# Stuff and Things > COVID & VACCINES >  HOT TOPIC: COVID:  Society, Politics, Human Rights

## Trinnity

*This thread is for the legal, societal and political aspects of COVID. Vaccines are in another STICKY in  this forum. Please add to this thread or yours may be moved.* 




> An article in Scientific American touches on the factors that may account for the high death rate in Italy including the demographics of an older population, while the spread of the infection may be attributed to bad luck in experiencing the infection early before there was a high degree of awareness of the virus. But another critical piece of the puzzle of why Italy is particularly hard hit which isn’t discussed by the mainstream media is offered up by David Vance at AltNewsMedia:
> “*Many Italians in Northern Italy have sold their leather goods and textiles companies to China. Italy then allowed 100,000 Chinese workers from Wuhan and Wenzhou to move to Italy to work in these factories, with direct flights between Wuhan and Northern Italy. This continued post outbreak*, so is it mere coincidence that Northern Italy is now Europe’s hotspot for Corona Virus?_"
> 
> _ rairfoundation.com


I haven't heard a peep about this in the MSM.

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## Morning Star

Open borders and global socialism is why.

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## jirqoadai

no. heres why. until the complete lock down, everyone was still running around.

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Lone Gunman (03-14-2020),Wehrwolfen (03-14-2020)

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## Kodiak

> I haven't heard a peep about this in the MSM.


Because the left never wants to put China in a bad light.

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Lone Gunman (03-14-2020),Old Ridge Runner (03-14-2020),Quark (03-14-2020)

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## Daily Bread

Italy is a place where the elder Italians like to go back to the "home country " and spend their last days . I'm seeing it more and more in my wife's family and the elderly are leaving and going back to their birthplace and it's the elderly that are dying from this virus. The health system isn't the one of old, where we used to see a degree on our doctors wall here in the U.S. with the words University of Bologna on it . The demands of the EU have strained the health care system and the Italy of old was replaced with the open border concept . It's close to bankruptcy and the aged and medical system is feeling the pain . Italy is a tourist mecca and Italians are a touchy ,feely nationality - that combined with kissing and overly explosive verbel expressions that send droplets of the virus into the surrounding atmosphere is taking its toll . 
Plus they didn't realize what this was at first and thought it was the flu and treated it as such . 
Some have indicated cheap Chinese labor brought into maintain the fabric and leather fashion industry in Milan may be the culprit and won't directly say it to protect the nationality .
All this is mute at the moment because the safeguards we used to use in the common sense days of having immigrants pass basic health test as on Ellis Island during the great immigration periods of the 30s,40s, and 50s is looked down upon by the social do gooders of the current times but this disease may be the left's downfall and there will be major changes in social attitudes and our tolerances  in the coming months .
We're PCing ourselves to death and are still too timid to take them on at the moment - thats going to change real quick.

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Lone Gunman (03-14-2020),Old Ridge Runner (03-14-2020),riderboy (03-14-2020)

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## Wehrwolfen

> no. heres why. until the complete lock down, everyone was still running around.


~~~~~~
It's my opinion that the Covid-19 virus was being passed around in China as early as October and China did nothing to stop it. By shutting down air travel immediately and isolating the cruise ships Trump's actions has given us a chance to get in front of the pandemic. DJT's fast actions far surpass the incompetent actions Obama made during the Swine, SARS, MRSA, Zika, and Ebola threats to America.

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## jirqoadai

my ditz daughter has freinds in italy. the family she knows was evacuating milan the day before the complete lockdown.

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Lone Gunman (03-14-2020)

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## riderboy

I knew there was a direct connection between Italy and China.  Didn't realize it was Wuhan. And of course, Italy failed to close down travel with disastrous consequences.

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Daily Bread (03-14-2020),Lone Gunman (03-14-2020),Old Ridge Runner (03-14-2020),Wehrwolfen (03-14-2020)

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## Old Tex

We are taking precautions here (stocking up, cutting down our trips out, etc.) not because of us but because of my step father. He's 88 & not in great health & a prime candidate to get something like this. I'm of course in the 
"danger" age group but I could really care less. I feel that if it's my time then it's my time. Besides I think that if I go to heaven (I "could" squeak in) there won't be any democrats there to talk to .  You have to look at the bright side.

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Daily Bread (03-15-2020),Lone Gunman (03-14-2020),Northern Rivers (03-15-2020)

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## Daily Bread

The common factor in all of this is the Chinese and any one flying in from China . Was it let loose on purpose to create havoc or was it a virus developed for future war use on China's enemies . 
Someone is obviously working on some powerful ,destructive forces and they need to be called out for it . What else is in the test tubes that didn't get out ?

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Lone Gunman (03-14-2020)

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## jirqoadai

there was a us group who went to egypt and everyone returning from the nile cruise got hit.

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## tom

According to a Russian virologist, the virus has mutated into several strains, and the one in Italy is especially dangerous.

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Wehrwolfen (03-14-2020)

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## jirqoadai

different strains? do tell...... ive never heard of that before.......

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## Jen

No more explanation than that is necessary.

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## ruthless terrier

> Because the left never wants to put China in a bad light.



i am starting to think China may be a driving force of the Democrat party.

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Daily Bread (03-15-2020)

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## Abbey

Has everything  been  shut down,  completely?

 No one from  ANY country  allowed  in?  No overseas  flights  into  American  airports?

 ALL illegals  turned  away at the southern border, no matter  if they're  seeking  asylum ?

 We have the right to do  those things,  in order to  protect  OUR country and  its citizens,  do we not?

 So, shove it  up your asses, Democrats and,  empty  headed  "celebrities!"

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Lone Gunman (03-14-2020),NuYawka (03-15-2020),riderboy (03-14-2020)

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## RMNIXON

Globalism is not just stupid, it is deadly!  :Sofa:

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Lone Gunman (03-14-2020)

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## Wehrwolfen

> I knew there was a direct connection between Italy and China.  Didn't realize it was Wuhan. And of course, Italy failed to close down travel with disastrous consequences.


~~~~~~
I'm starting to wonder if this 'Open Borders' theme Socialists in Europe and America have been touting may now become a thing of the past until this pandemic is gone.  The question is will it be gone or become cyclic?

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Lone Gunman (03-14-2020)

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## Wehrwolfen

> different strains? do tell...... ive never heard of that before.......



~~~~~~
*Coronavirus is mutating with a second strain identified by ...*



https://*www.news-medical.net*/news/20200305/*Coronavirus*-is-mutating-with-a-second...
9 days ago · The *coronavirus* is *mutating* as scientists identified a second strain, which is more aggressive and contagious. As healthcare officials fight to curb the outbreak of coronavirus, a team of researchers from China says a new study shows that COVID-19 is mutating, with at least two types of virus circulating across countries now.
The researchers named the aggressive strain as "L type," and the less aggressive type as "S type." The L type was more often seen in patients from Wuhan, China, where the virus first emerged in late December 2019. On the other hand, the S type is the one currently spreading in other countries. The L type strain has since declined steadily since January.

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## jirqoadai

> ~~~~~~
> *Coronavirus is mutating with a second strain identified by ...*
> 
> 
> 
> https://*www.news-medical.net*/news/20200305/*Coronavirus*-is-mutating-with-a-second...
> 9 days ago · The *coronavirus* is *mutating* as scientists identified a second strain, which is more aggressive and contagious. As healthcare officials fight to curb the outbreak of coronavirus, a team of researchers from China says a new study shows that COVID-19 is mutating, with at least two types of virus circulating across countries now.
> The researchers named the aggressive strain as "L type," and the less aggressive type as "S type." The L type was more often seen in patients from Wuhan, China, where the virus first emerged in late December 2019. On the other hand, the S type is the one currently spreading in other countries. The L type strain has since declined steadily since January.


i was being sarcastic to the tenth degree. 
theres bat,
pandolin and canadian biowarfare.

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## Trinnity

> i am starting to think China may be a driving force of the Democrat party.


Greed and power are their driving force. China simply bought most of them.

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## Lone Gunman

> Globalism is not just stupid, it is deadly!



intentionally so.

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## RedLily b6

> intentionally so.


Unfortunately so.

Every year something nasty comes out of China.   I don't think this one will be the worst we will see (far from it) but it certainly should prepare us for the worst in the future and make us change our attitude towards the types of goods we allow to be manufactured in China.

Let China make cheap trinkets but do not allow them to manufacture our pharmaceuticals or life preserving medical equipment.

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Northern Rivers (03-15-2020)

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## Wehrwolfen

> The common factor in all of this is the Chinese and any one flying in from China . Was it let loose on purpose to create havoc or was it a virus developed for future war use on China's enemies . 
> Someone is obviously working on some powerful ,destructive forces and they need to be called out for it . What else is in the test tubes that didn't get out ?


~~~~~~
You have to stop and wonder why the virus began just before the Chinese agreed to sign the trade agreement with the U.S.
In repeat of facts, Th main Level one laboratory is located 5 kilometers outside Wuhan. We also know that the Public Health facilities and sanitation in China minimal, the M.E. and similarly in part of Europe.
Is it a coincidence that Wuhan was the epicenter of the spread of Covid-19?   I don't think we'll ever know. 
I don't deny the importance of controlling the spread of this virus, it can be deadly to the old and infirmed. We've dealt with the influenza for a millennia so I personally am not distressed. Using good tried and tested sanitary conditions is the key. 
President trump has made the right moves to slow the spread. All the biased media talking heads and Leftist politicians are making mountains out of mole hills trying to make points and blame trump.

