECISELY because they have every right to.  Nobody is compelled to call the cops as an alternative to taking direct action to remove an unwelcome guest.



> Be real careful there.


  I did even better. I made sure I understood the laws that govern arrests by private citizens.



> BTW, I forgot to mention this, but if the guy in the original video is an officer of the court? The cop is screwed and liable for obstruction of justice charges. Judges take a very dim view of people waving guns at their delegated servants; by law an officer of the court cannot be charged with trespass in the serving of a writ, and no person "shall restrain, restrict, threaten or otherwise impair" the efforts ..or words to that effect and it's one of those things where you go directly to jail, no passing go.


The reason he'll get away with it is the same reason you're angry at him.  He's a cop.  I'm not too certain he's in the right on this, but he'll skate either way.



> In closing, I am not likely to ever try to arrest someone who is carrying a gun and whose version of the story will carry more weight than mine in court. Me, I just stand there recording it with my phone and we'll see if the guy is still a cop a month down the road.


You're talking about my eviction of a cop?  He was on the wrong side of the law and BELIEVE ME I had plenty of witnesses.  Oh, and I had a gun too. I'll repeat myself because it's a point that must be underscored, you have more rights on your own property than the police do and can enforce those rights at your discretion.  I wish more people understood that.

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## St James

> I've found most cops to be friendly to the 2nd Ammendment.
>   A crap shoot where the odds are you win.
>   Except when they don't.
> 
> 
> Now that's a load of crap.  How many cops do you know wh want to kick in doors (knowing they could get shot) and "relish the opportunity to shoot someone?"  Holy crap!  You cop haters act like these are alien beings from another planet instead of members of the community they serve with a strong sense of justice, compassion, and moral rectitude.  Many cops retire immediately after killing somebody because they couldn't take it and didn't want to be in a position to do it again.  Cops are human beings, not heartless monsters. They are no different than you and I. And they are Americans who respect and revere our Constitution.  While there will always be badged bullies, most don't sign up to be cops just to oppress people.  Let's get real!
>   No they can't.  This is what you cop-haters do, exaggerate all the excesses of law enforcement while ignoring their restraints.  You won't start threads about police officers being charged with murder after a review board because you don't think it happens.  In your surreal alter-reality, cops do whatever they want and don't face consequences.  Here in Realville, we call that bullshit.
>   Wrong-o!  The power to arrest is even greater for a citizen on his own property than for a police officer.  I remember as a security officer I had one cop harrassing patrons in a bar and making it intolerable to be there.  Because I was security for that bar, I told the cop to leave the premises immediately.  When he refused, I told him I would arrest him for tresspassing if he didn't.  When he saw I was serious, he left.  In California, a citizens arrest is a serious issue, so serious that if you make an arrest and a cop refuses to take custody of the person you arrested, he can be charged with a felony.  So having made multiple arrests in my time as a security officer, I call bullshit on your claim.


Try arresting a cop for intimdation....................doesnt matter, it is always subjective. If I feel truly threatened by a cop, and have done nothing wrong regardless, I should be able to defend myself. I used to live up northern Indiana in a fairly large community. You shoot a cop up there, you're time is up...a cop shoots you, he gets an award. That's LEO.
I have and will support my local peace officers. They are the guys that don't stop you just for the hell of it. Their approach is one of "peaceful resolution" hence peace officers. Hell dude, I was in my new place less that two weeks when 5 county cop cars and one plain white Lincoln was sitting all over my driveway. Nine county officers, one suit, with some mutt for an aid. He started bombarding me with questions and finally stopped and listened to what I was asking...Warrant? Complaint? 
Grumbled something about being from child protection services. and , no, he did not have a warrant, but......no complaint?....no...but it's an ongoing investigation for about a year now. 
Then it was about if I had found any paraphanalia in the trash I had removed....All the time, I'm looking at nine cops, especially the one beachball that had his hand on his firearn, even when it was evident I had no firearms on me. All that did was piss me off, and I told that ol' by that. I suggested next time he is more than welcome to come out, but it would be better to come out by himself. I won't be fuckin' bullied! I asked them to leave wnet in, shut the door , and went back to work. I know the limits, and I won't be bullshitted by some punk on a power trip. Next day, I went into town and contacted the sheriff personally and explained what happened and told him that it was suspicious on their part. That's when I was advised that it was unknown to him, but said he'd look into it. I told him he was always welcomed at my place. He's a peace officer. I got a drop by visit from him about a week later, and he told me he took care of the matter, that if i was good to my word, we would never have an issue. Problem solved, agreeably. But not all police are like this, it's not that they are human, but we don't expect that they should break the law and get away with it. There is no justification for any act of brutality against some one who is not a direct threat to themselves or someone else, someone attempting to kill, then extreme force is justifiable, just as it would for me. They hold themselves to a higher authority, then each and everyone of them should be spot on. 
Those who would be whistleblowers are rare and few. The fallout would be devastating to himself and his family. There are those who do not engage in that kind of activity, normally, but they can be stressed into it.
It starts at the lowest levels. Instead of writing a ticket, increase the number of warnings. That really the intent of the law. Just a nudge to let you know you were screwing around. Multi warnings or dangerous speeds, yeah stop 'em, I say, and give them a ticket that means something. One last thing, just because a cop says it's so, doesn't make it so...........