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## Wehrwolfen

> Greed and power are their driving force. China simply bought most of them.



~~~~~~
You are so right.... Unfortunately they've compromised both sides of the U.S. political system. DJT is the first president in the 21st Century that has tried to undo what previous presidents have done for decades to bring down this problem.

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## Trinnity

Sometimes I do get it right.  :Dontknow:  Go figure. I wish I'd known in my 20s what I understand now. :Geez:

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## ruthless terrier

> Sometimes I do get it right.  Go figure. I wish I'd known in my 20s what I understand now.


put another way: I wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then  :Cool20:

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## Ginger

I'm gonna be posting incidents of bad r_e_actions and info on WHY


Most of my friends in nursing are avoiding the vax at all costs-me too!

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## Ginger

Brianne Dressen is a preschool teacher from Utah who was injured after participating in AstraZeneca’s COVID vaccine clinical trial in November 2020. She has accumulated more than $250,000 in medical bills as a result of injuries she believes were caused by the vaccine.

Dressen said within one hour of being vaccinated she had tingling down her arm. By the time she got home her vision was blurry and doubled. Her sensitivity became so severe that she had to wear earmuffs and sunglasses all the time.

That’s when things took a turn for the worse. “Things progressed quickly,” Dressen said. She experienced neurological decline, but no one could explain why. After a neurological scan, doctors said it looked as if she had multiple sclerosis (MS).

According to Mayo Clinic, MS is a potentially disabling disease of the brain and spinal cord where the immune system attacks the protective sheath (myelin) that covers nerve fibers and causes communication problems between the brain and the rest of the body.

basedunderground.com

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## Jen

If someone is old, has significant health problems, and believe they are at high risk for covid, maybe they have nothing to lose if they take the vaccine.  

I choose not to take it.  Period.

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## BooBoo

Haven't gotten one either... just the Seasonal Flu shot back in Feb...!! Just got over a Summer Cold which lasted aprox. 10 Days...!! In Me 73rd Year and Me Immune System is Kicking Butt...!!!

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## donttread

> I'm gonna be posting incidents of bad r_e_actions and info on WHY
> 
> 
> Most of my friends in nursing are avoiding the vax at all costs-me too!



In my unpopular opinion ( in society not on this board) you have the right to not get vaccinated if that's what you want. Even though I am vaccinated despite also being COVID recovered. We just thought it would be necessary for work and travel so we got the shots. I had no fear of the vaccine and I think it's the lesser risk for most, even though I don't think I really needed it.
But I am sick of the government cajolling, pressuring and bribing people into taking a shot they don't want, especially black people whom they seem to see as incapable of making this choice for themselves. Why do all these vaccinated people care what others descide to do? The odds of dying from COVID after being fully vaccinated are extremely low so live and let live/ or die people.
It seems to be that the days of personal choice are numbered.

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## BooBoo

July 13, 2021
AJMC Staff :

"_HHS officials say that fully vaccinated individuals do not need to  get a booster shot; FDA issues a warning on link between the Johnson  & Johnson vaccine and a rare neurological condition; California  counties sue pesticide manufacturer over widely used bug killer that may  cause brain damage in children and fetuses."

"_Rare Nerve Syndrome Linked With Johnson & Johnson Vaccine
Yesterday,  the FDA issued a warning that the COVID-19 vaccine manufactured by  Johnson & Johnson (J&J) can lead to an increased risk of a rare  neurological condition known as Guillain-Barré syndrome, which occurs  when the immune system damages nerve cells, causing muscle weakness and  occasional paralysis. According to _The New York Times_,  the risk of developing the condition is low, with approximately 100  suspected cases identified so far, but the risk appears to be 3 to 5  times higher among those who received the J&J vaccine. Moreover, the  FDA said that available evidence suggests an association between the  vaccine and the condition, but there remains insufficient evidence to  establish a causal link."

More Here :

What Weâre Reading: Vaccine Booster Shot; Rare Nerve Syndrome Warning; Pesticide Linked to Brain Damage in Children

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phoenyx (07-16-2021)

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## Authentic

I won't be a guinea pig.

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## Canadianeye

I know 2 people personally who had the jab, and it didn't end well. One stroked out 2 weeks after the second jab. Blood clot didn't get to his brain though. He's in hospital, left side problems. Dunno if he can rebound back or not. 73. Non smoker, fairly fit, barely drank.

Other guy had his first shot, went to work (he owns a bicycle shop) and dropped dead in the back room. 55 ish.

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## Old Tex

I'm willing to compromise on the vax shots. Say half of the country should get them & the other half can do a "wait & see". I would suggest that the democrats should be the ones that get the shots. That way if they affect the brain it won't really matter.

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## Jen

> Haven't gotten one either... just the Seasonal Flu shot back in Feb...!! Just got over a Summer Cold which lasted aprox. 10 Days...!! In Me 73rd Year and Me Immune System is Kicking Butt...!!!


I have a great immune system for an old gal.

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## Conservative Libertarian

> I'm gonna be posting incidents of bad r_e_actions and info on WHY
> 
> 
> Most of my friends in nursing are avoiding the vax at all costs-me too!


My sister was a nurse of 40 years and retired in the Fall of 2019. She refuses to get a COVID vax.

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## Ginger

_(s_orry this i_s s_o long_)_

Canadian doctor Charles Hoffe believes that the mRNA vaccines manufacture microscopic blood clots in the capillaries of the vaccinated and at least 60 percent could eventually succumb to heart failure.

Charles Hoffe, who practices medicine at Lytton British Columbia, explained: We now know that only 25 percent of the vaccine injected into a persons arm actually stays in your arm. The other 75 percent is collected by your lymphatic system and literally fed into your circulation so these little packages of messenger RNA, and by the way in a single dose of Moderna vaccine there are literally 40 trillion mRNA molecules.

These packages are designed to be absorbed into your cells. But the only place they can be absorbed is around your blood vessels and the place where they are absorbed is the capillary networks  the tiniest blood vessels where the blood flow slows right down and where the genes are released.

Your body then gets to work reading and then manufacturing trillions and trillions of these spike proteins. Each gene can produce many, many spike proteins. The body then recognises these are foreign bodies so it makes antibodies against it so your are then protected against Covid. Thats the idea.

But instead, the product becomes part of the cell wall of the vascular endothelium. So it is absolutely inevitable that blood clots will form because your blood platelets circulate round your blood vessels, and the purpose of blood platelets is to identify damaged vessels and stop bleeding. So, when the platelet comes through the capillary it suddenly hits all these Covid spikes and it becomes absolutely inevitable that blood clots will form to block that vessel.

A blood test called a D-dimer blood test, clearly revealed this disconcerting development. The blood clots we hear about which the media claim are very rare are the big blood clots which are the ones that cause strokes and show up on CT scans, MRI, etc. The clots Im talking about are microscopic and too small to find on any scan. They can thus only be detected using the D-dimer test. In performing D-dimer tests on his mRNA jabbed patients, Hoffe discovered that at least 62 percent of them had these microscopic blood clots.

These people have no idea they are even having these microscopic blood clots. The most alarming part of this is that there are some parts of the body like the brain, spinal cord, heart and lungs which cannot re-generate. When those tissues are damaged by blood clots they are permanently damaged.

This causes Reduced Effort Tolerance (RET) due to the blood vessels in the lungs being blocked. As a result, the heart needs to work harder to compensate for the blocked vessels. The condition is known as pulmonary artery hypertension, which inevitably leads to heart failure.


https://uncanceled.news/canadian-doc...heart-failure/

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BooBoo (07-16-2021)

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## Physics Hunter

It's like freedom and boxing.  Defend yourself at all time and make your own choices.

I would not take the mRNA crap for the world, but I got the J&J.  From what I read, the J&J is only experimental in the sense that is has not been fully tested, not in the sense that it is in any way new technology...

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BooBoo (07-16-2021),Conservative Libertarian (07-15-2021)

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## Call_me_Ishmael

> It's like freedom and boxing.  Defend yourself at all time and make your own choices.
> 
> I would not take the mRNA crap for the world, but I got the J&J.  From what I read, the J&J is only experimental in the sense that is has not been fully tested, not in the sense that it is in any way new technology...


And I'm just the opposite.  I consciously prefer the mrna types. But ultimately, don't they all simply replicate the spike protein and isn't that what all the anti-vax is about?

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BooBoo (07-16-2021)

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## Call_me_Ishmael

> Your body then gets to work reading and then manufacturing *trillions and trillions* of these spike proteins. Each gene can produce *many, many* spike proteins.


I've worked in engineering too long I guess.  I'm interested in these antivaxer reports because there may be hazards I'm not aware of . 


But when I read such articles and I hit a phrase that relates to the real "toxic" components and it says "trillions and trillions" and "many many" as a way to quantify the toxic materials, the scientific part of my brain goes " oh well... that was a useless 5 minutes I'll never get back".

McDonalds-puts-out-Help-Wanted-sign.jpg

Numbers anyone? Scientific notation would suffice. Use ^ as an exponent.  Like ... 5x10^12 means 5,000,000,000,000 for example.  That's 5 trillion.

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BooBoo (07-16-2021),potlatch (07-20-2021)

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## Hermannsdenkmal

Please note: if you don't want to hear the results of Dr. Charles Hoffe's study, please click to another thread. This video needs to be consumed primarily by the unvaxed I would assume, and if you are vaxed, this can't help you. 




If you watched the 9 min video: what do you think? I think Dr Hoffe sounds light years more knowledgeable than all the TV doctors we're used to hearing. AFAIK, the man has no incentive to make the claims he's making. In fact, it's career suicide either way; if he's right, he'll be ostracized and canceled anyway, and if he's wrong, he'll be remembered as a quack.

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BooBoo (07-16-2021),tlmjl (07-30-2021)

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## UKSmartypants

On the other hand


Canadian doctors recycle inaccurate Covid-19 claims | Fact Check

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BooBoo (07-16-2021),FlameHeart (08-06-2021)

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## Hermannsdenkmal

> On the other hand
> 
> 
> Canadian doctors recycle inaccurate Covid-19 claims | Fact Check


Ok, so you've got your handy little French corporate media link to shill, but what else pertaining to covid did the global corporate media get wrong? Well, all of it. 

Or was covid really started at a wet market?

Or is mentioning the origin nation really racism?

Or do ventilators really work?

Or do masks really work?

Or are we better off isolating at home than enjoying the sunshine?

Or does covid infect outdoor diners, but not outdoor rioters?

Or are children really super spreaders?

Huh. What does AfP know?

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BooBoo (07-16-2021),Daily Bread (07-16-2021)

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## Hermannsdenkmal

> On the other hand
> 
> 
> Canadian doctors recycle inaccurate Covid-19 claims | Fact Check


To top it all off, you didn't even bother to read your own link. The 'AfP Fact-Checkers' can't be arsed to list who they are, and what their names are. But that's good enough. Anyway, even the Anonymous fact checkers admit Hoffe is right about the nature of his claims, they just accuse him of not having the numbers right. And being that this article is date stamped May 28, they wouldn't have known that in June, Dr Fauci's emails would validate Hoffe's claims that masks don't work, and may even come with risk. 

Huh.

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BooBoo (07-16-2021),Trinnity (07-16-2021)

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## Freewill

OK, the doctor talks about a problem can not be seen or detected other than by a test.

Empirical data tells me that no one I know who has received the jab has symptoms like this doctor describes.  One would think with a 62 percent rate there would be people dropping like flies, is that happening?  Is the problem with every vaccine or just some vaccines?

Before the jab I went to PF and did the elliptical for 30 minutes every other day.  Now I do the elliptical for 30 minutes after doing the rowing machine for 10 minutes (pure torture).

So I see no problem from the jab, FOR ME.  But that doesn't mean that there are those who a susceptible to having problems due to the jab.  Just like every one didn't get covid in the first place, nor did everyone get polio or small pox but some did.

More empirical data tells me NO ONE I know has had a side effect from the jab, NO ONE.

62 percent of his patients are found to have clotting at a level that can not be detected any other way then by a test.  Wouldn't that make a person question the test?  Or shouldn't a little bit of common sense be injected?

I am not a doctor, this man is.  So I do not reject what he says out of hand.  But I do believe both sides of the argument are gaslighting us.

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BooBoo (07-16-2021),Traddles (07-16-2021)

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## Freewill

PSA from the web for those of us not doctors:

The D-dimer test is a blood test that indicates whether blood clots are being actively formed somewhere within a person’s vascular system. This test is most often helpful in the diagnosis of pulmonary embolus and deep vein thrombosis, but it can also be useful in diagnosing other medical conditions in which blood clots play a role.

Why is a positive D-dimer is not always a blood clot?Why a Positive D-Dimer Is Not Always a Blood Clot. A blood clot causes a breakdown product called D-dimer . A negative blood result means you don't have a pulmonary embolism. But with increasing age comes an increased likelihood of a positive result, even if there are no blood clots.

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BooBoo (07-16-2021)

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## Oceander

Hmmm, a vaccine for a virus that leaves many people asymptomatic - i.e., it cannot be detected except with a specialized test - is allegedly causing side effects that, themselves, cannot be detected except with a specialized test.

Who is gaslighting whom?

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Canadianeye (07-16-2021)

----------


## Canadianeye

> OK, the doctor talks about a problem can not be seen or detected other than by a test.
> 
> Empirical data tells me that no one I know who has received the jab has symptoms like this doctor describes.  One would think with a 62 percent rate there would be people dropping like flies, is that happening?  Is the problem with every vaccine or just some vaccines?
> 
> Before the jab I went to PF and did the elliptical for 30 minutes every other day.  Now I do the elliptical for 30 minutes after doing the rowing machine for 10 minutes (pure torture).
> 
> So I see no problem from the jab, FOR ME.  But that doesn't mean that there are those who a susceptible to having problems due to the jab.  Just like every one didn't get covid in the first place, nor did everyone get polio or small pox but some did.
> 
> More empirical data tells me NO ONE I know has had a side effect from the jab, NO ONE.
> ...


Let's just break it down then.

The vaxxing side of things is using propaganda, fear tactics, threats, implied threats, fines and censorship...and in America at least a Presidential direction towards reading your texts for anti-vax messages. The vaxxing side of things comes from the governments, their purchased MSMs on television, cable and the internet, and, their employees in the medical bureaucracy, which is inclusive of the insurance industry and big pharma.

They are doing this on a global scale. Same format in many different countries.

Anti-vaxxers have the internet, albeit censored to varying degrees. That's it. When you make the statement you believe both sides of the argument are gaslighting us...are you not observing the perspective of "_scale_" and "past evil histories" of governments, MSMs, big Pharma, Insurance industries, towards their citizenry?

I had a rather lengthy conversation with a friend yesterday regarding this, and between us we kind of broke down the tactics and eventual outcomes will be.

So let's say this doctor is right. In 2-3 years those clots are going to produce a very negative effect on a significant portion of the population. The first conclusion we came to, is that that won't matter. The data regarding strokes and clots etc is contained by the above listed provaxxers. They can alter or withhold whatever they like.

Now, if one was clever enough to somehow get all that data compiled, spill it all over the internet NOW - for all to see and compare 2-3 years from now, won't make a hill of beans. They will claim conspiracy theory nuts, they will censor the viewing of that older data, and, they will generate false data geared towards any direction they wish.

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),tlmjl (07-30-2021)

----------


## Trinnity

As a rad tech I know a lot about pulmonary embolus -it's fatal if not caught and stopped quickly. I know enough about physiology to be scared shitless.  There's a high rate of medical people refusing the vaccine. WHY? 

_I'll take a hard pass on any covid vaccine. 
_
Thanks @squidward for giving me the answer I was seeking - that the JJ vax is just as bad; it makes the spike proteins just like the others do.

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Brat (07-16-2021),squidward (08-05-2021),tlmjl (07-30-2021)

----------


## Traddles

> ...
> Before the jab I went to PF and did the elliptical for 30 minutes every other day.  Now I do the elliptical for 30 minutes after doing the rowing machine for 10 minutes (pure torture).
> 
> So I see no problem from the jab, FOR ME.  But that doesn't mean that there are those who a susceptible to having problems due to the jab.  Just like every one didn't get covid in the first place, nor did everyone get polio or small pox but some did.
> ...


1. I "gaslight" no one - I realize you were not implying that. *LIEden* will tell any lie he thinks will result in political gain. A year ago, he, Kammie, and Goobernors Cuomo and Noisome were telling Americans that Covid vaccines being tested were unsafe and should not be trusted. Call that gaslighting, call it opportunistic lies, both shoes fit. The likes of RFK Jr. and Joseph Mercola will and do tell any lie they think will persuade people of their anti-vax and/or anti-Covid-vax views. From injected "microchips" to re-programming DNA to shedding spikes to magnetized arms (and more), all rancid porcine manure lies.

2. Pre-Covid and pre-vax I was able to do flat 5Ks and up to 5-milers. I hit the trails or did weights exercises at home once or twice a week. Pretty lazy, for me. Post-Covid and -vax I'm hitting the gym 4 or 5 days a week, doing 1 or 2 miles on the treadmill (bumping up speed and ramp from week to week) plus doing a couple of weights machines at each visit. Nothing spectacular, just, as with you, inconsistent with this supposed doctor's claim.

3. If 62% of vaccine recipients have "irreversible" blood clots, why haven't US hospitals been deluged with 111 million blood clot patients *(.6 x the # of US people who have received at least one vaccine dose)*? This porcine manure claim is so rancid that pigs wouldn't wallow in it.

4. As anyone who has recovered from a stroke or has a close relative or friend who has recovered from a stroke would know, blood clots do go away - whether dissolved, eaten by the immune system, or whatever. So not only is this supposed doctor's 62% claim preposterous on its face, so also is his claim that blood clots are "irreversible".

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Neo (07-16-2021)

----------


## Kurmugeon

> Let's just break it down then.
> 
> The vaxxing side of things is using propaganda, fear tactics, threats, implied threats, fines and censorship...and in America at least a Presidential direction towards reading your texts for anti-vax messages. The vaxxing side of things comes from the governments, their purchased MSMs on television, cable and the internet, and, their employees in the medical bureaucracy, which is inclusive of the insurance industry and big pharma.
> 
> They are doing this on a global scale. Same format in many different countries.
> 
> Anti-vaxxers have the internet, albeit censored to varying degrees. That's it. When you make the statement you believe both sides of the argument are gaslighting us...are you not observing the perspective of "_scale_" and "past evil histories" of governments, MSMs, big Pharma, Insurance industries, towards their citizenry?
> 
> I had a rather lengthy conversation with a friend yesterday regarding this, and between us we kind of broke down the tactics and eventual outcomes will be.
> ...


At one point, getting the vaccine or not was personal discretion in the Military.  And during that time 40% of the Marines refused the vaccine. 

My daughter is an Army mid-level officer.  She tells me, that since Biden took office, the vaccine is now 100% mandatory.  Let's say that the 60% dead or incapacitated by clots is true.  What does that do to our ability to say NO! to China, if they decide to invade Taiwan, New Zealand and/or Australia?

In the military, since WWII, the doctrine is to base your military preparedness actions on what the enemy CAN do, not what it has done. 

-

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Canadianeye (07-16-2021)

----------


## ruthless terrier

> blood clots do go away - whether dissolved, eaten by the immune system, or whatever.



unless they don't and you get a fatal heart attack or embolism or stroke.

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Trinnity (07-16-2021)

----------


## Trinnity

> blood clots do go away


Non medical people speculating is contemptible. It's the very same reason Fauci is a fraud.

Pro-tip: don't be the guinea pig.

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> *Non medical people speculating is contemptible*. It's the very same reason Fauci is a fraud.
> 
> Pro-tip: don't be the guinea pig.


May I quote you ?

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021)

----------


## Brat

> I'm gonna be posting incidents of bad r_e_actions and info on WHY
> 
> 
> Most of my friends in nursing are avoiding the vax at all costs-me too!


Preaching to the choir here, @Ginger

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Ginger (07-16-2021)

----------


## Neo

I had my 2 jabs, I had no reaction at all, in fact I feel superb, and I didnt even feel the needles both times go in my left upper arm.
As I travel around the country a lot I deemed it beneficial to get vaccinated, I come into contact with a hell of a lot of people Ive never met before.
Even reading of some alleged reactions to the jab I feel people are blaming it unduly, the jab is safe..get it done!

----------


## Trinnity

> May I quote you ?


I don't care.

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021)

----------


## Kurmugeon

> Non medical people speculating is contemptible. It's the very same reason Fauci is a fraud.
> 
> Pro-tip: don't be the guinea pig.


I was required to get the vaccine or lose my job with a major chip manufacturer.  Since I started raising questions about the safety of the vaccine on this forum, I was ostracized at work, and they fired me yesterday. So, I lost anyway, and now I likely have the chemical seeds of my own death inside me.

My wife is in far, far worse shape, I doubt she will survive more than a month.  She got her vaccine at Walmart, even though I begged her not to.

-

----------

12icer (07-19-2021),Big Bird (07-29-2021),BooBoo (07-16-2021),Jen (07-16-2021),tlmjl (07-30-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> I had my 2 jabs, I had no reaction at all, in fact I feel superb, and I didn’t even feel the needles both times go in my left upper arm.
> As I travel around the country a lot I deemed it beneficial to get vaccinated, I come into contact with a hell of a lot of people I’ve never met before.
> Even reading of some alleged reactions to the jab I feel people are blaming it unduly, the jab is safe…..get it done!



ditto. Ive had two Pfizer jabs, the wife has had two AZ. Apart from the usual achy arm for a day, nothing.

Unvaccinated people are mutation factories, and hinder herd immunity.

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Neo (07-16-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> I was required to get the vaccine or lose my job with a major chip manufacturer.  Since I started raising questions about the safety of the vaccine on this forum, I was ostracized at work, and they fired me yesterday. So, I lost anyway, and now I likely have the chemical seeds of my own death inside me.
> 
> My wife is in far, far worse shape, I doubt she will survive more than a month.  She got her vaccine at Walmart, even though I begged her not to.
> 
> -


Sorry to hear that you lost your job.


Your work associates know your posts here? Did you criticize vaccines at work? 


I'm glad I retired in Jan. I would have been fired too over CRT bullshit probably.

----------

12icer (07-19-2021),BooBoo (07-16-2021),tlmjl (07-30-2021)

----------


## Neo

> ditto. Ive had two Pfizer jabs, the wife has had two AZ. Apart from the usual achy arm for a day, nothing.
> 
> Unvaccinated people are mutation factories, and hinder herd immunity.


 :Thumbsup20:

----------

UKSmartypants (07-16-2021)

----------


## Kurmugeon

> Your work knows your posts here?


I was illegally Doxxed by a Progressive, hate-filled staff member with access to the registration database at the Debate Politics forum.

-

----------

12icer (07-19-2021),BooBoo (07-16-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> I was required to get the vaccine or lose my job with a major chip manufacturer.  Since I started raising questions about the safety of the vaccine on this forum, I was ostracized at work, and they fired me yesterday. So, I lost anyway, and now I likely have the chemical seeds of my own death inside me.
> 
> My wife is in far, far worse shape, I doubt she will survive more than a month.  She got her vaccine at Walmart, even though I begged her not to.
> 
> -



Sorry you lost your job mate   :Frown:

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Neo (07-16-2021),tlmjl (07-30-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> I was illegally Doxxed by a Progressive, hate-filled staff member with access to the registration database at the Debate Politics forum.
> 
> -


Ahhhh... that is a concern of mine... not so much here but elsewhere... which is why I'm staying away from "elsewhere".

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021)

----------


## Canadianeye

> I was illegally Doxxed by a Progressive, hate-filled staff member with access to the registration database at the Debate Politics forum.
> 
> -


Don't you just love the Vaxx Nazis...who delight in you losing your job.

I hope you and your wife survive this all, and I hope you can rebound to other employment.

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Ginger (07-16-2021),Kurmugeon (07-16-2021),tlmjl (07-30-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> ditto. Ive had two Pfizer jabs, the wife has had two AZ. Apart from the usual achy arm for a day, nothing.
> 
> Unvaccinated people are mutation factories, and hinder herd immunity.


I can't say pro or con about these vaccines. If people have doubts about their safety, they should not violate their own standards of safety. 