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## Irascible Crusader

> Try arresting a cop for intimdation....................doesnt matter, it is always subjective.


  actually, he would have been arrested for trespassing if he refused to leave.  In California, that's an arrest I could make stick which is why he left.  No officer could refuse to take him into custody once I made the arrest or they would be guilty of a felony.




> I have and will support my local peace officers. They are the guys that don't stop you just for the hell of it. Their approach is one of "peaceful resolution" hence peace officers. Hell dude, I was in my new place less that two weeks when 5 county cop cars and one plain white Lincoln was sitting all over my driveway. Nine county officers, one suit, with some mutt for an aid. He started bombarding me with questions and finally stopped and listened to what I was asking...Warrant? Complaint? 
>  Grumbled something about being from child protection services. and , no, he did not have a warrant, but......no complaint?....no...but it's an ongoing investigation for about a year now. 
>  Then it was about if I had found any paraphanalia in the trash I had removed....All the time, I'm looking at nine cops, especially the one beachball that had his hand on his firearn, even when it was evident I had no firearms on me. All that did was piss me off, and I told that ol' by that. I suggested next time he is more than welcome to come out, but it would be better to come out by himself. I won't be fuckin' bullied! I asked them to leave wnet in, shut the door , and went back to work. I know the limits, and I won't be bullshitted by some punk on a power trip. Next day, I went into town and contacted the sheriff personally and explained what happened and told him that it was suspicious on their part. That's when I was advised that it was unknown to him, but said he'd look into it. I told him he was always welcomed at my place. He's a peace officer. I got a drop by visit from him about a week later, and he told me he took care of the matter, that if i was good to my word, we would never have an issue. Problem solved, agreeably. But not all police are like this, it's not that they are human, but we don't expect that they should break the law and get away with it. There is no justification for any act of brutality against some one who is not a direct threat to themselves or someone else, someone attempting to kill, then extreme force is justifiable, just as it would for me. They hold themselves to a higher authority, then each and everyone of them should be spot on. 
>  Those who would be whistleblowers are rare and few. The fallout would be devastating to himself and his family. There are those who do not engage in that kind of activity, normally, but they can be stressed into it.
>  It starts at the lowest levels. Instead of writing a ticket, increase the number of warnings. That really the intent of the law. Just a nudge to let you know you were screwing around. Multi warnings or dangerous speeds, yeah stop 'em, I say, and give them a ticket that means something. One last thing, just because a cop says it's so, doesn't make it so...........


Sounds like you knew your rights.  I believe that police are more respectful when dealing with somebody who exudes familiarity with their rights under the law.  The point is, police are human beings with all the foibles, strengths and weaknesses of human beings.  They can be reasoned with, they are mostly well intentioned, and few if any want to roll out the carpet for the Red Brigades to come marching down the streets.  Many examples being cited on this site of "police brutality" are just petty.  We're so sheltered here in America that we have no idea what real police brutality is.  If I roll my eyes over some of the "outrages" that you guys are posting here, it's because I'm well aware of how police interract with the public in countries where liberty, democracy, and the rule of law are not held in high esteem.

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