As for me, I have always been a risk taker if the benefits are there.  I won't skydive nor bungee cord jump, for example. But I got 2 jabs of phizer as did my non-risk taker significant other. We have both been fine although I have known for a few years I will likely die of cancer in the next decade. My daughter got Moderna and it knocked her down for two days.  But then she was fine. My landlady (80) and her husband (70) both got one of the mRNA vaccines.  He's long been a basket case of ailments but she is tough and almost never sick. They are both OK. 

I don't know anyone who had serious complications with the virus. Last year, the people here who claimed that THERE IS NO COVID, used that test to prove it. "Do you know anyone who died of COVID?" A "NO" answer was supposed to be evidence that COVID was a hoax. If I applied that same logic, I might conclude that the vaccine is perfectly safe. But I didn't apply such childish logic then and I don't apply it now. I think taking the vaccines is a risky decision.  I simply accepted the risk.

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021)

----------


## BooBoo

> As a rad tech I know a lot about pulmonary embolus -it's fatal if not caught and stopped quickly. I know enough about physiology to be scared shitless.  There's a high rate of medical people refusing the vaccine. WHY? 
> 
> _I'll take a hard pass on any covid vaccine. 
> _
> Thanks @squidward for giving me the answer I was seeking - that the JJ vax is just as bad; it makes the spike proteins just like the others do.



See Post #6...!!!

----------


## BooBoo

> I was required to get the vaccine or lose my job with a major chip manufacturer.  Since I started raising questions about the safety of the vaccine on this forum, I was ostracized at work, and they fired me yesterday. So, I lost anyway, and now I likely have the chemical seeds of my own death inside me.
> 
> My wife is in far, far worse shape, I doubt she will survive more than a month.  She got her vaccine at Walmart, even though I begged her not to.
> 
> -



Well, that just Sucks...!!! Sorry that happened to You and I Hope Both You and the Mrs. come thru OK...!!!

----------

Kurmugeon (07-16-2021),tlmjl (07-30-2021)

----------


## Kurmugeon

> I can't say pro or con about these vaccines. If people have doubts about their safety, they should not violate their own standards of safety. 
> 
> As for me, I have always been a risk taker if the benefits are there.  I won't skydive nor bungee cord jump, for example. But I got 2 jabs of phizer as did my non-risk taker significant other. We have both been fine although I have known for a few years I will likely die of cancer in the next decade. My daughter got Moderna and it knocked her down for two days.  But then she was fine. My landlady (80) and her husband (70) both got one of the mRNA vaccines.  He's long been a basket case of ailments but she is tough and almost never sick. They are both OK. 
> 
> I don't know anyone who had serious complications with the virus. Last year, the people here who claimed that THERE IS NO COVID, used that test to prove it. "Do you know anyone who died of COVID?" A "NO" answer was supposed to be evidence that COVID was a hoax. If I applied that same logic, I might conclude that the vaccine is perfectly safe. But I didn't apply such childish logic then and I don't apply it now. I think taking the vaccines is a risky decision.  I simply accepted the risk.


I could be wrong, but I don't think there is anything wrong with MOST, but never all, of the vials of any of the vaccines coming out of the factories.  In any en devour, particular advanced medicine, there will be mistakes and bad lots, but by in large, I believe the vials of vaccine as they ship from the factory are fine, effective to 80-94% and a good thing.

But!  There is next to zero security on those vials as they ship to their locations of injection into people. And much, much worse, there are no background checks and personal reliability checks on the people doing the injections.

I believe all of the problems we are seeing with the "Vaccine Deaths", are from "Hate-filled Progressive Activists" who have contaminate some vials of the vaccine with various toxins, and when they check a LIST of Names, if you're a Register Republican, or you just look like a "deplorable"(older straight white male), they murder you.  

Its not the vaccine that's the problem, it is the violent, intolerant, Progressives.

Top hospital exec fired after saying Trump supporters with COVID-19 should give up ventilators and die - TheBlaze

Now, one important thing many people miss about that story... it was a TEACHING Hospital!  Where the Nurses come from!

20170222_thisiswar.jpg

BlameGame01.jpg

AllIWantForXmasIsGenocide.jpg

https://www.bizpacreview.com/2021/05...venge-1081771/

I think the Vaccine as it is released if the factory is probably fine.  Its what happens to it after, and the people given access to it, that is the problem.

America is in the middle of a violent civil-war, and you'd be a fool to accept medicine from the hate-filled enemy!

-

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BooBoo (07-16-2021),East of the Beast (07-16-2021)

----------


## MrMike

I will give my experience with the vaccine and some other items I have not shared before.  I had to agree to take the shot as part of my job (I have to go to countries that won't allow me to enter without it).

Also, for background > I personally had zero intention to get the vaccine because:

*[ONE]* I don't feel comfortable with medical products that are rushed to market and especially when the product can engage your entire bodies ecosystem.  I just don't think that's ever a good idea.

*[TWO]* I've been to China and was all over the country on local airlines there and about 60 miles from Wuhan at one point (I was in China Jan 2020 and returned at the end of the month right before Trump closed flights from China).  I never caught anything but upon my return was registered via customs and immigration clearance and connected to the CDC. From that point on, I was checked many times by the CDC assigned medical group here in Texas after I came back.  They took blood multiple times, samples of urine, my hair, and tested me every two weeks for three months.  Result, no scientific idea why I didn't catch Covid when 90+% of people I was with in China with got it.  A couple of things that stood out (they documented).   I don't get the flu (never had it in my life even though I had to take care of everyone in my family that got it over the years).  The other is I'm OCD about being clean (hand washing, etc.) and pretty much have been that way as an adult. So that was their last assumption (that I know of).  Personally, I think growing up eating dirt and boogers as a kid probably built up my immune system (I'm not kidding).



Okay, on the vaccine experience (Pfizer two dose version):

1) First shot (nothing), not even arm location soreness.  Had to wait two weeks for next one.
2) Second shot (nothing), not even arm soreness.  I think hey, no biggie.  Day after shot...9pm-ish that evening, the walls fall down.  

So, the evening after the second shot, I became unsteady and shaky, lost my ability to function (walking hard), fever went over 103, had a delerium type thing going on.  Lasted hard like that from that evening until around 7 or 8 the next morning when I started to regain myself.  At one point (the peak), I felt like I was going to die and could not raise myself out of bed. No joke.

So my advice (to my kids) was none of them will take it.  My daughter was with me so saw how it hit (it was immediate change, no ramp up, I was okay, then BOOM).

I've had many shots, vaccines, you name it (including the multi-shot gun in miltary with a cocktail of things).  Never had a reaction to anything before.  But this vaccine almost killed me and I'm quite healthy.

So..... I know others have taken it with zero issues and everyone is different.  But for me, it was awful and truthfully, I likely never needed to take it due to my own immune system being strong.

That's it...

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021),Canadianeye (07-16-2021),East of the Beast (07-16-2021),Jen (07-16-2021),potlatch (07-16-2021)

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## Ginger

> My wife is in far, far worse shape, I doubt she will survive more than a month. -


o d_e_ar God, why? this is terrible! I don't m_e_an to pry so  you don't have to t_e_ll

----------

12icer (07-19-2021),BooBoo (07-16-2021)

----------


## Traddles

> Originally Posted by Traddles View Post
> blood clots do go away - whether dissolved, eaten by the immune system, or whatever.
> 			
> 		
> 
> unless they don't and you get a fatal heart attack or embolism or stroke.


*Next time be honest enough to quote me in context!* Here is my full sentence with what you omitted highlighted:




> *As anyone who has recovered from a stroke or has a close relative or friend who has recovered from a stroke would know,* blood clots do go away - whether dissolved, eaten by the immune system, or whatever.

----------

BooBoo (07-16-2021)

----------


## Ginger

h_e_y man, you'r_e_ the expert, whatever you say is fin_e_

in a pig's eye

----------

BooBoo (07-18-2021)

----------


## Jen

> I will give my experience with the vaccine and some other items I have not shared before.  I had to agree to take the shot as part of my job (I have to go to countries that won't allow me to enter without it).
> 
> Also, for background > I personally had zero intention to get the vaccine because:
> 
> *[ONE]* I don't feel comfortable with medical products that are rushed to market and especially when the product can engage your entire bodies ecosystem.  I just don't think that's ever a good idea.
> 
> *[TWO]* I've been to China and was all over the country on local airlines there and about 60 miles from Wuhan at one point (I was in China Jan 2020 and returned at the end of the month right before Trump closed flights from China).  I never caught anything but upon my return was registered via customs and immigration clearance and connected to the CDC. From that point on, I was checked many times by the CDC assigned medical group here in Texas after I came back.  They took blood multiple times, samples of urine, my hair, and tested me every two weeks for three months.  Result, no scientific idea why I didn't catch Covid when 90+% of people I was with in China with got it.  A couple of things that stood out (they documented).   I don't get the flu (never had it in my life even though I had to take care of everyone in my family that got it over the years).  The other is I'm OCD about being clean (hand washing, etc.) and pretty much have been that way as an adult. So that was their last assumption (that I know of).  Personally, I think growing up eating dirt and boogers as a kid probably built up my immune system (I'm not kidding).
> 
> 
> ...


Well.  I'm in trouble.  I don't think I ever EVER ate a booger.    But I played in the dirt for years and I'm sure I ate that more than a few times.  

It is good (I guess) that you were the test subject for your family so that they would avoid it.  I am not near my kids and though I sent them warning material, for various reasons ( all work related) 3 of the 4 have taken the covid shots.  One had had covid already (almost symptom free)... and still had to take the vax.

My immune system is good.  I had some sort of virus in January of 2000.  And I may have had covid in January of 2020.  The only symptom was 3 days where I was so tired I thought I was going to die.  

Everyone is different. Nobody can predict whether or not they will have a strong reaction.  So... I am not going to take it unless forced.  My husband hasn't taken it and he has had a work-related travel thing this week........and nobody asked so he didn't tell.  We hope to avoid it.

----------

12icer (07-19-2021),BooBoo (07-18-2021),MrMike (07-16-2021)

----------


## Ginger

girls pick their noses, fart, scratch and get bad breath


but 

they 

do 

not

eat

boogers

----------

BooBoo (07-18-2021),Brat (07-18-2021),MrMike (07-16-2021)

----------


## Ginger

45 Year Old John Hopkins Hospital Employee Dies After Reaction To Mandatory Covid Shot


theempoweror.com

----------

BooBoo (07-18-2021),Brat (07-18-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> 45 Year Old John Hopkins Hospital Employee Dies After Reaction To Mandatory Covid Shot
> 
> 
> theempoweror.com



Right .But as we've pointed out before, these are the exception, not the rule. There's 3 Billion people across the planet, 45%, have been jabbed, do you see 3 billlion bodies piled up all round the planet?

No ofc you dont. what you do see is an average, if not slightly lower adverse reaction rate to the jab.  No worse than any other jab or any other medication, because no medication is compatible for 100% of the population.

What I see is this

Infected 190,351,371
Deaths:  4,093,043
Recovered:  173,545,272

2% death rate. Same as for Influenza.

and as far as i can determine, the rate of adverse reaction to all vaccines across all vaccinated is 10%.  So in 3 billion vaccinated, thats likely to be 300 million people . Its a big number, but its still only 10% of 3 billion

So i dont get why people here keep posting stories of vaccinated people dying or having adverse reactions. We know they do, we expect some of them to, it doesnt prove anything. And based on the average rates of adverse reactions,  the Covid vaccines are no different to any other medication.  


The adverse reaction rate to Aspirin is 30%, and it can cause blood clots. Why aren't you screaming bout having aspirin banned?

----------

Neo (07-17-2021)

----------


## CWF

Since I am not a medical expert I won't weigh in on shot taking.  However, I do find it interesting that the medical profession work is known as 'practicing', just like lawyers do.

The China virus was manufactured in a lab in Wuhan.  Never been there but this is what is reported.  If that is true (and I have no reason to believe that it isn't) then it was made for a purpose.  It was then released.  Damn. What an accident that was, huh?

People start getting sick, many die as a result, and the effect is a world wide pandemic that results in a hurry up shot in the arm said to protect you from getting it. 

The point is this.  There is a strong connection between the facts of the China Virus being manufactured, then released, then the development of a vaccine, and then the attempt to make the vaccine mandatory for all living people to get-her-done.  The real question is why did all this occur?

If anyone truly believes that this is all accidental, that it is innocent, that it is just a big WHOOPS, look at this will ya, then I have a serious reason to doubt that your mind is not clouded to the point of blindness, and if enough people are affected with this malady of the mind known as a severe case of the Stupids, then there is no hope for humanity or a continuation of America.

No, I did not get the shot, I will not get the shot, and I am old.   

I don't think I am stupid.  Maybe some of you do, but that is up to you.

----------

BooBoo (07-18-2021),Brat (07-18-2021)

----------


## Traddles

> h_e_y man, you'r_e_ the expert, whatever you say is fin_e_
> 
> in a pig's eye


  @Ginger, so, from zero interactions to ad hominem attack,  :Smiley ROFLMAO:  . Is attacking people who post things you dislike one of the duties of being an Admin? Great way to encourage discussion! Anyway, good to see you ... long time no see.

Similar to my response several days ago in which I pointed out that I have never claimed to be especially intelligent, you can search every post I've made here since January, 2020, but you won't find one where I claim to be an expert. So even your ad hominem was a straw man,  :Smiley ROFLMAO:  .

----------


## Ginger

I broke no rul_es_

mild insult and snark are allowed

you whin_e_ like a little girl

man up

----------

BooBoo (07-18-2021)

----------


## Authentic

> I broke no rul_es_
> 
> mild insult and snark are allowed
> 
> you whin_e_ like a little girl
> 
> man up


That's transphobic!

----------


## Authentic

> Right .But as we've pointed out before, these are the exception, not the rule. There's 3 Billion people across the planet, 45%, have been jabbed, do you see 3 billlion bodies piled up all round the planet?
> 
> No ofc you dont. what you do see is an average, if not slightly lower adverse reaction rate to the jab.  No worse than any other jab or any other medication, because no medication is compatible for 100% of the population.
> 
> What I see is this
> 
> Infected 190,351,371
> Deaths:  4,093,043
> Recovered:  173,545,272
> ...


If you were going to create a biological weapon, you would not design it to noticeably kill a lot of people unless you could make one that killed a large segment of your target population rapidly.

Don't you understand that a healthy 45 year old  who works at one of the premier medical institutions on the planet dying after getting the jab is alarming?

I used to debate people who told  that Chicago was _statistically_ a relatively safe city. I told them that their statistics must be of great comfort to the families of the 500 people who were killed by gunshot there in the prior year. 

This was in 2013.

----------

BooBoo (07-18-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> Don't you understand that a healthy 45 year old  who works at one of the premier medical institutions on the planet dying after getting the jab is alarming?
> 
> 
> This was in 2013.



NO!! Because theres NO PROVEN LINK!! All there is is idiots like you posting conspiracy theories!! Dont YOU understand that when you give FOUR BILLION PEOPLE a new med, then 2% adverse effects IS NOT UNUSUAL, and in fact  most meds have an adverse reaction rate - even Penicillin . Aspirin has 30% adverse effect rate, and its been round 125 years!! . Why arent you screaming to get aspirin banned and claiming its a bioweapon?

Show me the peer reviewed scientific paper, from a respectable professional journal, eg the Bulletin of the  World Society for Virology,  that shows a proven link.

----------


## Authentic

Those same people blamed Chicago gun violence on guns coming in from Indiana rather than the shooters. Neither of us mentioned that the shooters and victims were largely black. Tiptoeing around the issues was a hallmark of the Obama years.

----------


## Authentic

> NO!! Because theres NO PROVEN LINK!! All there is is idiots like you posting conspiracy theories!! Dont YOU understand that when you give FOUR BILLION PEOPLE a new med, then 2% adverse effects IS NOT UNUSUAL, and in fact  most meds have an adverse reaction rate - even Penicillin . Aspirin has 30% adverse effect rate, and its been round 125 years!! . Why arent you screaming to get aspirin banned and claiming its a bioweapon?


Is there a big push by heads of state to get everyone to take aspirin? Can I be kept from traveling to Europe if I don't take aspirin? Has the planet been shut down for 1 1/2 years because people get headaches?

You are comparing Barcelona to Derby County, guv'ner.

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> Right .But as we've pointed out before, these are the exception, not the rule. There's 3 Billion people across the planet, 45%, have been jabbed, do you see 3 billlion bodies piled up all round the planet?
> 
> No ofc you dont. what you do see is an average, if not slightly lower adverse reaction rate to the jab.  No worse than any other jab or any other medication, because no medication is compatible for 100% of the population.
> 
> What I see is this
> 
> Infected 190,351,371
> Deaths:  4,093,043
> Recovered:  173,545,272
> ...


They fought so hard against those who feared Covid that they themselves became the most frightened people that I have witnessed in my entire life.  Once again, my least favorite philosopher is right.




> "Beware that, when fighting monsters, you yourself do not become a monster... for when you gaze long into the abyss. The abyss gazes also into you.". ― Friedrich W. Nietzsche

----------

BooBoo (07-18-2021)

----------


## BooBoo

*RESIDENT EVIL*2004
  |               Action
,              Horror



Something  rotten is brewing beneath the industrial mecca known as Raccoon City.  Unknown to its millions of residents, a huge underground bioengineering  facility known as The Hive has accidentally unleashed the deadly and  mutating T-virus, killing all of its employees. To contain the leak, the  governing supercomputer, Red Queen, has sealed all entrances and exits.   Now a team of highly-trained super commandos including Rain (Michelle  Rodriguez - The Fast and the Furious, Girlfight), Alice (Milla Jovovich -  The Fifth Element) and Matt (Eric Mabius - Cruel Intentions) must race  to penetrate The Hive in order to isolate the T-virus before it  overwhelms humanity. To do so, they must get past the Red Queen's deadly  defenses, face the flesh-eating undead employees, fight killer mutant  dogs and battle The Licker, a genetically mutated savage beast whose  strength increases with each of its slain victims.

RESIDENT EVIL | Sony Pictures Entertainment

----------


## BooBoo



----------


## CWF

It is remarkably questionable to me, a least, that a Virology Lab, located in Wuhan, China is interested and purposed to ONLY study viruses in the attempt to protect the public from disease, sickness, and death?   And when the opposite result comes about from this noble scientific effort, any attempt to investigate the Lab and personnel who work there is denied by the Chinese Government? 

So, let us all trot along in line, take our little shot, and shut the hell up.  Wonderful, honest, integrity filled honorable people are telling us what to do. People such as Fauci, Biden, and such are there only to protect us from harm.  Right?

I was in a public bathroom when I was a kid, and reading what was written on the walls.  One note in particular struck me and I never forgot it.  It said, "F-ck all you wall writers."

In a way that comes close to summing up how I feel about those claiming to be looking out for others.

I'll make my own decisions.  Biden is a coward, a blowhard, and so too are the judges in our courts.  The link?  Biden is in the White House, playing pwesident.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## Northern Rivers

This was all planned. Donald Trump's perfectly right...make China pay. They killed more Americans than were killed in our Civil War.


 :Angry20:

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> This was all planned. Donald Trump's perfectly right...make China pay. They killed more Americans than were killed in our Civil War.


Well it was and it wasnt.


Im pretty sure Wuhan was working on bioweapons tech, paid for by the US government . That can be proven.


But i dont think the release was planned, or if it was planned it was supposed to happen in the future.  I happened because of the shite biosecurity of the lab, there were previous incidents of biological escape because they are incompetent


Then once released by accident, the Chinese government knew exactly what it was that was released, so  the thought "well its out now, lets spread it about and see how effective it is". Notice they shut down all internal flights and locked Wuhan down, but let all the infected foreigners fly home to spread it around the planet.

----------

Northern Rivers (07-30-2021),Oceander (07-19-2021)

----------


## Captain Kirk!



----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> 


Nonsense.

----------


## UKSmartypants

UK Data

The Defence rests.

----------

Oceander (07-19-2021)

----------


## Canadianeye

If I take the first S from yellow graph, and then the next o in the _very same graph_ and follow a very similar pattern on the _red_ graph, with the F, a and r...I come up with the truth of those stats.

So Far.

Q - reporting live...from TPF!

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> If I take the first S from yellow graph, and then the next o in the _very same graph_ and follow a very similar pattern on the _red_ graph, with the F, a and r...I come up with the truth of those stats.
> 
> So Far.
> 
> Q - reporting live...from TPF!



Yes that right, the left hand graph shows the number of cases  in both waves, and the right hand graph shows the number of deaths in both waves. 

Dec cases and dec deaths follow the same curve, more cases, more deaths.

Jan cases is climbing in an exponential a curve, but jan deaths are flat line. The number of deaths no longer follows the number of cases.

In other words, the vaccine is preventing people from dying.  


Understand it now?

----------

FlameHeart (08-06-2021),Oceander (07-19-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> Yes that right, the left hand graph shows the number of cases  in both waves, and the right hand graph shows the number of deaths in both waves. 
> 
> Dec cases and dec deaths follow the same curve, more cases, more deaths.
> 
> Jan cases is climbing in an exponential a curve, but jan deaths are flat line. The number of deaths no longer follows the number of cases.
> 
> In other words, the vaccine is preventing people from dying.  
> 
> 
> Understand it now?


Yes but what about the extra arms they and their progeny will grow for the next 10 generations?

Where's that in your graph smartypants ?

----------

BooBoo (07-20-2021),Oceander (07-19-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> Yes but what about the extra arms they and their progeny will grow for the next 10 generations?
> 
> Where's that in your graph smartypants ?



well as there no evidence of that, it doesnt feature. But you already knew that.

Thanks for wasting my time having to answer a brainless post.

----------


## Oceander

> Yes that right, the left hand graph shows the number of cases  in both waves, and the right hand graph shows the number of deaths in both waves. 
> 
> Dec cases and dec deaths follow the same curve, more cases, more deaths.
> 
> Jan cases is climbing in an exponential a curve, but jan deaths are flat line. The number of deaths no longer follows the number of cases.
> 
> In other words, the vaccine is preventing people from dying.  
> 
> 
> Understand it now?


That, or substantially all of those who were destined to die from COVID-19 caught it, and died, during the first wave, and so now the left-overs are those who, if they get it, will not die from it.

----------


## Canadianeye

> That, or substantially all of those who were destined to die from COVID-19 caught it, and died, during the first wave, and so now the left-overs are those who, if they get it, will not die from it.


So far.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

> Yes that right, the left hand graph shows the number of cases  in both waves, and the right hand graph shows the number of deaths in both waves. 
> 
> Dec cases and dec deaths follow the same curve, more cases, more deaths.
> 
> Jan cases is climbing in an exponential a curve, but jan deaths are flat line. The number of deaths no longer follows the number of cases.
> 
> In other words, the vaccine is preventing people from dying.  
> 
> 
> Understand it now?


No.  

Statistical concurrents of separate events, is not correlation or causation.

People who eat rice...die.  Not right away, but eventually.

That doesn't mean rice is killing them.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## 12icer

> UK Data
> 
> The Defence rests.


Not really enough information to even begin to build the graph. I have to take exception to the entire premise. There are many possibilities for a fluctuation in the death rate. Areas of infection, treatment advancement, temperature, weather conditions, activity changes, interaction density changes and preventive medical measures. So, sorry I will say that there will be another infection spike EVEN IN FULLY VACCINATED PERSONS when the weather changes to a cooler mean temperature again and the air density increases.

----------

BooBoo (07-20-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> Not really enough information to even begin to build the graph. I have to take exception to the entire premise. There are many possibilities for a fluctuation in the death rate. Areas of infection, treatment advancement, temperature, weather conditions, activity changes, interaction density changes and preventive medical measures. So, sorry I will say that there will be another infection spike EVEN IN FULLY VACCINATED PERSONS when the weather changes to a cooler mean temperature again and the air density increases.



bollox. Theres plenty of information used to build that graph and the lines speak for themselves. and yes there will be another wave  - of the unvaccinated. Bot not of those immune by natural means or vaccine,  but then you have no grasp of how immunity works, so this is a pointless conversation now.

Im actually sick of this now, it's banging ones  up against a brick wall, im appalled by how stupid some of you people are.  You can't teach astrophysics to the Village idiot.

----------

FlameHeart (08-06-2021),Oceander (07-21-2021)

----------


## Authentic

> bollox. Theres plenty of information used to build that graph and the lines speak for themselves. and yes there will be another wave  - of the unvaccinated. Bot not of those immune by natural means or vaccine,  but then you have no grasp of how immunity works, so this is a pointless conversation now.
> 
> Im actually sick of this now, it's banging ones  up against a brick wall, im appalled by how stupid some of you people are.  You can't teach astrophysics to the Village idiot.


We are not talking astrophysics, but immunology. I wouldn't expect a British bloke to understand the difference.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## BooBoo

> bollox. Theres plenty of information used to build that graph and the lines speak for themselves. and yes there will be another wave  - of the unvaccinated. Bot not of those immune by natural means or vaccine,  but then you have no grasp of how immunity works, so this is a pointless conversation now.
> 
> Im actually sick of this now, it's banging ones  up against a brick wall, im appalled by how stupid some of you people are.  You can't teach astrophysics to the Village idiot.



Just Another 


> I am an expert. You are not.

----------


## Trinnity

If Mr.V was an expert, he wouldn't call me names and run for the hills;
 he'd be here defending his intellectual positions. He's an odd duck.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021),Foghorn (07-29-2021)

----------


## Ginger

_w_here's Jenny McCarthy on this?

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021),Foghorn (07-29-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021),MrMike (07-21-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

Where can I get one of those?

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021),MrMike (07-21-2021),QuaseMarco (07-21-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## Hillofbeans

am saddened, surprised, and disappointed with anti vaxers here

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## ruthless terrier

piglets!!.jpg
pigs!!.jpg

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## MrMike

> am saddened, surprised, and disappointed with anti vaxers here


*Correction:*  Anti-covidvaxers

Most people accept other proven vaccines over their lifetimes.  They're just not comfortable with that one.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021),Foghorn (07-29-2021),JustPassinThru (08-02-2021)

----------


## Foghorn

> *Correction:*  Anti-covidvaxers
> 
> Most people accept other proven vaccines over their lifetimes.  They're just not comfortable with that one.


It's an excellent point.

For the lazy, however, it is easier to just lump them in all together.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## Foghorn

Patient #1, Tom, was infected with COVID last year but his body fought it off naturally.  To me, that means his body fought it off naturally.  But not to the cult.  They see Tom as totally unprotected from the virus and a menace to society.

Patient #2, Lucy, got both shots earlier this year but then contracted COVID months later.  To me, that means Lucy could infect others.  To the cult that means Lucy cannot infect others.

Patient #3, Juan, wandered over the border and was never tested nor quarantined.  To me, Juan should have been tested just like they do with incoming flights from overseas.  To the cult, Juan is free and clear and needs a taxpayer funded lift to Minneapolis.

At this stage we're beyond science, beyond truth and beyond logic.  What we need is a group of psychoanalysts that specialize in cults.

----------

Authentic (07-29-2021),BooBoo (07-29-2021),MrMike (07-29-2021)

----------


## RET423

The original creator of the method used in all 3 vaccines is Robert Malone, he has been erased from wikipedia, all his videos removed from YouTube and his name cleansed from all of the research as a result of what he is saying about these vaccines.

He is the second guest on this episode of Warroom, I encourage everyone to listen to what he is saying; especially if you have kids and are thinking about getting them vaccinated to please their school.

Episode 1,129 â Are Vaccines Causing Mutations? (w/ Naomi Wolf, Dr. Robert Malone, Col. John Mills, Rachel Hamm, Melissa Huray)

----------

BooBoo (07-29-2021),Foghorn (07-30-2021),QuaseMarco (07-30-2021)

----------


## MrMike

Interesting... (see below)

----------

BooBoo (07-29-2021),phoenyx (07-29-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> Interesting... (see below)


That's in line with an article on Covid cases in the UK published on Tuesday on Mercola.com. I've made a thread about it here:
Signs of COVID Injection Failure Mount | Mercola.com

----------

BooBoo (07-29-2021)

----------


## MrMike

> That's in line with an article on Covid cases in the UK published on Tuesday on Mercola.com. I've made a thread about it here:
> Signs of COVID Injection Failure Mount | Mercola.com



Agreed.  The UK stats on vaccinated infections/deaths vs unvaccinated proves the point.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## Authentic

> No.  
> 
> Statistical concurrents of separate events, is not correlation or causation.
> 
> People who eat rice...die.  Not right away, but eventually.
> 
> That doesn't mean rice is killing them.


People who live, ultimately die.

----------


## phoenyx

> Agreed.  The UK stats on vaccinated infections/deaths vs unvaccinated proves the point.


Interesting numbers. It would seem that if you are over 50 years old, you are more than twice as likely to die from this Covid 19 Delta Variant if you've been vaccinated than if you haven't been.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## RET423

> Interesting numbers. It would seem that if you are over 50 years old, you are more than twice as likely to die from this Covid 19 Delta Variant if you've been vaccinated than if you haven't been.


The vaccination created the delta variant, its called "antibody dependent mutation" I think; those with natural immunity from beating the virus are fine at any age basically.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021),Foghorn (07-30-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021),phoenyx (07-30-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> The vaccination created the delta variant, its called "antibody dependent mutation" I think; those with natural immunity from beating the virus are fine at any age basically.


I wouldn't be surprised, though I haven't seen any articles claiming that as of yet.

----------


## phoenyx

> 


Definitely, some real shady stuff governments are doing in regards to Covid 19.

----------


## phoenyx

> 


Scary stuff :-/.

I went to the tinyurl.com link they had there, it goes to this page which has more information:
4,250% Increase in Fetal Deaths Reported to VAERS After Flu Shot Given to Pregnant Women  VacTruth.com

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## RET423

> I wouldn't be surprised, though I haven't seen any articles claiming that as of yet.


Yeah, I was going to wait to bring that up until after I had studied the phenomenon a bit more, it's always easier to describe something when I feel like I get the basics; but I do think this is really important stuff right now.

WARNING: This is a layman's explanation of something I am unqualified to explain.

Apparently Dr. Malone is the scientist who created the mRNA method of vaccination technique, he developed it specifically to deal with fears that viruses emanating from animals that mutate enough to infect humans (Covid type) are the single most deadly threat to humans; he wanted to finally find a way to deal with viruses of the Corona type.

mRNA is a way of altering a DNA strand to add the information needed to combat the flu, if successful the person with this edit becomes genetically resistant to the effects of the virus (much like the animals that carry these viruses) 

This is different from most flu vaccines in that most are simply the synthetic antibodies created from the natural antibodies of people who have contracted and recovered from the virus; these work but they have a lifespan that is limited to a few months. 

According to Dr Malone (I hope I am not butchering this too much) when the mRNA gene therapy was applied to Covid type viruses there was a consistent problem that kept occurring, instead of using the new "map" to create antibodies that would destroy the Covid virus; the Covid virus would instead mutate and become dependent upon the antibodies that the modified genetics were creating. 

He called this the worst possible scenario because the mutated Covid virus was nearly impossible to stop in a body where that gene therapy had been performed; the Delta variant is (in Dr. Malone's opinion) an example of that phenomenon. 

His basis for believing this is two fold:

Firstly, this happened every time he tried the mRNA gene therapy technique with a Covid virus. 

Secondly, there is a "T-stat" (that maybe the wrong term) that was measured in people (by the CDC) who had contracted the Delta Variant of Covid-19; those who had been vaccinated had a higher measurement than those who had not been vaccinated; this is apparently a telltale that the Delta variant has become "antibody dependent" in those who had the vaccine. 

I have heard 2 reports that conflict on the 3 vaccines that are available, one report said all 3 used the mRNA technique and the other said only 2 (Pfizer and Moderna) used mRNA whjle the other is a traditional flu type vaccination; I am not certain which report is correct. 

All 3 vaccines are charged with the synthetic antibodies created from natural antibodies in people who have recovered from Covid and those work well until they dissipate (a few months); by then the new genetic information is supposed to become the watchdog and make its own defense. 

It is the gene therapy that is failing to perform, necessitating booster shots for those without a natural immunity gleaned from catching and recovering from Covid-19. Those with a natural immunity have little to no issues with the Delta variant. 

If Dr Malone has interpreted the data correctly (and I believe he has in spite of my clumsily formed layman's summary) then people need to know that it's not just a "no harm no foul" decision when it comes to taking "the shot", it has frightening risks that only those with serious co-morbidities should risk; everyone else should just catch and beat the virus naturally and leave their genetic code alone.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021),Canadianeye (07-30-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> I wouldn't be surprised, though I haven't seen any articles claiming that as of yet.


The virus doesn't know or care if it's doing damage, it just wants to reproduce.

Antibody dependent mutation is just a fancy way of saying evolutionary niche.

Any time you change the biological conditions of the virus's environment, you're altering its niche.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> Yeah, I was going to wait to bring that up until after I had studied the phenomenon a bit more, it's always easier to describe something when I feel like I get the basics; but I do think this is really important stuff right now.
> 
> WARNING: This is a layman's explanation of something I am unqualified to explain.
> 
> Apparently Dr. Malone is the scientist who created the mRNA method of vaccination technique, he developed it specifically to deal with fears that viruses emanating from animals that mutate enough to infect humans (Covid type) are the single most deadly threat to humans; he wanted to finally find a way to deal with viruses of the Corona type.
> 
> mRNA is a way of altering a DNA strand to add the information needed to combat the flu, if successful the person with this edit becomes genetically resistant to the effects of the virus (much like the animals that carry these viruses) 
> 
> This is different from most flu vaccines in that most are simply the synthetic antibodies created from the natural antibodies of people who have contracted and recovered from the virus; these work but they have a lifespan that is limited to a few months. 
> ...


Well, part of what he is saying actually concords with what another Dr. Jack Stockwell wrote in a book titled "How Vaccines Wreck Human Immunity: A Forbidden Doctor Publication", as well as writings by immunologist Tetyana Obukhanych, who wrote The Vaccine Illusion. Both books are available on Amazon.com, in both physical and kindle versions. Specifically, they both bring up evidence that vaccines don't do nearly as good a job at protecting someone from a pathogen as natural immunity does. Dr. Stockwell goes further than Tetyana, however, in that he provides evidence that not only do vaccines not provide the type of immunity that natural immunity provides, but there is actually evidence that they mess up our immune systems by their unnatural way of introducing pathogenic material. For him to do this requires a bit of work, however, as he first gets into the different types of immune systems. Interestingly, he brings up one type of immunity that is seldom mentioned in mainstream sources, infant immunity. That being said, the other 2 types of immunity are generally covered in mainstream sources, innate and acquired immunity. Innate immunity are parts of the immune system that are around from the beginning, such as phogocytes and Natural Killer cells.


The there's the final type of immunity, acquired or humoral immunity. This is the type of immunity that can be triggered if the body is exposed to foreign pathogens, whether acquired via the air or food or bloodstream. The body is most adept at dealing with pathogens if they come in via the airways or food. Not so much if entering from the bloodstream, but they are of course not defenceless there or injection based vaccines would have no way of affecting the immune system.

The author then gets into how there are 2 main types of cells in the acquired immune system, T Cells and B Cells. He makes a case that for one to gain acquired immunity naturally, first the T Cells have to come into action and only afterwards do the B cells, aka antibodies, come into play. He likens T Cells to the army and B Cells to the CIA. He believes that vaccines put the cart before the horse- they stimulate B cell/antibody production without getting the T Cells into things. Personally, I suspect it's a little more complicated. Why wouldn't T cells try to get rid of the foreign material in vaccines? But regardless, the next part of what he says makes sense:
**
*So since a vaccine only has a dead virus involved, which would not trigger a T Cell reaction, it was necessary to shock the system with chemical additives, called adjuvants, to force the body to mount a B Cell, humoral, antibody formation. These adjuvants, also known as excipients, are: mercury, aluminum, formaldehyde, etc. Mercury, being the most naturally occurring neurotoxic substance known to man, one would wonder why you would ever inject mercury into a living human being. You have been told it is a preservative. This is like calling cyanide a preservative! Deadly poisons do not preserve, but they do have another function in smaller dosages. They literally shock the nervous system into reacting to the dead, or almost dead virus by producing antibodies.So when they tell you they have taken out the mercury, they have only upped the content of aluminum and/or formaldehyde, and or polysorbate 40, etc., all of which are neurotoxic! So you are no safer. The vaccines are NOT “green.” That’s why vaccine makers laugh when people demand safer vaccines. That is the very purpose of the mercury or other adjuvants, to create a neural shock to the immune system! Without this chemical force the immune system would not recognize the dead or attenuated virus. So that is quite different than referring to mercury as a preservative.

This obviously is not how the body was designed to operate, however, there is no other way around it! Since we have been on this planet the immune system couldn’t care less about a dead virus, so the violent neurotoxic chemicals were put into the vaccine cocktail to force the body to recognize it. Can there be an action without a reaction? No. “Every action has an opposite and equal reaction” according to Sir Isaac Newton.
So what might the opposite reaction be to shocking the immune system with an adjuvant such as, aluminum, mercury, formaldehyde, etc.? How about antibodies? How about lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of antibodies, from lots and lots and lots and lots of vaccines? Just what are those antibodies going to do with no virus to attack? Thus the autoimmune disease explosion, where all these unnaturally formed antibodies attack you.So since the 1940’s, if you do this enough, to enough people, to enough kids, over and over, you will get a suppressed T Cell mediated response and a heightened B Cell humoral response. The whole order gets upside down. Why?? Because that was the intention! The very goal! To bypass the “sick” part, and give us an unnatural immunity to virus’. So what happens is this: Cell mediated immunity - T Cells, go on vacation. And the humoral immunity - B Cells, go through the ceiling!

Make a list of diseases that we are seeing all the time now without a T Cell mediated response (the “sick” part of disease)…they just happen spontaneously…asthma, allergies, eczema, Crohn’s, colitis, MS, Parkinson’s, Sjogren’s, Hashimoto’s, and more. These diseases are all marked by increased autoantibody production production without cell mediation. This is what an autoimmune disease is.

All these diseases come on suddenly in some cases, in others, over a while, with slow onset of symptoms but there never is any sickness that proceeds it. The diseases we are always hearing about in the news now did not start with fever, vomiting, diarrhea, headaches, body aches and rashes. These diseases were diagnosed by the presence of autoantibodies in the blood stream. An autoantibody is where you have an antibody attacking you, yourself - not some microbe!

This was absolutely unheard of prior to WWII! And now even the Debakey Institute in Houston, Texas, the developers of the heart bypass operation, says that ALL heart disease is all autoimmune. This is also the largest area of current medical research, with over 80 identified autoimmune diseases in the human body. How did something virtually unknown - autoimmune diseases - before 1940 become the #1 debilitating disease process today?*
Screen Shot 2021-07-30 at 4.30.55 PM.png


**
Source:
Stockwell CGP, Dr. Jack; Stockwell CGP, Mary. How Vaccines Wreck Human Immunity: A Forbidden Doctor Publication (1) . Dr. Jack and Mary Stockwell, CGP. Kindle Edition.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021),Canadianeye (07-30-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> The virus doesn't know or care if it's doing damage, it just wants to reproduce.
> 
> Antibody dependent mutation is just a fancy way of saying evolutionary niche.
> 
> Any time you change the biological conditions of the virus's environment, you're altering its niche.


Have you heard of the theory that viruses are actually exosomes? I'm still not completely sure if it's true, or perhaps only partially true (as in, some viruses are exosomes while others really viruses), but the more I've thought about it, the more I've come to lean on the idea that all viruses are in fact exosomes. There's an article I've found that has a good video in it that explains this theory here:
What Science Calls Viruses May Really Be Exosomes  Great Mountain Publishing

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> Have you heard of the theory that viruses are actually exosomes? I'm still not completely sure if it's true, or perhaps only partially true (as in, some viruses are exosomes while others really viruses), but the more I've thought about it, the more I've come to lean on the idea that all viruses are in fact exosomes. There's an article I've found that has a good video in it that explains this theory here:
> What Science Calls Viruses May Really Be Exosomes  Great Mountain Publishing


"Exosome" is a pretty meaningless term, scientifically. It's like saying "car" when we're talking about a Ford F-150.

Earlier I mentioned that the Covid spike protein causes membrane fusion. A membrane is a lipid bilayer, with the oily parts on the inside and the watery parts on the outside of both the inner and outer sides, so the physics says if you want to fuse you have to break the bilayer first.

----------

BooBoo (07-30-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> .
> 
> Apparently Dr. Malone is the scientist who created the mRNA method of vaccination technique, .


*NO HE DIDNT!*

And I made a thread about who really invented it, about two months ago

Here's an entire website that confirms my post from two months go - The story of mRNA: From a loose idea to a tool that may help curb Covid

Malone is an imposter and charlatan.

THIS woman, *Katalin Karikó,* is the person who owns the patents and invented the technique. Malone owns no patents, and invented nothing.  All he does is claim credit for something he isn't entitled to claim credit for, and spreads disinformation to discredit  Katalin.

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

phoenyx (07-31-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> "Exosome" is a pretty meaningless term, scientifically. It's like saying "car" when we're talking about a Ford F-150.


I don't see it that way, primarily because of videos like the following, that suggest that all viruses are actually just exosomes:
Virus Theory vs Exosome Theory


That video is short and to the point, but there are others that go into the theory in more depth, in particular with the Covid 19 virus:
News :: Diseases :: Virus and exosomes

----------


## UKSmartypants

> The vaccination created the delta variant, its called "antibody dependent mutation" I think; those with natural immunity from beating the virus are fine at any age basically.


Utter bollox. Viruses mutate whatever, vaccine or no vaccine, and at different rates depending on the percentage of viable  non immune hosts in a population. You can show no cause and effect that directly connects a mutation with someone being vaccinated. Provide a link to a peer reviewed scientific paper by a qualified recognised virologist that shows as much, or we can assume you are just making it up as you go along, and its fantasy science

Such a load of psuedoscientific babble, fake news, guesswork, conspiracy theory, and just plain unsupported made up bollox being posted in the is thread. But then when you get your scientific information from facebook, its only to be expected......

----------


## RET423

> Utter bollox. Viruses mutate whatever, vaccine or no vaccine, and at different rates depending on the percentage of viable  non immune hosts in a population. You can show no cause and effect that directly connects a mutation with someone being vaccinated. Provide a link to a peer reviewed scientific paper by a qualified recognised virologist that shows as much, or we can assume you are just making it up as you go along, and its fantasy science
> 
> Such a load of psuedoscientific babble, fake news, guesswork, conspiracy theory, and just plain unsupported made up bollox being posted in the is thread. But then when you get your scientific information from facebook, its only to be expected......


You have provided nothing but imbecilic declarations in 2 posts now, if your entire argument is based on who owns a patent then you are just as ignorant about patents as you are about forming a compelling argument.

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12icer (08-06-2021)

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## nonsqtr

> I don't see it that way, primarily because of videos like the following, that suggest that all viruses are actually just exosomes:
> Virus Theory vs Exosome Theory
> 
> 
> That video is short and to the point, but there are others that go into the theory in more depth, in particular with the Covid 19 virus:
> News :: Diseases :: Virus and exosomes


A capsid is something very different from an exosome

----------

FlameHeart (08-06-2021)

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## phoenyx

> A capsid is something very different from an exosome


It looks like it was somewhat more complicated than I initially thought. I just read something by a man named Jeff Green that I think may have figured things out, as it were. He has basically decided to stick with the term virus, but he stresses that they are basically just enzimes produced by the body and not contageous. Below, I quote someone asking him questions and then his response:
**
*Tordenskrald* says:
December 30, 2020 at 4:07 AM
Hey Jeff. I’ve been investigating this subject now for months and I’ve been contacting a lot of specialists and experts to create a discussion that would hopefully change the official narrative eventually, but I think you know how it is. It’s usually a one-sided discussion, as people won’t even think outside their ‘forced’ schoolbooks.
While my theory says there is no such thing as viruses and they are really exosomes, I see you still calling them viruses but say that they are not harmful and contagious which actually won’t make I difference I think.
I was hoping you could help me with some questions if you don’t mind.
‘They’ claim that genetic fragments that they target in an RT-PCR to define in a person are not found to be related to the human genome. They call them ‘alien’ and they say that an exosome(Or true virus) have RNA fragments that can be connected with our human body?
To my understanding, what tells that an RNA fragment is a human- or nonhuman genome, was decided by unknown molecular biologists through advanced coding that no-one knows of? Your thoughts?
The only way to define a virus to really be harmful would be what Koch and River were in about. Isolate and purify, then insert to a living being right?
Of course, doctors call this complete madness invented by conspiracy theorists. We do of course need to add neuro poisons, heavy metals, and aborted fetuses to make it the most normal thing.
They claim that they can just prove this by adding the isolate to gen-modified mice. Or is it only the cells of one? Because a doctor told me that the mouse got the same symptoms as Covid-19, but how can that be?



*Jeff Green* says:
December 30, 2020 at 5:14 AM
I have written about exosomes and viruses, and their differences. There is wide speculation on the exosome theory that, (as far as I know) was driven in large part by people like Andy Kaufman. I spoke with Kaufman on the phone a few months ago and discussed my disagreements with the exosome theory. He was silently in agreement, and could not disagree with my assertions, but I do not expect him to recant or modify his theory publicly. This has resulted in many people taking the easy way out and simply saying viruses do not exist. This is dangerous and not scientifically sound whatsoever. Exosomes are mediators between cells that communicate danger and transport cellular life.
*I write about exosomes here, see issue #1, p.5-6:* https://virusesarenotcontagious.com/...ht-newsletter/
*To address your questions:*
Viruses are non-living enzymes. They are not poisons. I simply use the word ‘virus’ because it is widely understood what I am referring to. With regard to Koch’s Postulates: I address the inadequacies of that theory issue #2 of my newsletter, p.5-7, seen at the above link.
*‘They’ claim that genetic fragments that they target in an RT-PCR to define in a person are not found to be related to the human genome. They call them ‘alien’ and they say that an exosome(Or true virus) have RNA fragments that can be connected with our human body?*Any cell, virus, or bacterium will have been manifested by the body and contained RNA and DNA of that body. DNA and RNA operate on a lock and key system. Foreign proteins, including viruses, do not contain the necessary RNA and DNA to be compatible with your own cells, since all cells in every body are minutely different, and operate only with the permission of other bodily functions and regulators (cytokines, immune cells, T-cells, and so forth). You may find foreign viral protein in the body, say swine tissue from vaccination for swine flu, but this does not indicate swine virus replication. They will of course view this as ‘alien’.
*From my newsletter, see issue #2, p.2-3:*
The ability for the virus to latch on to the cell due to compatibility between RNA and DNA of that particular cell and virus, which will attract viruses to specific cells like velcro—in hindsight, it’s a very intelligent thing that happens.
When a cell creates a virus, it embeds the core of the virus with RNA and DNA ‘keys’, and layers it under a protein surfactant type coating (capsid) made of a gel-like water membrane, which allows the virus (with the help of white blood cells) to dissolve specific tissue by engulfing the matter in the outer coating, and gradually dissolving the matter by disassembling it as an enzyme would break down food.
Remember that viruses are cell expressions. Either way, you cannot then inject that tissue and cause immunity, because the body uses cellular RNA and DNA to communicate their processes in the body—those communication keys are embedded by your cells. Since viruses originating outside your body do not contain your specific RNA and DNA, it is analyzed as nothing but foreign debris with no identification key, thus, no purpose.*I write the following on the purification of viruses here, see issue #2, p.5:*
Viruses cannot be isolated because they are bound with fluids from the body. Viruses may only be partially isolated when ‘grown’ in cell cultures that sustain cellular life, but they are still bound by fluids. They usually use ‘HeLa cell’ lines which are supposed to be ‘immortal cells’, which are really mutated cancer cells that incur false observations of reality, because they do not behave as normal cells would—they are mutations and those cells are partially dead by nature. Without bodily and cellular fluids, viruses would wither. Isolation of cell constituents, like viruses, is practically impossible. A virus cannot be isolated in the sense that it will then exist solely on its own without disrupting the nature of the virus itself. You cannot isolate something like a virus from the rest of its constituents. Perhaps, through purification methods, such as utilizing a centrifuge, they can attempt to isolate a virus, but then a virus will become something entirely different than its organic counterpart—attenuated and altered, purified, etc. It then eventually becomes ‘dead’ tissue, thereby altering its nature.*Concerning the mice:*
Whenever you inject a mice with a vaccine and its tissues, that mice will develop enzymes known as viruses to help it break down those toxins. This is because toxins in vaccines will poison to death living cells in a creature’s body, thus, non-living enzymes must be utilized. The same occurs in humans.
—Jeff

**

Source:
Exosomes vs Viruses  Viruses Are Not Contagious

----------


## patrickt

...mandatory COVID vaccinations.


"Hundreds, including healthcare workers, gathered in Charlotte, North Carolina, on Sunday to protest Atrium Health’s and Novant Health’s recent announcement requiring workers to be vaccinated against the Chinese coronavirus. One registered nurse said she is “not going to be forced to take an experimental vaccine.”

"Atrium Health and Novant Health, two of the biggest healthcare systems in the city, announced last month that all staff will be required to get vaccinated against the Chinese coronavirus.

“With the new Delta variant being far more potent than the original virus, we view it as essential that each of our teammates receive their vaccination to protect themselves, their families and the people in their care,” Atrium said in a press release. The mandate covers the system’s more than 70,000 workers spanning dozens of hospitals and other facilities.

“We view this vaccine no differently than our requirement for our teammates to get an annual flu shot, as well as be vaccinated for measles, chickenpox and other infectious diseases,” it added."
NC Healthcare Workers Protest Vaccine Mandate: I Will Not Take an 


They aren't alone.

"Nearly a third of staffers at Big Apple hospitals are still unvaccinated — more than nine months into the campaign to inoculate medical workers and all New Yorkers against the killer bug, state data reviewed by The Post reveals.

"The figures compiled by the state Health Department also show that nearly 40 percent of hospital staff across three boroughs have either refused or have not received their COVID-19 vaccine.

"The vaccination rate among hospital workers was only 61 percent for those in the Bronx, 62 percent in Brooklyn and 64 percent in Staten Island, state statistics received through July 14 found."Just two-thirds, or 67 percent, of staffers at Queens hospitals have gotten their COVID jabs."
One-third of NY hospital workers are unvaccinated, data shows

Wouldn't you have thought 100% they had 100% compliance in the healthcare industry. Sort of puts the lie to the Democrat--not that anyone needs to put the lie to Democrats--that those are aren't vaccinated are uneducated idiots.


I might have a solution. Eliminate the total immunity given the pharmaceutical companies for developing the vaccine. This might also involve politicians returning the money they've gotten from the pharmaceutical companies.

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donttread (08-03-2021),Esdraelon (08-02-2021),Lone Gunman (08-02-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-02-2021),Rebel Yell (08-02-2021),WarriorRob (08-02-2021)

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## Big Dummy

Selfish, arent they? They have no problem with mandatory vaccinations for the serfs, but when its them, they protest. The Hippocratic oath should be replaced by a hypocrite oath.

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nonsqtr (08-02-2021),WarriorRob (08-02-2021)

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## Dr. Felix Birdbiter

I am not in favor of a blanket requirement for mandatory vaccination.  If you are willing to take the risk and die, well, that's on you isn't it?  However, healthcare workers by definition work with those having a compromised immune system and are much more at risk of contracting and dying from any disease.  Many of those patients are unable to decide for themselves if they wish to be placed in the path of such risk.  I don't give a rats ass if the healthcare worker dies because they refused the vaccination but I don't want her murdering grandma because of her foolishness.

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WarriorRob (08-02-2021)

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## Big Dummy

> I am not in favor of a blanket requirement for mandatory vaccination.  If you are willing to take the risk and die, well, that's on you isn't it?  However, healthcare workers by definition work with those having a compromised immune system and are much more at risk of contracting and dying from any disease.  Many of those patients are unable to decide for themselves if they wish to be placed in the path of such risk.  I don't give a rats ass if the healthcare worker dies because they refused the vaccination but I don't want her murdering grandma because of her foolishness.


If the vaccine makes healthcare workers more susceptible and carrier’s, as the science says, then they are killing those in their care.

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Esdraelon (08-02-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-02-2021),WarriorRob (08-02-2021)

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## patrickt

> I am not in favor of a blanket requirement for mandatory vaccination.  If you are willing to take the risk and die, well, that's on you isn't it?  However, healthcare workers by definition work with those having a compromised immune system and are much more at risk of contracting and dying from any disease.  Many of those patients are unable to decide for themselves if they wish to be placed in the path of such risk.  I don't give a rats ass if the healthcare worker dies because they refused the vaccination but I don't want her murdering grandma because of her foolishness.


Since the vaccinated can transmit the virus the "murdering" of grandma isn't really an issue, is it? And death isn't a risk it's a guaranteed outcome of life.

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WarriorRob (08-02-2021)

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## phoenyx

> Selfish, aren’t they? They have no problem with mandatory vaccinations for the serfs, but when it’s them, they protest. The Hippocratic oath should be replaced by a hypocrite oath.


I don't think that's quite fair. Let's not forget America's Frontline Doctors, who filed a lawsuit try to make an immediate halt of Covid 19 vaccines for some of the population:
Federal Lawsuit Seeks Immediate Halt of COVID Vaccines, Cites Whistleblower Testimony Claiming CDC Is Under-Counting Vaccine Deaths | Children's Health Defense


A quick duckduckgo search found another doctor who has raised concerns as well:
Another prominent scientist speaks against the covid vaccine  The Savage Nation

In summary, there are some intelligent and moral doctors out there, it's just their voices are generally being suppressed. Dr. Mercola's Mercola.com site has posted tons of articles detailing all the ill effects of these vaccines, and he has been vilified for it many times. He just came out with an article today wherein he describes being vilified yet again, this time by the New York Times:
NY Times Names Dr. Mercola Most Influential Superspreader | Mercola.com


Given this, I can understand why health care professionals are reluctant to go on the record expressing concerns about Covid vaccines.

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WarriorRob (08-02-2021)

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## Dr. Felix Birdbiter

> If the vaccine makes healthcare workers more susceptible and carrier’s, as the science says, then they are killing those in their care.



The science doesn't say that.  Fauci says that based on a rejected study from India

----------


## Dr. Felix Birdbiter

> Since the vaccinated can transmit the virus the "murdering" of grandma isn't really an issue, is it? And death isn't a risk it's a guaranteed outcome of life.


There is no proof that the vaccinated can transmit the virus.  This stems from a single study conducted in India that has since been rejected.

If the vaccinated can continue to infect others this will be the first time in the history of vaccines that this has happened.

----------


## Big Dummy

> The science doesn't say that.  Fauci says that based on a rejected study from India


Sorry, multiple studies say the vaccinated sluff off the spike protein that causes the spread.

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## Oceander

> Sorry, multiple studies say the vaccinated sluff off the spike protein that causes the spread.


 :Smiley ROFLMAO:

----------


## Foghorn

At the Methodist Hospital in Houston a few dozen people were fired for refusing the jab.  Several weeks later a judge upheld the firings after a lawsuit was filed.

This is but one example, there are many more to come as this thing progresses.  I see a legal nightmare in the making.

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gregonejeep (08-02-2021),Lone Gunman (08-02-2021)

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## Big Dummy

> 


Even the cdc admits the vaccinated spread the virus.  :Hammertime:

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Lone Gunman (08-02-2021)

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## Oceander

> Even the cdc admits the vaccinated spread the virus.


Of course they can, because the vaccine isn't some magical mystery cure-all that 100% prevents any infection.  Geez, don't you even bother to read the stuff my grade-school kid can read (and understand)?

If a vaccinated person spreads COVID-19, it's not something from the vaccine itself, it's because that person came into contact with COVID-19, picked up an infection, and shed some all-natural, regular virus particles.

Not because that person shed some sort of magical mystery protein spikes generated by the mRNA in the vaccine.

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## Dr. Felix Birdbiter

If the contention is that the vaccinated can continue to spread the virus just what the fuck was the purpose of getting the vaccine and all the attendant hoopla!

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Lone Gunman (08-02-2021)

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## WarriorRob

More proof the Vaccine does not work or is very unsafe, if someone would know, would be Health care workers or first responders. I think they know it's all Political.

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Big Dummy (08-02-2021),Lone Gunman (08-02-2021)

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## Lone Gunman

they worked without a vaccine for about a year, so they don't see the need for it; i agree.

i'm  sure some of them caught the flu and survived it, they're most likely immune anyway.

----------

Big Dummy (08-02-2021),WarriorRob (08-02-2021)

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## Oceander

> If the contention is that the vaccinated can continue to spread the virus just what the fuck was the purpose of getting the vaccine and all the attendant hoopla!


Uh, because the vaccine materially reduces one's chances of getting infected, materially reduces the severity of any resulting infection, and materially reduces the likelihood that one will pass the virus on to someone else.

If one has the business end of a six-shooter pointed at one's chest, which would one prefer, the case where all six chambers are loaded with live rounds, or the case where only two of the six chambers are loaded with live rounds, and the other four with dummy rounds?  That'd be worth quite a lot of hoopla.

----------


## Esdraelon

Delta is the primary iteration being seen in the U.S. now.  Delta has a higher R0 but a much milder disease.  Mortality for Delta is roughly the same as seasonal influenza.  Saying  With the new Delta variant being *far more potent* than the original virus," is a lie, plain and simple.  This virus is behaving EXACTLY the same as all other viruses.  It becomes more easily transmissible and less deadly.

----------


## gregonejeep

> At the Methodist Hospital in Houston a few dozen people were fired for refusing the jab.  Several weeks later a judge upheld the firings after a lawsuit was filed.
> 
> This is but one example, there are many more to come as this thing progresses.  I see a legal nightmare in the making.


I agree. I worked in hospitals for 12 years and I do not believe the hospital's management are happy about mandating their staff be CV-19 vaccinated. Why ? As they are medical professionals and one can bet at their monthly meetings with the doctors that work in their hospital, they are probably not getting very much positive feedback from them.  And every industry out here now are probably having trouble finding good employees now, especially qualified HC workers. 

And IMO truth be told, they are probably as uncomfortable about the predictable "success" of the CV vaccines, as we non-medical people are. As they know as well as anyone, the vaccines were fast dropped out in the patient market without having at least a few years, of human testing models done using the vaccines.

 Even when I worked in the hospitals 20 years ago, as an employee I was required to take certain shots or hit the street. As their #1 rule was to protect their helpless patient being treated in their hospital, from any risk of a direct patient care employee's sickness, negligence or their act of dumbassness. Were the hospital CEO's/managers being great humanitarians or litigation prevention practitioner's ?  Probably a 50/50 mix of both. JMO

----------


## Dr. Felix Birdbiter

> Uh, because the vaccine materially reduces one's chances of getting infected, materially reduces the severity of any resulting infection, and materially reduces the likelihood that one will pass the virus on to someone else.
> 
> If one has the business end of a six-shooter pointed at one's chest, which would one prefer, the case where all six chambers are loaded with live rounds, or the case where only two of the six chambers are loaded with live rounds, and the other four with dummy rounds?  That'd be worth quite a lot of hoopla.


My position is that the vaccine does work and while there is a very very very small chance of an adverse reaction the chances of getting the virus and dying were far higher.  My position is that if YOU have had the vaccine you are not at risk of getting Covid nor are you at risk of spreading it to someone else.  They, in a round about way, continue to tell us this is true but because some won't vaccinate we are all supposed to respect their wishes and mask up, lock down, social distance until the end of time.

I will not do it.  I had the vaccine in February through the VA, I am more of a risk driving in my car than I am walking around unmasked.  I am under no obligation to concern myself with those who won't take simple precautions.

----------


## donttread

> ...mandatory COVID vaccinations.
> 
> 
> "Hundreds, including healthcare workers, gathered in Charlotte, North Carolina, on Sunday to protest Atrium Healths and Novant Healths recent announcement requiring workers to be vaccinated against the Chinese coronavirus. One registered nurse said she is not going to be forced to take an experimental vaccine.
> 
> "Atrium Health and Novant Health, two of the biggest healthcare systems in the city, announced last month that all staff will be required to get vaccinated against the Chinese coronavirus.
> 
> With the new Delta variant being far more potent than the original virus, we view it as essential that each of our teammates receive their vaccination to protect themselves, their families and the people in their care, Atrium said in a press release. The mandate covers the systems more than 70,000 workers spanning dozens of hospitals and other facilities.
> 
> ...



No one should be forced to do this.

----------

phoenyx (08-04-2021)

----------


## ruthless terrier

> My position is that if YOU have had the vaccine you are not at risk of getting Covid nor are you at risk of spreading it to someone else.


*that is total bullshit.* the theory now is that the vaccine will prevent you from getting seriously ill. but don't kid yourself .. the vaccinated can be carriers of covid. read the news much?

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phoenyx (08-04-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> *that is total bullshit.* the theory now is that the vaccine will prevent you from getting seriously ill. but don't kid yourself .. the vaccinated can be carriers of covid. read the news much?


Even that's being overly generous. I just posted a thread getting into how even the mainstream media acknowledges that many have died from Covid 19 even after having been fully vaccinated:
151 Dead, 563 Hospitalized in Illinois Breakthrough COVID Cases

----------


## squidward

> As a rad tech I know a lot about pulmonary embolus -it's fatal if not caught and stopped quickly. I know enough about physiology to be scared shitless.


and the associated micro emboli will clip years off your life, but most won't know the full effects till years down the road when the cardiomyopathy and renal failure kick in.

----------

12icer (08-06-2021)

----------


## Sunsettommy

Gateway Pundit

*BOOM! Founder of mRNA Vaccine: CDC Is UNDER-REPORTING and EDITING Adverse Effects of COVID Vaccines  Govt. Suppressing Information! (VIDEO)*


By Jim Hoft
Published July 24, 2021



Excerpt:



Dr. Robert Malone, the founder of the mRNA vaccine technology joined Steve Bannon on The War Room on Saturday morning.
This was a riveting interview.


According to Dr. Malone the CDC is covering up the adverse effects of the dangerous COVID vaccines.  Dr. Malone then went on to accuse megalomaniac Dr. Tony Fauci of being a liar who is purposely hiding this information from the public  for their own good.

Dr. Robert Malone: Theres pretty clear evidence that the spike protein expressed from vaccines is caused from toxicity in a small subset of patients. The question is how big is that subset and how bad and broad are those toxicities? The honest truth is we dont know and furthermore there is a lot of signs that that information is being withheld from us I have colleagues in the government who were aware and were months before the toxicity was disclosed that the toxicity was an issue They are finding that the CDC is grossly underreporting these key adverse events My senior colleagues at the FDA have known that this was the case for months we have multiple signs that the CDC is editing this data in support of this noble lie

----------

Big Dummy (08-06-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-06-2021),Lone Gunman (08-06-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-06-2021),Quark (08-06-2021),S-N-A-F-U (08-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

Don't doubt it in the least.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (08-06-2021),Lone Gunman (08-06-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-06-2021)

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## Physics Hunter

Thus J&J if you are interested...

----------

Conservative Libertarian (08-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

> Thus J&J if you are interested...


The major problem with that one is heart inflammation. That's one I was going to take if I had to but with my minor but somewhat serious heart issues that would probably kill me too or at least make me permanently disabled. Heart inflammation does seem to be a serious problem for young people so maybe as an old fart I might be okay.

Maybe it's just time for all of us to just pull the plug and be done with it.

----------


## gregonejeep

And there are and will be those people that got vaxed like that I did, unwillingly. And not while fearing for losing their own life, but for the fear of killing their loved one.  My wife is mid-70's now and trying to make her every day count. As she has emphysema and has been fighting it for over 10 years now, and the end of  her battle is getting much closer now. Therefore needless to say, that while knowing that CV attacks the lungs she got vaxed as soon as the shot was available to her. 

Even though she got vaxed, I could not in good conscience NOT get the two shots that I received from Pfizer. As I had to at least try to lower my odds of getting the CV. Because if I got CV, I would then be putting my wife's CV vaccination's worthiness, to a life or death test. 

Now today, I watched on our local news just what I was fearing, and that is children younger than 18 are being "pushed" to be vaccinated. As they ran a skit showing that for the month of June 2021, the cases of CV reported for the 18 and under age groups was *534*. And then for the month of July 2021, this same age group is now being reported as having* 2000* CV cases !!!

 HUH ? 

If these numbers are a fact, I bet there is something the local news will NOT broadcast again. And that is, the film footage they showed on their newscast about 3 months ago now. The time when one of their reporter's video recorded *multiple* busloads of only 18-ish and under immigrants, stepping off of some VERY nice, new-ish looking buses . 

And it was this reporter's belief, that with our new immigration "policy" these kids must have been bussed directly from a state bordering the Rio Grande. Hmmm now, could this have anything at all to do with this SUDDEN rise in CV cases in just one month, amongst the kids?  

I do not believe I will ever get to read or watch on TV, the truth about the aforementioned.

----------

12icer (08-06-2021),Oceander (08-06-2021)

----------


## Sunsettommy

Here is a quiet admission that Fully vaccinated people still get infected anyway.

CDC

*Outbreak of SARS-CoV-2 Infections, Including COVID-19 Vaccine Breakthrough Infections, Associated with Large Public Gatherings  Barnstable County, Massachusetts, July 2021*_Weekly_ / August 6, 2021 

Excerpt:

During July 2021, 469 cases of COVID-19 associated with multiple summer events and large public gatherings in a town in Barnstable County, Massachusetts, were identified among Massachusetts residents; vaccination coverage among eligible Massachusetts residents was 69%. Approximately three quarters (346; 74%) of cases occurred in fully vaccinated persons (those who had completed a 2-dose course of mRNA vaccine [Pfizer-BioNTech or Moderna] or had received a single dose of Janssen [Johnson & Johnson] vaccine ≥14 days before exposure). Genomic sequencing of specimens from 133 patients identified the B.1.617.2 (Delta) variant of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, in 119 (89%) and the Delta AY.3 sublineage in one (1%). Overall, 274 (79%) vaccinated patients with breakthrough infection were symptomatic. Among five COVID-19 patients who were hospitalized, four were fully vaccinated; no deaths were reported.

LOT more HERE

----------

BooBoo (08-06-2021),Lone Gunman (08-06-2021),Quark (08-06-2021),WarriorRob (08-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

It's the flu damn it! Of course, this is going to happen. Look at how far along we would have been if we had not shut down and just let this virus do it's virus thing like any flu. Instead our super smart (read stupid) technocrats botched everything up.

----------

Big Dummy (08-06-2021),Lone Gunman (08-06-2021),WarriorRob (08-06-2021)

----------


## Lone Gunman

obviously trump's fault.

----------

BooBoo (08-06-2021),WarriorRob (08-06-2021)

----------


## ruthless terrier

at least we got rid of the nasty tweets.

----------

BooBoo (08-06-2021),WarriorRob (08-06-2021)

----------


## BooBoo

> obviously trump's fault.





> at least we got rid of the nasty tweets.


Wonder just how many Deaths were caused by those "Tweets" and bee "Thankful" there will bee no more...!!!

----------

Quark (08-06-2021),WarriorRob (08-06-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

I read somewhere. I guy or girl wrote, since the Covid outbreak all flu or respiratory illnesses have disappeared to make way for Covid or some brain dead LibTard crap. I read that and had to laugh, No Dumbf*ck all flu was lumped in Covid :Geez:

----------

Big Dummy (08-06-2021),BooBoo (08-06-2021),Quark (08-06-2021)

----------


## BooBoo

> I read somewhere. I guy or girl wrote, since the Covid outbreak all flu or respiratory illnesses have disappeared to make way for Covid or some brain dead LibTard crap. I read that and had to laugh, No Dumbf*ck all flu was lumped in Covid


 :Smiley ROFLMAO:  but, But, BUTT, True...!!!

----------

Quark (08-06-2021),WarriorRob (08-06-2021)

----------


## FlameHeart

> Ok, so you've got your handy little French corporate media link to shill, but what else pertaining to covid did the global corporate media get wrong? Well, all of it.


Well that was condescending.

----------

12icer (08-06-2021)

----------


## FlameHeart

> We are not talking astrophysics, but immunology. I wouldn't expect a British bloke to understand the difference.


Have you taken Immunology? Do you know the functions of the different cytokines, cluster differentiations? Where do T-cells originate and mature? Do you know which of the 5 immunoglobulin isotopes responds first when antibody-mediated response is initiated? Do you know what the cascade effect is, or redundancy? How about PAMs? 

FB_IMG_1628290397803.jpg

I know the answers to all of these. Do you?

----------

12icer (08-06-2021)

----------


## FlameHeart

> We are not talking astrophysics, but immunology. I wouldn't expect a British bloke to understand the difference.


What is red matter in the spleen? What about white matter? Peyer's patches? What does PALPS stand for? Do you know the anatomy of the different branches of the lymphatic system are called, head to toe? What does CD3 do? Or CD22? What does the Zona Fasculata tissue in the adrenal glands produce? Are phagocytic cells part of the innate or adaptive immune system- and why? What is the MAC? Is it apart of the innate or adaptive immune system? What lymphocyte recognizes and binds to MHC Class II receptors? MHC Class I? I would like both names for each. Is the idiotype of an antibody determined by the heavy chain or the light chain region- and what region within this region? What lymphocytes receptors have a fixed "hinge" region and which ones have a flexible region? Do you know the definition of the ending -itis? 

I got the answers to all of these and more when I took Immunology. I wouldn't expect someone with arrogance such as yourself to know the answers to these questions.

----------

12icer (08-06-2021)

----------


## FlameHeart

The thymus is a main lymph organ in babies and young children- however, it shrinks as you age. Where do certain cells go to mature in adults?

----------

12icer (08-06-2021)

----------


## 12icer

The vaccine causes a lot of unreported PROBLEMS I have watched and spoken to many people have had serious unreported reactions from them and had some myself and in my family. 
They lie about the FACTS of where the virus came from, who was the initiator of the manufacture of the weapon and that WE the PEOPLE paid for some of if not all of the illicit manufacture.
They lie about The stats and the REAL state we are in related to the actual danger of infection, the actual areas of outbreak, the actual statistics and facts about the levels of infection that are passed in various environments, and through varied mediums. 
They are telling us NOTHING at all but a bunch of gibberish with no real central plan for compiling any accurate data base to work from.
This looks like the climate change "science" BS we have seen for a few decades that has resulted in absolutely NO change of the narrative, or forecast from the LIARs who get rich off of the LIE.

----------


## FlameHeart

> Utter bollox. Viruses mutate whatever, vaccine or no vaccine, and at different rates depending on the percentage of viable  non immune hosts in a population. You can show no cause and effect that directly connects a mutation with someone being vaccinated. Provide a link to a peer reviewed scientific paper by a qualified recognised virologist that shows as much, or we can assume you are just making it up as you go along, and its fantasy science
> 
> Such a load of psuedoscientific babble, fake news, guesswork, conspiracy theory, and just plain unsupported made up bollox being posted in the is thread. But then when you get your scientific information from facebook, its only to be expected......


Indeed. There is a certain experiment that explains all of this, one that I hear comes up on the MCAT as. "favorite."

Do you remember the experiment of the mice and the (R)ough and (S)mooth strains of the same virus? 

The mice were infected with the live rough strain. They died. A new set of the same species was infected with the live S strain. They lived. Killed R? They lived. Killed S? Lived. 

But, when they were infected with the killed R and live S? They died. Why is that?

Well, one word: viral transformation. Killed off viruses are able donate their genetic material to other strains, causing them to mutate. Similarly, with bacteria; a positive strain of the species can use a structure called a sex pilus to donate some of their replicated DNA to a bacterium that is a negative strain. This is one way they develop antibiotic resistance. This is called transduction or horizontal gene transfer. There is also a process called transformation in which the bacteria takes foreign genes and incorporates them. 

This is freshman Biology 1112 stuff.

----------

12icer (08-06-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

It seems that a number of cerebral and coronary blood clots are improbably appearing in Jabbed patients - often young patients, previously-healthy patients.

On another board we're calling it The Clottery.  The funnest thought we're sharing, is how United Airlines has 80 percent of their pilots Jabbed.  So...one fine day, one of those pilots will be in the seat with a Boeing Max 8...and he's gonna be a sudden winner of The Clottery.

Hilarity will ensue.

But not really.  What's gonna come of this is a LOT of fear, chaos, death and ruin.

----------

12icer (08-06-2021),Brat (08-06-2021)

----------


## Big Dummy

-
We got a good idea on a few of the effective drugs, thanks to Trump.
-

----------

Conservative Libertarian (08-06-2021),dinosaur (08-06-2021),Lone Gunman (08-06-2021),Physics Hunter (08-07-2021),Quark (08-06-2021),QuaseMarco (08-06-2021),WarriorRob (08-06-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

> What is red matter in the spleen? What about white matter? Peyer's patches? What does PALPS stand for? Do you know the anatomy of the different branches of the lymphatic system are called, head to toe? What does CD3 do? Or CD22? What does the Zona Fasculata tissue in the adrenal glands produce? Are phagocytic cells part of the innate or adaptive immune system- and why? What is the MAC? Is it apart of the innate or adaptive immune system? What lymphocyte recognizes and binds to MHC Class II receptors? MHC Class I? I would like both names for each. Is the idiotype of an antibody determined by the heavy chain or the light chain region- and what region within this region? What lymphocytes receptors have a fixed "hinge" region and which ones have a flexible region? Do you know the definition of the ending -itis? 
> 
> I got the answers to all of these and more when I took Immunology. I wouldn't expect someone with arrogance such as yourself to know the answers to these questions.


A lot of university courses today seem to be aiming at Sophistry - taking simple or straightforward concepts, and reducing them to gibberish...so that the instructor's desired conclusion can be promulgated as Fact.

Like Modern Monetary Theory, AKA Magic Money Tree.  Print money while using a whole lot of buzzwords to cover what you're doing, and everyone's RICH!

They think.  Or they want us to believe.  A so-called professor, Stephanie Kelton of SUNY, has even written a book about this idiocy.

Likewise, here.  I'm a simple lay person.  But I can understand basic facts - such as, a vaccine that doesn't protect but DOES have a HIGHER risk of "side" effects, including death or permanent injury...is probably no good.  (Ya think?)

Moreover, if the vaccine doesn't protect from the unvaccinated, and a sudden mutation of the virus is MORE easily transmuted to the "vaccinated" than the "control" group (us Refusniks) then, the vaccine has side effects that are not wanted and dangerous.

Blaming those who didn't take any genetic modification, and are not sick...is not science.  It's belief in witchcraft.

----------

Brat (08-06-2021),East of the Beast (08-06-2021),RET423 (08-10-2021)

----------


## 12icer

Flameheart, 

I THINK Anyone who would think Immunology and any biological process was any less intricately complex than simple astrophysics is Lost in Space. 

As a simple EMT and sometimes ER staff, sometimes Quarantine and treatment Staff for a few years. I dealt with some of the things in treatment phases of severely ill patients that you are posting about. I know absolutely nothing close the level you posted, but I know that if you allow an infectious disease to regenerate it will require a different treatment to eradicate the regenerated disease. We just explained it as  absorption, adaptation and metamorphosis.

----------

FlameHeart (08-06-2021)

----------


## East of the Beast

The variant scare is just a precursor for another lockdown.

----------


## Quark

First off when I got hit it was pretty mild and I used over the counter stuff to deal with the virus. I have had my pneumonia shots and keep the shots updated, plus I have a heck of an immune system, and I have never smoked and have drank very little alcohol. I have good healthy lungs which why I came through so well and why I won't take the jab.

Second, if anybody can find a cure for the virus it'll be a place like Israel, it certainly won't be the USA as our medical science has been to politicized and any cure would be shot down in a New York minute.

Third, if I was college bound other than Hillsdale College or one of the conservative classical education Christian colleges or universities I would seriously contemplate Israel as their colleges and universities seem to be leading edge education.

----------

Big Dummy (08-06-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-06-2021),dinosaur (08-06-2021),Lone Gunman (08-06-2021),QuaseMarco (08-06-2021)

----------


## Traddles

Over a year ago there were some efforts to find and test existing drugs that might be treatments. The screening was done by computer, and IIRC, one such search came up with 70 or 80 possibilities. The computer search probably took a few days or weeks, but the testing, obviously, would take quite a few months and finding volunteers willing to participate instead of being treated with approved/authorized treatments might be difficult.

----------

dinosaur (08-06-2021)

----------


## FlameHeart

> A lot of university courses today seem to be aiming at Sophistry - taking simple or straightforward concepts, and reducing them to gibberish...so that the instructor's desired conclusion can be promulgated as Fact.
> 
> Like Modern Monetary Theory, AKA Magic Money Tree.  Print money while using a whole lot of buzzwords to cover what you're doing, and everyone's RICH!
> 
> They think.  Or they want us to believe.  A so-called professor, Stephanie Kelton of SUNY, has even written a book about this idiocy.
> 
> Likewise, here.  I'm a simple lay person.  But I can understand basic facts - such as, a vaccine that doesn't protect but DOES have a HIGHER risk of "side" effects, including death or permanent injury...is probably no good.  (Ya think?)
> 
> Moreover, if the vaccine doesn't protect from the unvaccinated, and a sudden mutation of the virus is MORE easily transmuted to the "vaccinated" than the "control" group (us Refusniks) then, the vaccine has side effects that are not wanted and dangerous.
> ...


This isn't simply "theory"- it is what scientists and medical personnel have found and it is what is in the curriculum. My questions were straightforward and I expect answers. Otherwise he can take his condescending attitude and ear crow. Terminology isn't "gibberish." 

The vaccine doesn't alter the genome because there are no enzymes to carry DNA counterparts into the nuclesome- and mRNA cannot encrypt into DNA.

I don't believe in witchcraft.

----------

12icer (08-07-2021)

----------


## Sunsettommy

The Last Refuge

*CDC Director Makes Case Vaccination Passports are Futile, Vaccines Do Not Prevent COVID Infection or Delta Variant Transmission*August 6, 2021 | Sundance 

Excerpt:



They are just making up narratives now, and the media are not calling them out on it.


The Director of the CDC made an important admission during an interview today on CNN.   CDC Director Rochelle Walensky stated the vaccine does not prevent COVID-19 infection, nor does it stop the vaccinated person from _transmitting the infection_ or the delta variant.  According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that it reduces the severity of symptoms.


LINK

----------

dinosaur (08-07-2021),Esdraelon (08-07-2021),Physics Hunter (08-07-2021),Quark (08-06-2021)

----------


## Dan40

From that I get that the vaccine WILL NOT reduce the severity of symptoms.

----------

Authentic (08-07-2021),Esdraelon (08-07-2021)

----------


## Sunsettommy

> From that I get that the vaccine WILL NOT reduce the severity of symptoms.


This is more important and why taking the vaccine is risky:

"CDC Director Rochelle Walensky stated the vaccine does not prevent COVID-19 infection, nor does it stop the vaccinated person from _transmitting the infection or the delta variant."

_No she said the opposite, but not a big deal for most people anyway:

"According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that it reduces the severity of symptoms."

You seem to be confused here, past your bed time?

----------

Esdraelon (08-07-2021),Fall River (08-11-2021)

----------


## OldSchool

Guess we'll all have to rely on masks.

 :Biglaugh:

----------

Mainecoons (08-07-2021),Sunsettommy (08-11-2021)

----------


## Quark

The so-called vaccine is doing what it's supposed to do up the odds of survival for people with co-morbidity issues and compromised immune systems. Not everyone should get the jab.

----------

MedicineBow (08-07-2021),Northern Rivers (08-07-2021)

----------


## Physics Hunter

> The Last Refuge
> 
> *CDC Director Makes Case Vaccination Passports are Futile, Vaccines Do Not Prevent COVID Infection or Delta Variant Transmission*
> 
> August 6, 2021 | Sundance 
> 
> Excerpt:
> 
> 
> ...


It's like watching Gymnastics floor routine, flip, flop, flop, flip...

----------

dinosaur (08-07-2021),Quark (08-07-2021),Sunsettommy (08-07-2021)

----------


## Esdraelon

If the vaccines do moderate symptoms then I've never seen anyone adequately explain HOW they quantify that.  The vast majority of those who contract this virus have minimal symptoms.  If one has never contracted the virus but gets the vaccine then contracts the virus, how can they say they KNOW the symptoms will be moderated by the vax and not just luck of the draw?  

When a government pushes this hard to vaccinate millions with an EUA drug and absolute legal immunity for the pharma companies, people would have to be dense not to question the narrative and the true motives.

----------

Quark (08-07-2021),Rebel Yell (08-07-2021)

----------


## Authentic

> This is more important and why taking the vaccine is risky:
> 
> "CDC Director Rochelle Walensky stated the vaccine does not prevent COVID-19 infection, nor does it stop the vaccinated person from _transmitting the infection or the delta variant."
> 
> _No she said the opposite, but not a big deal for most people anyway:
> 
> "According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that it reduces the severity of symptoms."
> 
> You seem to be confused here, past your bed time?


He is not confused at all. He realizes that Walensky is trying to sell the vaccine and has to state some benefit.

If CDC lied about infection and transmission, why should we believe them in severity of symptons?

----------

JMWinPR (08-07-2021),Quark (08-07-2021),Rebel Yell (08-07-2021)

----------


## Esdraelon

"the only benefit from the vaccine now *is presumably that it reduces the severity of symptoms."  

*Even she won't make an authoritative claim.  We have this confused, flip flopping narrative that has gone on for over a year and every promise made about the benefit of vaccines is being hedged now.  We're back to masks and some states are talking about enhanced restrictions or even lockdowns.  

Enough!  This government needs to back off before trouble starts.

----------

Quark (08-07-2021),Rebel Yell (08-07-2021),Sunsettommy (08-07-2021)

----------


## Quark

> "the only benefit from the vaccine now *is presumably that it reduces the severity of symptoms."  
> 
> *Even she won't make an authoritative claim.  We have this confused, flip flopping narrative that has gone on for over a year and every promise made about the benefit of vaccines is being hedged now.  We're back to masks and some states are talking about enhanced restrictions or even lockdowns.  
> 
> Enough!  This government needs to back off before trouble starts.


The government can't do that and survive. The government has dug a hole and has no way out of the hole.

----------

Authentic (08-07-2021),ruthless terrier (08-07-2021)

----------


## Northern Rivers

> The so-called vaccine is doing what it's supposed to do up the odds of survival for people with co-morbidity issues and compromised immune systems. Not everyone should get the jab.


I fear taking it. yes, I've had my aorta sliced 'n diced...later on...a stent in my LDA on the heart, itself...but...I'm in decent shape. "Co-morbidity" needs attention from all of us. Long time smoker? You definitely have compromised your lungs and respirators won't help a whole lot. Diabetic? The swings in your glucose levels will be a problem, too.

Me? I'm a modern-day Felix Unger. Germophobe? Yeah...okay...yep.

When my three boys were "little little" I actually trained them as to what they can expect in public places...especially rest rooms. Open doors with a shirt sleeve or other part of their clothes...use your feet where you can...clothed elbow...whatever. Doorknobs, railings, cart handles...pens...everything. If someone coughs...visualise a "cough cloud" and get through it by slowly exhaling...on and on it went.

Was/am I overprotective? _Of my boys???_ You betcha!!!  :Headbang:

----------

Quark (08-07-2021),Rebel Yell (08-07-2021)

----------


## Dan40

> This is more important and why taking the vaccine is risky:
> 
> "CDC Director Rochelle Walensky stated the vaccine does not prevent COVID-19 infection, nor does it stop the vaccinated person from _transmitting the infection or the delta variant."
> 
> _No she said the opposite, but not a big deal for most people anyway:
> 
> "According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that it reduces the severity of symptoms."
> 
> You seem to be confused here, past your bed time?


Sarcasm out of your wheelhouse?

----------


## Sunsettommy

> Sarcasm out of your wheelhouse?


Notice you didn't pay attention to your mistake, corrected you on it and still you don't notice.
LOL

----------


## memesofine

I took this off freerepublic but the link to populist press is in the snippet.* 4 BILLION PROFIT. This Resident Biden administration is in on it and why they are pushing pushing pushing all this on us. They have become LYING TYRANTS AND it's time to take a stand.* *

Moderna Calls For 3rd Shot, Posts $4 Billion Profit This Quarter*
*Populist Press ^* | 08/06/2021
Posted on *8/6/2021, 10:38:02 PM* by *SeekAndFind*
*Click here to read the full article*

Shut up, line up and take your shot.



Mod*er*na announced this week that due to the new strains of the coro*n*avirus they are rec*om*mend*ing a third shot before winter.

Moderna said Thursday that people will likely need a COVID-19 vaccine boost*er dose to protect against future mutations (AND IT GOES ON AND ON AND ON AND ON AND ON. wake up citizens) of the coronavirus, touting the robust antibody response generated by the additionl shot.

all of it here:
Moderna Calls For 3rd Shot, Posts $4 Billion Profit This Quarter

----------

Quark (08-07-2021),Rebel Yell (08-07-2021)

----------


## Rebel Yell

*Reduced symptoms? We don't need no stinking reduced symptoms......*

----------


## 12icer

It may not be the idea of using a trigger such as the mRNA to start antibody production it may be that the scope of the production is too wide in some people and their immune system produces an immune reaction that is what causes the adverse effects. 
That is what kills people when they have anaphylaxis, their immune response is out of control and they have to use epinephrine to reverse effects of massive histamine release it produces. 
I think in MY case my immune system has always been strong and very stable never had a viral infection as far as I know, I have had bacterial infections, but most go quickly. 
I think it is now supercharged to the point of overreacting to any perceived threat, even a natural biological process that may change or expand.

----------

FlameHeart (08-07-2021)

----------


## Dan40

> Notice you didn't pay attention to your mistake, corrected you on it and still you don't notice.
> LOL


What mistake?  Posted exactly what I intended.

----------


## Sunsettommy

> What mistake?  Posted exactly what I intended.


Article says:  According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that *it reduces the severity of symptoms.
*

YOU wrote at post 2: From that I get that the vaccine WILL NOT reduce the severity of symptoms.


I corrected you by quoting the article: "According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that *it reduces the severity of symptoms."
*
_red bolding mine
_

Now you come back with his: "What mistake? Posted exactly what I intended.



You stated it *will NOT reduce severity* of symptoms, while the CDC Director says that *it DOES reduce severity* of symptoms.


You are indeed confused just as I suspected, now it is confirmed.

----------


## memesofine

> Article says:  According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that *it reduces the severity of symptoms.
> *
> 
> YOU wrote at post 2: From that I get that the vaccine WILL NOT reduce the severity of symptoms.
> 
> 
> I corrected you by quoting the article: "According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that *it reduces the severity of symptoms."
> *
> _red bolding mine
> ...


who are you to correct anyone's post? Just joined this month with hardly any postings of your own.  Mind your own business.

----------


## memesofine

Remember folks

----------


## Sunsettommy

> who are you to correct anyone's post? Just joined this month with hardly any postings of your own.  Mind your own business.


*Bwahahahahahahahahaahahhahhaaa!!!*

He ASKED me for the answer at post 16, how did you miss it?




> What mistake? Posted exactly what I intended.


Thus I answered in a calm manner with hard evidence, he has since backed off as the gentleman he is. Everyone make mistakes me included in forums, but trying to deny the obvious mistakes is bad form.

Dan40 is a good man.

You think the number of postings should determine on how I behave here?

----------


## Dan40

> Article says:  According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that *it reduces the severity of symptoms.
> *
> 
> YOU wrote at post 2: From that I get that the vaccine WILL NOT reduce the severity of symptoms.
> 
> 
> I corrected you by quoting the article: "According to Director Walensky, the only benefit from the vaccine now is presumably that *it reduces the severity of symptoms."
> *
> _red bolding mine
> ...


Is English hard for you?  Do you not comprehend the word, " SARCASM "?  I'll try to help, an official' made a claim (a claim, not a fact) from which I got that the opposite would be true. ie, the official was lying.   Do you need more?   That means do I have to re-explain it to you again?  I'd hoped that when I posted the word sarcasm earlier you would understand.  I apologize for giving you too much credit.

----------


## East of the Beast

It also tells you that the COVID scare is/was contrived.If we are all now returning to normalcy knowing that the vaccine is basically ineffective yet the numbers of cases and deaths are falling.That tells me it was all meant to introduce a way of controlling the masses.

To buttress my argument we also know case numbers and deaths were severely exaggerated.We have been deceived,lied to,and manipulated by fear.

----------


## Sunsettommy

> Is English hard for you?  Do you not comprehend the word, " SARCASM "?  I'll try to help, an official' made a claim (a claim, not a fact) from which I got that the opposite would be true. ie, the official was lying.   Do you need more?   That means do I have to re-explain it to you again?  I'd hoped that when I posted the word sarcasm earlier you would understand.  I apologize for giving you too much credit.


This is all you offered and your alleged sarcasm is really hard to see since you posted it in a serious manner.

You call this sarcasm at post #2?




> From that I get that the vaccine WILL NOT reduce the severity of symptoms.


No indication here that you think she is lying........, you never followed up on it either.
You flatter yourself too much.





> Sarcasm out of your wheelhouse?


LOL

I have seen far better all over the internet.

Your smarmy reply indicate that you KNOW you have a weak argument to work with, suggest you give it a rest.

Cheers.

----------


## Dan40

> This is all you offered and your alleged sarcasm is really hard to see since you posted it in a serious manner.
> 
> You call this sarcasm at post #2?
> 
> 
> 
> No indication here that you think she is lying........, you never followed up on it either.
> You flatter yourself too much.
> 
> ...


You are making something of NOTHING.  Seek therapy.  Govt officials lie constantly, maybe someday, you'll understand that.  Sarcasm seems out of your reach

----------


## Sunsettommy

> You are making something of NOTHING.  Seek therapy.  Govt officials lie constantly, maybe someday, you'll understand that.  Sarcasm seems out of your reach


Ha ha ha, I have posted a bunch of evidence of government lying and misleading right here in the forum. You are so clueless in what I think of them your assumptions carry the same weight as your sarcasm does, a big fat nothing!

I posted the definition of Sarcasm it makes clear YOU are the one who doesn't know what it is, you ignored it.

You call this sarcasm at post #2?

1*:*a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain

2a*:* a mode of satirical wit depending for its effect on bitter, caustic, and often ironic language that is usually directed against an individual.


You wrote:




> From that I get that the vaccine WILL NOT reduce the severity of symptoms.




Nothing there that meets the minimum level of sarcasm.

Not caustic or bitter, or ironic or satirical in your sentence.

I am getting tired of making a fool out of you as you make it so easy.

Goodbye.

----------


## Dan40

> Ha ha ha, I have posted a bunch of evidence of government lying and misleading right here in the forum. You are so clueless in what I think of them your assumptions carry the same weight as your sarcasm does, a big fat nothing!
> 
> I posted the definition of Sarcasm it makes clear YOU are the one who doesn't know what it is, you ignored it.
> 
> You call this sarcasm at post #2?
> 
> 1*:*a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain
> 
> 2a*:* a mode of satirical wit depending for its effect on bitter, caustic, and often ironic language that is usually directed against an individual.
> ...


Goodbye?  Well thank you kid, I've become tired of your childishness.  Maybe we can talk when you mature and learn,,,,, something.  Bubye.

----------


## Hermannsdenkmal

> Well that was condescending.


And well deserved. You can't just fling a corporate media link at a poster and assume that low effort response is a well rounded rebuttal.

----------


## FlameHeart

> Have you taken Immunology? Do you know the functions of the different cytokines, cluster differentiations? Where do T-cells originate and mature? Do you know which of the 5 immunoglobulin isotopes responds first when antibody-mediated response is initiated? Do you know what the cascade effect is, or redundancy? How about PAMs? 
> 
> Attachment 61885
> 
> I know the answers to all of these. Do you?


 @Authentic

----------


## phoenyx

> @Authentic


I don't know about Authentic, but I imagine Tetyana Obukhanych, who has a PHD in immunology would know a thing or 2 on the subjects you mentioned. She wrote a book on the kindle platform you might want to check out (I have it myself): 
https://www.amazon.com/Vaccine-Illus...dp/B007AW2CLG/

I also highly recommend Dr. Jack Stockwell's book on vaccines:
https://www.amazon.com/How-Vaccines-...dp/B013RYIONU/

----------


## phoenyx

> The vaccine doesn't alter the genome because there are no enzymes to carry DNA counterparts into the nuclesome- and mRNA cannot encrypt into DNA.


About that...
Could mRNA Vaccines Permanently Alter DNA? Recent Science Suggests They Might. | Children's Health Defense

https://meaninginhistory.blogspot.com/2021/04/reverse-transcription-and-vaxxing-is.html

----------


## El Guapo

> Dogs to sniff out COVID-19 in Vancouver hospitals
> 
> Researchers at Vancouver Coastal Health are working on a new weapon they hope will defeat the spread of the virus that causes COVID-19.
> 
> The canine scent detection program is expanding to include dogs trained to sniff out the disease.
> 
> The program, formed five years ago to detect and reduce cases of the easily spread bacteria C. difficile, has added three new dogs capable of identifying COVID-19.
> 
> The two Labrador retrievers, Micro and Yoki, as well as Finn, an English springer spaniel, underwent six months of training, and all three are now certified to detect the virus.


Dogs to sniff out COVID-19 in Vancouver hospitals  | Globalnews.ca


 My skeptical nature finds this news dubious, to say the least.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (08-14-2021),Lone Gunman (08-14-2021),QuaseMarco (08-14-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> Dogs to sniff out COVID-19 in Vancouver hospitals  | Globalnews.ca
> 
> 
>  My skeptical nature finds this news dubious, to say the least.



Why? There's dogs that can sniff out cancer and various other diseases. Dogs have a sense of smell 1300 times better than yours or mine. And all life is a chemical process. 

There are quite a few stories of a pet dog obsessing about an owner's mole or some part of their body, only to discover in a doctor's appointment that the dog was actually sensing cancer. In one study, a patient’s dog kept licking a mole behind his ear.   When the mole was examined, it was confirmed to be a malignant melanoma.

A 2019 study found that dogs can correctly pick out blood samples from people who have cancer with 97% accuracy.  Using clicker training with four beagles, lead researcher Heather Junqueira found that the dogs focused their efforts on blood samples from patients with lung cancer, and with one exception, they were highly successful.  The work is part of a larger study of  canine scent detection in non-small-cell lung carcinoma and breast cancer samples.

Five dogs were trained to detect cancer based on breath samples for a 2006 study.  Once trained, the dogs were able to detect breast cancer with 88 percent accuracy, and lung cancer with 99 percent accuracy. They were able to do this across all four stages of the diseases.

A trained dog presented with urine samples from patients with cervical cancer, cervical abnormalities, benign uterine disease, and healthy volunteers was able to successfully distinguish the sample of patients with cervical cancer each time. 

Study after study has shown that dogs can detect cancer in people, but it may be awhile before your doctor employs a hound for your annual checkup. Researchers still don't know exactly which chemical compounds for different types of cancers the dogs are sensing in these samples to alert to the presence of the disease. This remains a hurdle both for better training of cancer-sniffing dogs and for creating machines that can more accurately detect cancer in the early stages.

----------

QuaseMarco (08-14-2021)

----------


## patrickt

There are lots of stories about almost everything. I have not seen any articles on research establishing that dogs can sniff out cancer, COVID-19, and from my exposure to police K-9 units I suspect dogs are responding more to their handler's expectations than anything else.

----------

El Guapo (08-14-2021)

----------


## El Guapo

> There are lots of stories about almost everything. I have not seen any articles on research establishing that dogs can sniff out cancer, COVID-19, and from my exposure to police K-9 units I suspect dogs are responding more to their handler's expectations than anything else.


 Bingo.

----------

Big Dummy (08-14-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> There are lots of stories about almost everything. I have not seen any articles on research establishing that dogs can sniff out cancer, COVID-19, and from my exposure to police K-9 units I suspect dogs are responding more to their handler's expectations than anything else.



Nope, dogs can sniff cancer, and its well researched



    In a study conducted in Amersham, England and published in the British Medical Journal, researchers tried to find out if dogs could be trained to identify bladder cancer solely based on urine odor. The dogs used in this study were able to correctly identify bladder cancer in the urine 41 percent of the time.


    In a research study conducted by the Pine Street Foundation, breath samples of 31 breast cancer patients, 55 lung cancer patients and 83 healthy people were presented to five trained scent dogs (three Labrador retrievers and two Portuguese water dogs). These dogs were able to detect or rule out breast and lung cancer, at all stages of the disease, with approximately 90 percent accuracy.


    An expert in melanomas, Dr. Armand Cognetta of Tallahassee,studied whether dogs could detect skin cancer and enlisted the help of a dog trainer. With the samples of melanomas, he worked to train a dog to sniff out the skin cancer. George, the dog used in the study, was able to detect the melanoma approximately 99 percent of the time. Furthermore, this research proved that George could successfully detect the malignant melanoma lesions from the benign lesions in patients.


    According to S. News & World Report, a black lab named Marine was able to detect colon cancer in a study of 200 humans suffering from this disease with an incredible 97 percent accuracy rate. This dog was even more accurate than the routine fecal occult blood tests by approximately 25 percent. He was able to pick up early-stage signs of cancer and advanced malignancies.


    According to a recent study published in the European Respiratory Journal, four trained dogs (one Australian shepherd, two German shepherds and one Labrador) correctly identified lung cancer in 71 of 100 samples from lung cancer patients. These dogs also ruled out cancer in 372 of 400 samples that were known not to have the cancer. That’s a very low rate of false positives – about 7 percent.


    In Milan, the colleagues of Gianluigi Taverna of Humanitas Research Hospital took urine samples from 320 men with prostate cancer and 357 without it. The men with cancer had different stages of the disease from low-risk tumors to high-risk tumors. In the non-prostate-cancer group, some of the men also had other diseases, including other types of cancer. Two dogs were used for this study. Taken together, both dogs had an accuracy rate of 98 percent, which the team reported to the annual meeting of the American Urological Association.



https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...0408114304.htm

Can dogs smell cancer in humans? Research and diagnosis

New Study Finds That Dogs Can Smell Cancer With Incredible Accuracy - Best LifeBest Life

Can Dogs Smell Cancer in Humans? 2020 Research

----------


## El Guapo

> 


This thread isn't about cancer. 


It's not even about dogs.

----------


## UKSmartypants

> This thread isn't about cancer. 
> 
> 
> It's not even about dogs.



Its about dogs sniffing diseases. eg Covid. and posters who dont believe it can be done.  Except its proven it can be. Dogs can smell multiple diseases.


and you are a hypocrite.  You and certain other people here criticise if i post information with posting links to the source. and then you criticise if i do.  So im damned if i do, and  im damned if i dont.   What a bunch of vindictive two faced hypocrites.

----------


## UKSmartypants

> This thread isn't about cancer. 
> 
> 
> It's not even about dogs.



remember this?



idiot.jpg

----------


## Big Bird

There may be a mask that actually works on the wuhu flu on the market soon. That's if the drug companies don't stop it.



https://globalnews.ca/news/7481016/c...ta-researcher/


search:
covid 19 salt mask filter

covid 19 salt mask filter - Google Search

----------

Karl (08-19-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

That or train other friendly viruses in martial arts and unarmed combat.

----------

Big Bird (08-19-2021),Thom Paine (08-19-2021)

----------


## Karl

> There may be a mask that actually works on the wuhu flu on the market soon. That's if the drug companies don't stop it.
> 
> 
> 
> https://globalnews.ca/news/7481016/c...ta-researcher/
> 
> 
> search:
> covid 19 salt mask filter
> ...


As far as I know only the 3M model 95 mask has any "effective" in that how it seals..

Problem is those are "Hoarded" kept "off market" for Hospitals and Medical Places like Nursing Homes.. Now granted they "Need" Em more than anybody else I understand

What we and everybody else is putting on is basically Cloth or Paper ...No Seal "proven" INNEFECTIVE

But Damn It we all gotta put one on ...Double Mask

----------

Big Bird (08-19-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

100 YEAR OLD CARTOON ABOUT COVID - WHATS HAPPENING NOW BEING SHOWN TO US 100 YEARS AGO


 :Thinking:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (08-20-2021),Foghorn (08-20-2021),Kodiak (08-20-2021),Lone Gunman (08-20-2021),Quark (08-20-2021)

----------


## Kodiak

Damn, that is amazing.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (08-20-2021),Lone Gunman (08-20-2021),Quark (08-20-2021),WarriorRob (08-20-2021)

----------


## Foghorn

Told ya it was all Woodrow Wilson's fault.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (08-20-2021),Kodiak (08-20-2021),Lone Gunman (08-20-2021),Quark (08-20-2021),WarriorRob (08-20-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

Claims that cartoon from the 1930s predicted COVID-19 pandemic are fake - FakeNews - Dunya News


This says cartoon was fake, figured It would be good to add this, good idea to fact check everything nowadays, a lot of fake stuff around these days.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (08-20-2021),Lone Gunman (08-20-2021)

----------


## Jen

Wow.  I remember seeing old cartoons like that when I was very young (they were old then)........they were very scary.  I guess they were meant to be.

----------

WarriorRob (08-20-2021)

----------


## Jen

> Claims that cartoon from the 1930s predicted COVID-19 pandemic are fake - FakeNews - Dunya News
> 
> 
> This says cartoon was fake, figured It would be good to add this, good idea to fact check everything nowadays, a lot of fake stuff around these days.


Maybe this one was fake........but some of those olden cartoons were pretty scary.

----------

WarriorRob (08-20-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

i was about to ask for the source of the  film. You cannot just take such stuff as genuine, and Bitchute is rife with fake stuff, its not a trustworthy source.  And the use of the word 'weaponise' clearly was suspicious.

----------

Jen (08-20-2021),WarriorRob (08-20-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> i was about to ask for the source of the  film. You cannot just take such stuff as genuine, and Bitchute is rife with fake stuff, its not a trustworthy source.  And the use of the word 'weaponise' clearly was suspicious.


Bitchute is probably more reliable than MSM, those Communists pieces of Sh*t, still can't believe they still have a platform for their propaganda, they have been exposed so often :Angry20:

----------


## Sunsettommy

More evidence that the mRNA based vaccines don't work well enough to justify the risk of taking it.


Jo Nova

*Even 100% vaccination is not enough: 27 people on a cruise ship get infected, one dies*


August 21, 2021

Excerpt:


*70, 80, 90 percent vaxed doesn’t look like the ticket to Freedom*


*A cruise ship with only vaccinated people on board gets 27 cases of covid*


Is this what “living with the virus” means?


LINK

----------

Quark (08-21-2021),TheOneOnly2 (08-21-2021),WarriorRob (08-20-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

Seems more and more everyday it seems the biggest money making scam in History. I hope there will be prosecutions for this, they are literally killing people in the name of science, we are the Guinea pigs :Angry20:

----------

Quark (08-21-2021),Sunsettommy (08-20-2021)

----------


## Quark

Science is now a religion especially medical science.

Science at one time was a philosophy, that is questions that may never be answered but scientists kept trying so as to expand their knowledge.

Now science is a religion, that is answers that may never be questioned, answers that are settled and there is a consensus. 

Science is dead.

----------

TheOneOnly2 (08-21-2021),WarriorRob (08-21-2021)

----------


## TheOneOnly2

> Science is now a religion especially medical science.
> 
> Science at one time was a philosophy, that is questions that may never be answered but scientists kept trying so as to expand their knowledge.
> 
> Now science is a religion, that is answers that may never be questioned, answers that are settled and there is a consensus. 
> 
> Science is dead.


They tried to kill God. Replace it with science. 




Stephen Hawking. Ha. People believe in Stephen Hawking. But not God.

edit - A brain dead %$%$ing retard. Blowing in a %$%$ing straw.. edit - Oh its a squeeze box.

edit - Who are we to question?

----------

WarriorRob (08-21-2021)

----------


## Frankenvoter

> They tried to kill God. Replace it with science. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Stephen Hawking. Ha. People believe in Stephen Hawking. But not God.
> 
> edit - A brain dead %$%$ing retard. Blowing in a %$%$ing straw.. edit - Oh its a squeeze box.
> 
> edit - Who are we to question?


That wasn't even his real voice, sounded fake as shit.

----------


## phoenyx

Recently, I bought a book in kindle format with the same title as this thread. I decided to get it based on the fact that I'd been reading various theories that are clearly anathema to the mainstream medical establishment in regards to viruses: 

1- Viruses don't exist. Instead, they are only exosomes, which are created by the body for various functions. 

2- Viruses do exist, but they are similar to exosomes and are used by the body as a last resort to rid the body of toxins that are so toxic that no other bodily mechanism can deal with them. 

After reading parts of this book, I've come to believe the first, that viruses are in fact just exosomes. Ofcourse, it's easy to say whatever one likes about viruses, whether it be conventional viewpoints or unconventional ones. The key is to provide evidence for one's viewpoint, so that's what I went looking for and past a certain point, I think it's safe to say that it's easier to buy books on the subject, so that's what I decided to do here. 

Anyway, this book seems to squarely be in the camp that viruses are exosomes. I wanted to share part of what's written so that you could understand where I'm coming from with my own views and then decide for yourselves whether the evidence I put forth is worth looking into more or not. So with that said, here's the excerpt, from the beginning of Chapter 6 in the book:

****** 
_Exosomes

After reading the last two chapters you may be shaking your head in disbelief; you may have so many questions swirling in your mind that you feel disoriented. The main question for us all is how the entire world of medicine, virology, and immunology, along with our political leaders, could have made such an obvious mistake? How could generations of doctors and researchers have become convinced that many of our common diseases are viral in origin? 

Let’s first provide the scientific basis for challenging the notion of contagion. As we have said, an in-depth look at the scientific literature reveals no proof of the contagion theory, but the alternate explanations for so-called “bacterial” or “viral” illness do have research behind them. Only Western medicine invokes the concept of contagion—person-to-person transmission of harmful bacteria or viruses. Neither traditional Chinese medicine (TCM) nor Ayurveda (a system of medicine with historical roots in the Indian subcontinent) entertains the concept of contagion. These ancient healing systems look at imbalances, diet and toxins as the causes of disease. 

So how did the theory of viral causation come about? During the late 1800s, with the popularity of Pasteur and the increasing materialistic thinking of the age, the germ theory gained popularity. The germ theory explained common observations, such as why drinking sewage water made people sick and why people who share a workspace or household seem to get sick in a similar way at the same time. With the advent and widespread use of the light microscope, scientists and doctors could clearly identify bacteria associated with particular illnesses.

In the nineteenth century, scientists and physicians assumed that the teeming forms they saw in their microscopes caused disease and were hostile to life. In writing On the Origin of Species (published in 1859), Charles Darwin (a contemporary of Pasteur) proposed a theory of evolution in which only the plants and animals best adapted to their environment survive to reproduce. He painted a picture of life in which the various organisms were in constant struggle against each other. Darwin borrowed popular concepts (such as “survival of the fittest”) from sociologist Herbert Spencer and “struggle for existence” from economist Thomas Malthus. The notion of hostility and competition in all of nature fit with attempts to justify the social inequalities, poverty, and sufferings that characterized the dawning Industrial Age. Social Darwinism actually preceded biological Darwinism!

For all the known “infectious” bacterial illnesses, the science points to other accurate explanations—namely starvation and poisoning. However, the microscope gave scientists the ability to find germs at the site of disease. Their observations revolutionized the practice of medicine and our thinking. The microscope allowed medicine to enter a “scientific” age and provide a ready and easy explanation for illness—one that circumvented the more difficult and less profitable work of cleaning up the cities, improving diets, mitigating poverty, and reducing pollution. However, bacteria are found at the site of disease for the same reason that firemen are found at the site of fires. Bacteria are the cleanup crew tasked with digesting and getting rid of dead and diseased tissues. Claiming that bacteria cause a certain disease is no more reasonable than claiming that firemen cause fires, especially as experimental evidence shows this to be false. Likewise, maggots on a dead dog are there to clean up dead tissue—no one would accuse the maggots of killing the dog. In fact, one therapy for necrotic tissue is maggot therapy (applying maggots to the wound). The maggots kill only the dead tissue; when there is only live tissue left to eat, they die off. 

But scientists could not always find an offending bacterium for a specific disease. Louis Pasteur could not find a bacterial agent for rabies, and he speculated about a pathogen too small to be detected using a microscope.1 The same held true for polio—hard as they tried, scientists could find no bacteria at the site of the illness.2 Following Pasteur, and completely wedded to germ theory, they postulated a tiny enemy, something that our technology could not yet visualize. The search was on to find this disease-causing organism. 

The eureka moment came with the invention of the electron microscope; scientists finally saw tiny “particles” at the site of disease. These particles had “stuff” inside them, suggesting they were “alive.” They were more abundant in diseased tissue than in healthy tissue (although this is not what Lanka found in algae). There were variations between types of particles, suggesting that one type of particle caused one disease and another particle type caused a different disease. Immediately assuming that these particles were bad for us, scientists named them viruses, after the Latin word for “toxin.” 

Further research revealed that these particles often emerged from within the cell; this led to the conclusion that these viruses were not just bad for the cell in which they resided, but they could invade other cells. Scientists surmised that viruses co-opted the “machinery” of the cell like parasites, turning the cells into “slaves,” meaning the cell would do the bidding of its new master, the infecting particle. Like alien invaders in science fiction movies, the particle would come from the outside, inject itself into the cell, take over the genetic machinery of the cell, reproduce itself by the thousands, and then emerge from the cell to continue on its evolutionary path, spreading to take over the world. 

The wily virus theory was born—except that what scientists had really discovered with their electron microscopes was not viruses but exosomes. The only thing infectious in this scenario was the noxious belief that these small particles, dubbed viruses, caused disease. This false theory was the part that spread all over the world and is now threatening to kill us all. 

Exosomes are simple, well-characterized features in the cells of all creatures, and conventional scientists have carefully elucidated their functions.3 When a living organism is threatened in almost any way— through starvation, chemical poisoning, or electromagnetic effects—the cells and tissues have a mechanism for “packaging,” “propagating” and releasing these poisons. Modern researchers have shown that exosomes have exactly the same attributes as “viruses.” They are the same size, contain the same components, and act on the same receptors.4

HIV researcher James Hildreth, president and CEO of Meharry Medical College and former professor at Johns Hopkins, put it this way: “The virus is fully an exosome in every sense of the word.”5 Exosomes are completely indistinguishable from what the virologists have been calling “viruses.” Here’s how exosomes work: let’s say you have a poorly nourished organism, then you expose it to a common environmental toxin. The tissues and cells that are affected begin to produce, package, and secrete these poisons in the form of exosomes. This is a way of ridding the cells and tissues of substances that would do it great harm. The greater the exposure to toxic assaults, the more exosomes will be produced.

Studies have shown that if one somehow stops the cells from producing and excreting these exosomes, then the cells and tissues, in fact the organism, will have a worse outcome.6 This research demonstrates that the production and excretion of exosomes is a crucial detoxification function of all cells and tissues._ 
****** 

Source: Morell, Sally Fallon. The Truth About Contagion: Exploring Theories of How Disease Spreads. Skyhorse. Kindle Edition.

There's a lot more on exosomes, bacteria and more in the book, really a wonderful read in my view.

----------


## WarriorRob

This is above my pay grade :Thinking:  I think it's just a money making scheme, it's also killing people with experimental vaccines, how they got people to go along with it is truly baffling, guess by bullying. I think the Pandemic or Plandemic was planned to make a fake vaccines for profit, sadly millions are Guinea Pigs as well, there are going to be severe consequences for future generations of Humans.

----------


## phoenyx

> This is above my pay grade I think it's just a money making scheme, it's also killing people with experimental vaccines, how they got people to go along with it is truly baffling, guess by bullying. I think the Pandemic or Plandemic was planned to make a fake vaccines for profit, sadly millions are Guinea Pigs as well, there are going to be severe consequences for future generations of Humans.


(above pay grade) lol :-). When I first heard of this theory that viruses were actually exosomes, I was skeptical and for a while, I decided there wasn't enough evidence for it. But over time, and after reading a lot of different material, I've come to believe that it's the explanation that makes the most sense, especially considering things like people getting infected by alleged viruses even though they were nowhere near people who had allegedly been infected, such as sailors out at sea. If, on the other hand, people were reacting to toxins, then there is no need for anyone to be exposed to someone who is infected, as the cause of disease is toxins, not infections.

Anyway, regardless of this, I fully agree with you that people are being used as guinea pigs with these experimental vaccines :-p.

----------

WarriorRob (08-21-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> This is above my pay grade I think it's just a money making scheme, it's also killing people with experimental vaccines, how they got people to go along with it is truly baffling, guess by bullying. I think the Pandemic or Plandemic was planned to make a fake vaccines for profit, sadly millions are Guinea Pigs as well, there are going to be severe consequences for future generations of Humans.


It's not above your pay grade. The reasoning in the OP is flawed at a basic level. The human body does NOT simply "secrete poisons", whoever thinks that doesn't have any kind of medical education.

It's way way WAY more complicated than that. The human body is quite impressive. Things released from human cells are very carefully controlled.

The OP sounds like liberal propaganda. Trying to make humans responsible for all the disease. Don't buy it.

----------

Fall River (08-29-2021),WarriorRob (08-22-2021)

----------


## UKSmartypants

> It's not above your pay grade. The reasoning in the OP is flawed at a basic level. The human body does NOT simply "secrete poisons", whoever thinks that doesn't have any kind of medical education.
> 
> It's way way WAY more complicated than that. The human body is quite impressive. Things released from human cells are very carefully controlled.
> 
> The OP sounds like liberal propaganda. Trying to make humans responsible for all the disease. Don't buy it.


I concur, this is a load  of nonsense.


The idea that viruses are secreted by cells exposed to toxins is the virology equivalent of Flat Eartherism, and just as easily debunked.

    1.There has never, ever, ever been even one example of taking a healthy cell, exposing it to any toxin, and seeing viruses appear.

    2. If you take a virus from an infected cell and introduce it into a culture of healthy cells, the healthy cells become infected without the introduction of any toxin.

    3. Viruses have their own genome, DNA or RNA, that includes genes not found in cells that code for proteins not present in infected cells.

    4. We can watch viruses infect a cell, watch the infected cells begin to manufacture more viruses, and watch those viruses go on to infect other cells, even in cultures that are carefully controlled without the presence of “toxins.”

We have electron and other pictures of them.

In short: We have direct observations of them NOT being exosomes excreted by cells exposed to toxins, we have observations of them attacking other VIRUSES, etc, We have observations of them injecting their genetic materials INTO cells, We have observations of the injected materials, from outside the cell, injected BY the virus, INTO the cell, then templating with the cell’s materials, to template reactions that make COPIES of the virus.

And so on and so forth.

SO, there is ZERO evidence that viruses are toxin triggered exosomes, and completely massive and overwhelming OBSERVATIONS of them being VIRUSES.

As far as conspiracy theories go, “viruses are the result of toxins” is one step above “flat earth” and two steps below “shapeshifting lizard aliens from outer space control the banking establishment.”

----------

Fall River (08-29-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

There is no OP. The material that is posted came from the forum.  The presence of willing readers stimulated the forum to produce the words that appear in that opening post.

----------

UKSmartypants (08-23-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> It's not above your pay grade. The reasoning in the OP is flawed at a basic level. The human body does NOT simply "secrete poisons", whoever thinks that doesn't have any kind of medical education.


It certainly goes against the mainstream medical dogma, yes. That being said, your notion that the authors of the book don't have any kind of medical education is absolutely false. Here's the bio on Thomas S. Kowan:
**
Dr. Tom Cowan discovered the work of the      two   men who would have the most   influence on his  career while teaching   gardening as a Peace  Corps volunteer in     Swaziland, South Africa. He read _Nutrition   and PhysicalDegeneration_ by   Weston   A.Price, as well as Rudolf Steiner’s   work on   biodynamic agriculture. These events         inspired   him to pursue a medical degree.   Tom   graduated   from Michigan State     University   College of   Human Medicine in   1984. After his residency in Family Practice at Johnson City Hospital in Johnson City, New York, he set up an anthroposophical medical practice in Peterborough, New Hampshire. Dr. Cowan relocated to San Francisco in 2003.
Dr. Cowan has served as vice president of the Physicians Association for Anthroposophical Medicine and is a founding board member of the Weston A. Price Foundation™.  During his career he has studied and written about many subjects in medicine. These include nutrition, anthroposophical medicine and herbal medicine. He is the author of three books published by Chelsea Green: _Cancer and the New Biology of Water; Vaccines, Autoimmunity and the Changing Nature of Childhood Illness, and Human Heart, Cosmic Heart. He is the principal author of The Fourfold Path to Healing, which was published in 2004 by New Trends Publishing, and is the co-author of The Nourishing Traditions Book of Baby & Child Care, published in 2013. He has lectured throughout the United States and is a frequent guest on health-related podcasts. He has three grown children and six grandchildren and practices medicine in San Francisco, where he resides with his wife, Lynda Smith._
**
Source:
https://fourfoldhealing.com/pages/about-us


Now, given the strong medical dogma in the U.S., it stands to reason that the medical inquisition would go after him, and they did, well before Covid 19 even came into the picture. Apparently, it had to do with him prescribing a medication that wasn't approved by the FDA called GcMAF. It led to his medical license being revoked. So I took a look at this GcMAF drug. Here's what I found:
**
What do you believe would happen if researchers learned a cure for chronic diseases including cancer? Would it be broadcasted across the globe in celebratory fashion? Would there be any attempts made to cover up the discovery? Could you imagine that doctors who have used the cure successfully would be murdered over their findings?
Several doctors linked to a potential cure known as GcMAF have been found dead within the last year. Reports of their deaths are blamed on suicide, heart failure, and other mysterious links. Family, friends, and coworkers surrounding these doctors have no reports of physical or mental illness that in any way would have arisen suspicion.
Could GcMAF be the link between these doctors' sudden deaths and what is GcMAF?
**
Source:
Five Things to Know About GcMAF

Fortunately, that hasn't stopped him from continuing his research and sharing it with those who are willing to listen.

----------


## phoenyx

> There is no OP.


Apparently, you don't know what OP means. Admittedly, I thought it stood for Opening Post, but apparently it actually stands for Original Poster:
The Meaning of OP in Online Conversation

Either way, this thread has one.





> There is no OP.


The material that is posted came from the forum.[/quote]

No, the material I posted comes from the Kindle Edition of the book whose name this thread shares. Which you would have known had you read the opening post.

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> Apparently, you don't know what OP means. Admittedly, I thought it stood for Opening Post, but apparently it actually stands for Original Poster:
> The Meaning of OP in Online Conversation
> 
> Either way, this thread has one.




My post makes sense if you interpret OP as "original poster". I used the same cockamaimee logic you use with exofarts.

Ridiculous.... isn't it.

----------


## UKSmartypants

> Apparently, you don't know what OP means. Admittedly, I thought it stood for Opening Post, but apparently it actually stands for Original Poster:
> The Meaning of OP in Online Conversation
> 
> Either way, this thread has one.
> 
> 
> 
> The material that is posted came from the forum.


The abbreviation OP, or Original Poster, derives from back in the days of dial up BBS's, (Bulletin Board Systems), which was what we had pre  internet.  It also became ubiquitous in IRC (Internet Relay Chat) and USEnet, pre WWW.

----------

phoenyx (08-24-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

CDC Caught Falsifying Data? by The Highwire with Del Bigtree


So should we really trust the CDC :Dontknow:  I sure as hell don't :Angry20:

----------

Big Dummy (08-24-2021),Brat (08-24-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-24-2021),dinosaur (08-24-2021),Quark (08-24-2021)

----------


## patrickt

I'm shocked, shocked mind you.




The CDC has a long history of lying and publishing false findings. The U.S. government has zero credibility. The FBI, NSA, DOJ, FDA, EPA, Dept. of Education, the Capitol Police--killers of Ashli Babbitt, House of Representatives, Senate, and the President and his administration have zero credibility.

----------

Brat (08-24-2021),dinosaur (08-24-2021),WarriorRob (08-25-2021)

----------


## Big Dummy

Did you ever trust the cdc?  I never have.

----------

StanAtStanFan (08-24-2021),WarriorRob (08-25-2021)

----------


## Neo

It's time to stop forcing the vaccinated majority of Americans to accommodate those who refuse to take
this simple step — especially now that at least one Covid-19 vaccine has been fully approved.

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/08/26/opinions/make-the-unvaccinated-bear-financial-costs-for-their-decision-banzhaf/index.html

----------

Rutabaga (08-27-2021)

----------


## OneDumbBlonde

LOL

Dr Christina Parks states that the CDC tracked 429 Covid outbreak in Massachusetts where 74% were fully jabbed and 4 out of 5 that needed to be hospitalized were also fully jabbed.*It is obvious the shot is not working.

*

----------

Big Dummy (08-27-2021),Rutabaga (08-27-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

i gib em tree fitty...

----------

Foghorn (08-27-2021)

----------


## Authentic

I am not at all surprised that CNN is advocating for fascism.

----------

East of the Beast (08-27-2021),Kodiak (08-27-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## Authentic

If this is a "pandemic of the unvaccinated" why are so many vaccinated filling hospitals?

What do the vaccinated have to fear from the unvaccinated if the vaccine is effective?

----------

East of the Beast (08-27-2021),Kodiak (08-27-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021),Rebel Yell (08-27-2021),Rutabaga (08-27-2021)

----------


## OneDumbBlonde

> If this is a "pandemic of the unvaccinated" why are so many vaccinated filling hospitals?
> 
> What do the vaccinated have to fear from the unvaccinated if the vaccine is effective?


And when are the vaccinated going to realize that they _are_​ the Delta variant?

----------

Authentic (08-27-2021),Big Dummy (08-27-2021),East of the Beast (08-27-2021),Foghorn (08-27-2021),Rebel Yell (08-27-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> LOL
> 
> Dr Christina Parks states that the CDC tracked 429 Covid outbreak in Massachusetts where 74% were fully jabbed and 4 out of 5 that needed to be hospitalized were also fully jabbed.*It is obvious the shot is not working.
> 
> *


About that - that outbreak was at an annual gay orgyfest, so of course everyone's going to get infected with all the bodily fluid exchange going on.  The wonder isn't that only some of them got infected, the wonder is that they didn't all get infected.

It's also not a very useful measuring point for the general effectiveness of the vaccine.

----------

pjohns (08-27-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> I am not at all surprised that CNN is advocating for fascism.


Neither am I.  They ceased being a real journalism outfit decades ago and now they're nothing more than a propaganda outfit for the american fascist party, aka the democrat party.

----------

Authentic (08-27-2021),Foghorn (08-27-2021),Rutabaga (08-27-2021)

----------


## tiny1

I don't care if the shot works, or not.  I don't need a limey telling me what to put in my body.  Anyone who feels they want to make me pay, send me a text and I'll shoot you directions to my house.  C'mon and make me pay.  I Dare You.
This is stupid.  We are in America.  I know it doesn't seem like it, with the Pretender in the WH, and all these European peons vying for the title of best American irritant.  But, I remembered quite recently that we are a free country.
In your own country, go ahead.  Give up your rights.  Give up your guns.  Walk around with your PC nose up Achmed's ass if you want, but stay out of MY Neighborhood.
The vaccine is controversial.  I don't Want it!!!  If you like it.....you take it.  Leave me the Hell Alone!

----------

Authentic (08-27-2021),Big Dummy (08-27-2021),Brat (08-27-2021),East of the Beast (08-27-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021),Rebel Yell (08-27-2021),Rutabaga (08-27-2021)

----------


## Authentic

> I don't care if the shot works, or not.  I don't need a limey telling me what to put in my body.  Anyone who feels they want to make me pay, send me a text and I'll shoot you directions to my house.  C'mon and make me pay.  I Dare You.
> This is stupid.  We are in America.  I know it doesn't seem like it, with the Pretender in the WH, and all these European peons vying for the title of best American irritant.  But, I remembered quite recently that we are a free country.
> In your own country, go ahead.  Give up your rights.  Give up your guns.  Walk around with your PC nose up Achmed's ass if you want, but stay out of MY Neighborhood.
> The vaccine is controversial.  I don't Want it!!!  If you like it.....you take it.  Leave me the Hell Alone!


Oh, but don't you care about the community? Especially the _global_ community? We are all in this together, you know. Trust the science!

----------

Foghorn (08-27-2021),Rebel Yell (08-27-2021),Rutabaga (08-27-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

my body, my choice, and stay off my lawn... :Old:  :Hiding:

----------

Authentic (08-27-2021),East of the Beast (08-27-2021),Foghorn (08-27-2021),Neo (08-27-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

> Oh, but don't you care about the community? Especially the _global_ community? We are all in this together, you know. *Trust the science!*




like biology and "believe all women"?

----------

Authentic (08-27-2021),Foghorn (08-27-2021)

----------


## OneDumbBlonde

> It's also not a very useful measuring point for the general effectiveness of the vaccine.


Overall?  You're not wrong.  There are much better ones out there; I'm just being extremely lazy in finding/posting a better one.

Considering the only difference between the vaccinated and unvaccinated is the severity of symptoms _when_ they contract any strain of the virus, any video works for dismantling the lies that the 'savior vaccines' are for our health.

----------

Brat (08-27-2021)

----------


## Kodiak

All this crap is one big sham.  People contracting and spreading Covid after being vaxxed, forcing people to wear masks that don't work, and on and on and on.   Its giving me a headache.  

It's obviously a scam when you see politicians demanding we wear face diapers whether vaxxed or not, then they are caught at parties (Pelosi, Newsome) with naked faces.  Disgusting.

----------

Brat (08-27-2021),Foghorn (08-27-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## tiny1

> Oh, but don't you care about the community? Especially the _global_ community? We are all in this together, you know. Trust the science!


No.  No, and not me, Hoss.
I do trust the science. I refuse to be a guinea Pig for anyone. I don't wear masks.  They don't work.  Study the science.
I don't want the vaccine.  It is not something I trust.  Do the research.  Study the science.
I believe in natural herd immunity.  Study the science.

Almost 2 years.  No mask.  In touch with the public daily.  I even caught Double Pneumonia, and was anemic at the same time.  Still here.  7 decades and I am still here.  Study the science.
Sheesh.

----------

Authentic (08-27-2021),Brat (08-27-2021),East of the Beast (08-27-2021),Foghorn (08-27-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> Overall?  You're not wrong.  There are much better ones out there; I'm just being extremely lazy in finding/posting a better one.
> 
> Considering the only difference between the vaccinated and unvaccinated is the severity of symptoms _when_ they contract any strain of the virus, any video works for dismantling the lies that the 'savior vaccines' are for our health.


Considering that severity of symptoms can be the difference between life and death, that's not entirely true.

And no, I'm not advocating for the vaccines as some sort of 100% effective miracle cure - there is no vaccine out there that is 100% effective and without any side-effects whatsoever - and I'm certainly not advocating for compulsory or mandatory vaccination, either.

Fact is, even if the vaccine were 100% effective and had 0% side-effects, I would still on point of principle resist mandatory or compulsory vaccination for this particular bug.

----------

OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## tiny1

> Considering that severity of symptoms can be the difference between life and death, that's not entirely true.
> 
> And no, I'm not advocating for the vaccines as some sort of 100% effective miracle cure - there is no vaccine out there that is 100% effective and without any side-effects whatsoever - and I'm certainly not advocating for compulsory or mandatory vaccination, either.
> 
> Fact is, even if the vaccine were 100% effective and had 0% side-effects, I would still on point of principle resist mandatory or compulsory vaccination for this particular bug.


Take the antibody cocktails and forget about it.  Take Hydroxychloroquine or Ivermectin.  Problem solved

----------


## East of the Beast

> I don't care if the shot works, or not.  I don't need a limey telling me what to put in my body.  Anyone who feels they want to make me pay, send me a text and I'll shoot you directions to my house.  C'mon and make me pay.  I Dare You.
> This is stupid.  We are in America.  I know it doesn't seem like it, with the Pretender in the WH, and all these European peons vying for the title of best American irritant.  But, I remembered quite recently that we are a free country.
> In your own country, go ahead.  Give up your rights.  Give up your guns.  Walk around with your PC nose up Achmed's ass if you want, but stay out of MY Neighborhood.
> The vaccine is controversial.  I don't Want it!!!  If you like it.....you take it.  Leave me the Hell Alone!


Hear! Hear!

----------

Brat (08-27-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## Authentic

I read a series of children's books in the 1980s. I can't remember the name of it but it was set in a small town in Utah at the turn of the 20th century.

In one book the main character got sick. His mother immediately pulled him and his healthy brothers and sisters out of school and placed them in the same room so that they would all be infected at once.

This happened for all the childhood illnesses and the kids developed natural immunity.

----------


## Authentic

Here it is. _The Great Brain_.

The Great Brain - Wikipedia

----------


## Oceander

> Take the antibody cocktails and forget about it.  Take Hydroxychloroquine or Ivermectin.  Problem solved


Nope, not entirely.

----------


## tiny1

> I read a series of children's books in the 1980s. I can't remember the name of it but it was set in a small town in Utah at the turn of the 20th century.
> 
> In one book the main character got sick. His mother immediately pulled him and his healthy brothers and sisters out of school and placed them in the same room so that they would all be infected at once.
> 
> This happened for all the childhood illnesses and the kids developed natural immunity.


My Grandmother, and by extension, my Mom, believed this:
If your child does not eat at least a pound of dirt by his 5th birthday, he'll be a sickly person his whole life.  They let us get mumps, together.  Same with chicken pox, and a host of other ailments.  We played in dirt all day, and only got one bath, at bedtime. We got sick in youth, but I have had very little susceptibility to viruses and the like.
SO, I don't need no stinkin' vaccine.

----------

Authentic (08-27-2021),Brat (08-27-2021),East of the Beast (08-27-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## tiny1

> Nope, not entirely.


Just because you believe the Sky is Falling, doesn't mean you are right.  This is all a scam.  And you buy into the scam.  
BTW, I am with the IRS and you are delinquent on your taxes to the tune of 1500 dollars, and if you send it to me post haste, I'll see that you are not arrested.
People are so gullible.

----------


## Oceander

> Just because you believe the Sky is Falling, doesn't mean you are right.  This is all a scam.  And you buy into the scam.  
> BTW, I am with the IRS and you are delinquent on your taxes to the tune of 1500 dollars, and if you send it to me post haste, I'll see that you are not arrested.
> People are so gullible.


Just because you believe the anti-vaxx fear pron, and the unwarranted, unjustified claims that simple OTC solutions are the 100% guaranteed magic bullet, doesn't make you correct.

The only one buying the scam here, is you.

----------


## Foghorn

Didn't the Supreme Court rule you can't penalize people for *not* doing something ?  (Obamacare)

----------

Brat (08-27-2021)

----------


## tiny1

> Just because you believe the anti-vaxx fear pron, and the unwarranted, unjustified claims that simple OTC solutions are the 100% guaranteed magic bullet, doesn't make you correct.
> 
> The only one buying the scam here, is you.


OK, Azzhead.  
Right now, I want your 100% assurance that, if I take the vaccine, and get sick, you'll take care of my family until they die.  Deal?  I mean, if you are so sure that it is the best protection I can have, why would you not guarantee it?

BECAUSE YOU CAN'T BE SURE YOU ARE CORRECT, can you now?  You are trying to get people to ignore their instincts, and do what YOU think is best for them.
Unless you are willing to put a little "skin" in the game, you need to shut the eff up and let people make their own decisions.
I am nearly 70 years old.  I don't need you to tell me what is best for me and mine.  
You like the vaccine?  Take the vaccine.  I freaking do not want it.
I am no antivaxer.  I took the flu shot.  You like being a guinea pig, have at it.  I have been lied to enough.  I refuse to believe you, or anyone else.  
Now, Hoss, my doctor ain't taking it, either.  Maybe you should contact her and let her know how wrong she is.
Sheesh.

----------


## pjohns

> Anyone who feels they want to make me pay, send me a text and I'll shoot you directions to my house.  C'mon and make me pay.  I Dare You.


Unfortunately, the process is well underway.

Some companies are now requiring proof of the jab as a condition of continued employment.  

And one company--I think it is Delta Airlines--is already charging a $200-per-month premium for healthcare insurance, for the unvaccinated.  

Fortunately, these matters do not affect me, directly, since (1) I am retired; and (2) I have healthcare insurance through my late wife's BC/BS plan (which I therefore do not pay premiums for).  

But my stepson just got the jab--very much against his will--because more and more places are now requiring proof of vaccination, just in order to let him inside.  

Next may come a star on the chest, for those "undesirables" who are not yet vaccinated...

----------

Oceander (08-27-2021)

----------


## Kodiak

> Just because you believe the anti-vaxx fear pron, and the unwarranted, unjustified claims that simple OTC solutions are the 100% guaranteed magic bullet, doesn't make you correct.
> 
> The only one buying the scam here, is you.


If the vaxx is so great, why are fully vaxxed Jesse Jackson and his wife in the hospital with Covid?

edit:  Oh, excuse me, that's probably more fear pron (porn).

----------

OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> OK, Azzhead.  
> Right now, I want your 100% assurance that, if I take the vaccine, and get sick, you'll take care of my family until they die.  Deal?  I mean, if you are so sure that it is the best protection I can have, why would you not guarantee it?
> 
> BECAUSE YOU CAN'T BE SURE YOU ARE CORRECT, can you now?  You are trying to get people to ignore their instincts, and do what YOU think is best for them.
> Unless you are willing to put a little "skin" in the game, you need to shut the eff up and let people make their own decisions.
> I am nearly 70 years old.  I don't need you to tell me what is best for me and mine.  
> You like the vaccine?  Take the vaccine.  I freaking do not want it.
> I am no antivaxer.  I took the flu shot.  You like being a guinea pig, have at it.  I have been lied to enough.  I refuse to believe you, or anyone else.  
> Now, Hoss, my doctor ain't taking it, either.  Maybe you should contact her and let her know how wrong she is.
> Sheesh.


Fuck off dildo.  And before you go crying waa-waa to the moderators, you started with the insults.

----------


## Authentic

If Delta Airlines wants to stop the Delta Variant, it should change its name.

----------

Oceander (08-27-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> If Delta Airlines wants to stop the Delta Variant, it should change its name.


They could try Lambda Airlines, but that might bring with it the wrong sort of connotations.

----------

Authentic (08-27-2021)

----------


## Authentic

> If the vaxx is so great, why are fully vaxxed Jesse Jackson and his wife in the hospital?


Racism.

----------

Rebel Yell (08-27-2021)

----------


## East of the Beast

> Unfortunately, the process is well underway.
> 
> Some companies are now requiring proof of the jab as a condition of continued employment.  
> 
> And one company--I think it is Delta Airlines--is already charging a $200-per-month premium for healthcare insurance, for the unvaccinated.  
> 
> Fortunately, these matters do not affect me, directly, since (1) I am retired; and (2) I have healthcare insurance through my late wife's BC/BS plan (which I therefore do not pay premiums for).  
> 
> But my stepson just got the jab--very much against his will--because more and more places are now requiring proof of vaccination, just in order to let him inside.  
> ...


I'll wear it with pride.

----------

pjohns (08-27-2021),Rebel Yell (08-27-2021)

----------


## Authentic

> I'll wear it with pride.


Lambda Airlines. We have pride when we fly, and it shows!

----------

Oceander (08-27-2021)

----------


## Trinnity

Naxis.  We're seeing in our Society  just  how popular Tyranny is among the  Citizens.

----------


## ruthless terrier

the author Banzhaf classifies non vaccinated people to be the same as smokers and the obese. it will be a cold day in hell when the government can force citizens to quit smoking and lose weight.

----------

pjohns (08-27-2021),Rebel Yell (08-27-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> Lambda Airlines. We have pride when we fly, and it shows!

----------

Authentic (08-27-2021),Foghorn (08-27-2021),pjohns (08-27-2021)

----------


## OneDumbBlonde

> the author Banzhaf classifies non vaccinated people to be the same as smokers and the obese. it will be a cold day in hell when the government can force citizens to quit smoking and lose weight.


Can you imagine having been in a coma for the past few years, and just now waking up to all the words and definitions that have been hijacked? The latest apparently being 'health'.

----------

East of the Beast (08-27-2021),Foghorn (08-27-2021),Kodiak (08-27-2021),pjohns (08-27-2021),Rebel Yell (08-27-2021)

----------


## Kodiak

> Can you imagine having been in a coma for the past few years, and just now waking up to all the words and definitions that have been hijacked? *The latest apparently being 'health'*.


.....and "infrastructure".

----------

OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021),pjohns (08-27-2021),Rebel Yell (08-27-2021)

----------


## Foghorn

> Can you imagine having been in a coma for the past few years, and just now waking up to all the words and definitions that have been hijacked? The latest apparently being 'health'.


Can't we all just reimagine health?


 :Nono:

----------

OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## OneDumbBlonde

> Can't we all just reimagine health?


Apparently so! It's the progressive thing to do. 

$cience!

----------

Foghorn (08-27-2021)

----------


## Rebel Yell

> My Grandmother, and by extension, my Mom, believed this:
> If your child does not eat at least a pound of dirt by his 5th birthday, he'll be a sickly person his whole life.  They let us get mumps, together.  Same with chicken pox, and a host of other ailments.  We played in dirt all day, and only got one bath, at bedtime. We got sick in youth, but I have had very little susceptibility to viruses and the like.
> SO, I don't need no stinkin' vaccine.



I went the same route, one of us would get sick and all were sent to great grandma's, she was old, she had seen it and had it all before, but even as her being so old, she had a strong immune system. I have a strong immune system for the same reasons as you, I hope to keep strong until my natural end, no genetic enhancement required nor wanted.

As an aside I also suffer no known allergies while enjoying my 6th decade.

----------

Foghorn (08-27-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-27-2021)

----------


## Frankenvoter

USDA: wild Ohio white-tailed deer first deer in world to be found with COVID-19 virus (msn.com)

No word on whether a leftist was "having relations" with the deer causing the infection, although I wouldn't doubt it.




> In July, researchers with the USDA found that 40% of wild white-tailed deer sampled from four states (Michigan, Pennsylvania, Illinois, and New York) had antibodies to SARS-CoV-2. 385 deer were sampled.

----------

12icer (08-27-2021),Big Bird (08-28-2021),Conservative Libertarian (08-27-2021),East of the Beast (08-28-2021),Madison (08-28-2021),Northern Rivers (08-27-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-28-2021),Quark (08-27-2021),QuaseMarco (08-27-2021),Rutabaga (08-27-2021)

----------


## Quark

I say we need to lockdown the country and weld everyone into their homes.

----------

East of the Beast (08-28-2021),Frankenvoter (08-28-2021),Madison (08-28-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-28-2021),Thom Paine (08-27-2021)

----------


## 12icer

Just get your burial insurance paid up, mine is. You will either get it every year till it kills you or you will die from something, HEHEHEH

----------

Frankenvoter (08-28-2021),Madison (08-28-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-28-2021),Quark (08-27-2021),Thom Paine (08-27-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

Lay in your horse paste.

Those who get it, and have an easy case of it, with EFFECTIVE medical treatment (self-administered)...have immunity.  Wide-spectrum immunity.

Those who got genetically re-engineered, are going to be susceptible to all minor variants of Wu Flu...while, meantime, their immune-system is compromised.  Quarterly boosters for a few years...because that's all your system can stand; you're dead.

Of the Gates cure.

----------

12icer (08-28-2021),Frankenvoter (08-28-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-28-2021),Quark (08-27-2021)

----------


## Physics Hunter

So deer are a potential source of Covid Antibodies...   :Thinking: 

Two thoughts about my favorite prey...

A) How the hell did they get it?  I guarantee they were not within 6' of any humans, and this time of year they tend to stay in extended family packs of does/yearlings/fawns, and small groups of bachelor bucks.?!?!?!?!??!?  

B) So if I kill and consume one, does it boost my immunity?   :Cool20:

----------

12icer (08-28-2021),Frankenvoter (08-28-2021),Madison (08-28-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-28-2021),Quark (08-28-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

what are the statistical odds of me catching covid or any variant thereof and dying from it?


hmmmm?


what are the odds of winning the state run lottery?


hmmmm?

now which one do you think i have better odds at acquiring?


i bet i'll be rich before i'm dead.

----------

12icer (08-28-2021),Frankenvoter (08-28-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-28-2021),Quark (08-28-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

July? So this was the Delta variant?

----------

12icer (08-28-2021),Frankenvoter (08-28-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-28-2021),Rutabaga (08-28-2021)

----------


## Old Ridge Runner

I think that Joe should mandate all deer infected with Covid have to wear a mask. That way when we go out this fall we will know which ones we can and can not shoot.

----------

12icer (08-28-2021),Frankenvoter (08-28-2021),JustPassinThru (08-28-2021),Madison (08-28-2021),nonsqtr (08-28-2021),Quark (08-28-2021),Rutabaga (08-28-2021)

----------


## Madison

And the world goes crazy!!!!

----------

12icer (08-28-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-29-2021),Quark (08-28-2021),Rutabaga (08-28-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

> A) How the hell did they get it?  I guarantee they were not within 6' of any humans, and this time of year they tend to stay in extended family packs of does/yearlings/fawns, and small groups of bachelor bucks.?!?!?!?!??!?


How'd they get it?  Obviously because we weren't wearing enough masks!  Two isn't working...THREE MASKS!  SO ORDERS **THE SCIENCE**, THE LITTLE 80-YEAR-OLD GOVERNMENT-EMPLOYED MILLIONAIRE WITH A FIFTY-YEAR-OLD MD DEGREE!

----------

12icer (08-28-2021),Kodiak (08-28-2021),Madison (08-28-2021),Old Ridge Runner (08-29-2021),Quark (08-28-2021),Rutabaga (08-28-2021)

----------


## 12icer

I have seen, but do not know the actual source, that all animals can get it since fakki and friends decided to make it a human virus. Reports are said to have been done on cats, dogs and chipmunks also and they were positive for covid. 
This may have been a common virus for animals and just had never made the leap before the stupidest people on earth decided they were smarter than GOD. 

Now the idiots have made another disease for our furry friends to deal with and spread. 
Maybe they are trying to pass it to cows so we wont be eating meat. 
LESS COWS MEANS LESS CARBON!! they say, What about the, "MILK PRODUCTION", idiots?
OH I forgot almond milk, I like that stuff myself  BUT it aint the same
dimshits and global warming green people are so shallow and monoplanic they should be walking around in a mental facility inthe dangerous ward.

----------

Madison (08-29-2021),Quark (08-28-2021),Rutabaga (08-28-2021)

----------


## Quark

> How'd they get it?  Obviously because we weren't wearing enough masks!  Two isn't working...THREE MASKS!  SO ORDERS **THE SCIENCE**, THE LITTLE 80-YEAR-OLD GOVERNMENT-EMPLOYED MILLIONAIRE WITH A FIFTY-YEAR-OLD MD DEGREE!


If we ever get a constitutional amendment with term limits for politicians it should also include term limits for judges, technocrats, and government employees. I'm thinking 2 terms for the House, 1 term for the Senate, 10 years for judges, technocrats, and employees.

----------

JustPassinThru (08-28-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

We won't get it, though.

We waited too long.

It's over.  Now we need to think of life apart from Imperial Washington.

----------

Quark (08-28-2021)

----------


## Quark

> We won't get it, though.
> 
> We waited too long.
> 
> It's over.  Now we need to think of life apart from Imperial Washington.


That's what I keep saying too but few listen. I figure "Atlas Shrugged" has to totally happen, rock bottom and then out of the ashes new smaller nation states.

----------


## JustPassinThru

> That's what I keep saying too but few listen. I figure "Atlas Shrugged" has to totally happen, rock bottom and then out of the ashes new smaller nation states.


I think we're seeing it.

The compromised immune systems from this genetic experiment.  Now they'll have to get updated mRNA shots, probably monthly.

The shock to the system will kill many of them.  The rest...will depend on Big Pharma for life.

The government will pay for it.

...oh, REALLY?  How long can this money-printing orgy go on?  I say, months; and then all fall down.

And Big Pharma as part of that.  A big operation, honest or crooked, has big overhead.  When money is no good, how do you pay researchers?  Lobbyists?  Bagmen?  Who pays for the monthly juice-jab?

Nobody, that's who.  That's when the bodies get stacked like cordwood.

----------


## nonsqtr

> I think we're seeing it.
> 
> The compromised immune systems from this genetic experiment.  Now they'll have to get updated mRNA shots, probably monthly.
> 
> The shock to the system will kill many of them.  The rest...will depend on Big Pharma for life.
> 
> The government will pay for it.
> 
> ...oh, REALLY?  How long can this money-printing orgy go on?  I say, months; and then all fall down.
> ...


We'll be at war with the Chinese first.

Economic conflicts always lead to military conflicts.

----------


## WarriorRob

Mirror:  Ireland Govt Forced to Admit COVID-19 DOES NOT Exist


This real or not, you decide :Dontknow:

----------

Big Dummy (08-28-2021),OneDumbBlonde (08-28-2021),Rutabaga (08-28-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

This article was published back in November 2020. So it's certainly not the most recent article on Covid 19. That being said, upon reading it in its entirety (I only skimmed it when it came out), I came to realize just how much information was packed into this thing. So I thought I'd share the introduction to it here, but I'd say the really good stuff gets started once you go further in. Coloured text links to other articles in the original.

**
Nov 17, 2020
Iain Davis

COVID 19, and the subsequent governmental responses, appear to be part of an international conspiracy to commit fraud. It seems there is no evidence that a virus called SARS-CoV-2 causes a disease called COVID 19.

Sometimes you have to go with your gut. I am not an expert in genetics and, as ever, stand to be corrected. However my attention was drawn to some research published by the Spanish medical journal D-Salud-Discovery. Their advisory board of eminently qualified physicians and scientists lends further credibility to their research. Their claim is astounding. 

The genetic primers and probes used in RT-PCR tests to identify SARS-CoV-2 do not target anything specific. I followed the search techniques outlined in this English translation of their report and can corroborate the accuracy of their claims about the nucleotide sequences listed in the World Health Organisations protocols. You can do the same. 

D-Salud-Discovery state there are no tests capable of identifying SARS-CoV-2. Consequently, all claims about the alleged impact of COVID 19 on population health are groundless. 

The entire official COVID 19 narrative is a deception. Ostensibly, there is no scientific foundation for any part of it. 

If these claims are accurate we can state that there is no evidence of a pandemic, merely the illusion of one. 

[snip]


*IDENTIFICATION OF WHAT EXACTLY?*

 The World Health Organisation (WHO) classified COVID-19 (COronaVIrus Disease 2019). They declared a global COVID 19 pandemic on March 11th [2020].

The WHO’s Laboratory testing guidance states:

_The etiologic agent [causation for the disease] responsible for the cluster of pneumonia cases in Wuhan has been identified as a novel betacoronavirus, (in the same family as SARS-CoV and MERS-CoV) via next generation sequencing (NGS) from cultured virus or directly from samples received from several pneumonia patients.”_


The WHO’s claim is that the SARS-CoV-2 virus causes the disease COVID-19. They also allege this virus has been clearly identified by researchers in Wuhan.

In the WHO’s *Novel Coronavirus 2019-nCov Situation Report 1*, they state:

_The Chinese authorities identified a new type of coronavirus, which was isolated on 7 January 2020……On 12 January 2020, China shared the genetic sequence of the novel coronavirus for countries to use in developing specific diagnostic kits.”_


These two statements from the WHO clearly suggest the SARS-CoV-2 virus was isolated (meaning purified for study) and then genetic sequences were _identified_ from the isolated sample. From this, diagnostic kits were developed and distributed globally to test for the virus in towns, cities and communities around the world. According to the WHO and Chinese researchers, these tests will find the virus that _causes_ COVID 19.

Yet the WHO also state:
"Working directly from sequence information, the team developed a series of genetic amplification (PCR) assays used by laboratories.”

The Wuhan scientists developed their genetic amplification assays from _“sequence information”_ because there was no isolated, purified sample of the so called SARS-CoV-2 virus. They also showed electron microscope images of the newly discovered virions (the spiky protein ball containing the viral RNA.)

However, such protein structures are not unique. They look just like other round vesicles, such as endocytic vesicles and exosomes.

Virologists claim that it is not possible to _“isolate”_ a virus because they only replicate inside host cells. They add that *Koch’s postulates* do not apply because they relate to bacteria (which are living organisms). Instead, virologists observe the virus’ cytopathogenic effects (CPE), causing cell mutation and degradation, in cell cultures.

When Chinese researchers *first sequenced* the full SARS-CoV-2 genome they observed CPE in Vero E6 and Huh7 cells. Vero E6 are an immortalised monkey cell line and Huh7 are immortalised cancer (tumorigenic) cells. Meaning they have been maintained in vitro (in petri dish cultures) for many years.

Central to the official SARS-CoV-2 story is the idea that it is a zoonotic virus, capable of bridging the species gap from animals to humans. When *scientists from the US CDC*_“infected”_ various cells with the novel virus they noted the following:
_We examined the capacity of SARS-CoV-2 to infect and replicate in several common primate and human cell lines, including human adenocarcinoma cells (A549) [lung celles], human liver cells (HUH7.0), and human embryonic kidney cells (HEK-293T), in addition to Vero E6 and Vero CCL81 [monkey cells]…No cytopathic effect was observed in any of the cell lines except in Vero cells [monkey cells]…HUH7.0 and 293T cells showed only modest viral replication and A549 cells [human lung tissue cells] were incompatible with SARS-CoV-2 infection.”_

The CDC did not observe any CPE in human cells. They saw no evidence that this alleged virus caused any human illness. Nor did this supposed human virus show any notable replication in human cells, suggesting human to human infection would be impossible. 

Noting this problem, a team of Polish scientists introduced this sequenced “virus” to human epithethelium (airway) cells. They observed the effects on these HAE cultures for 5 days. They noted much greater replication than the CDC scientists but ultimately stated:

_“We did not observe any release of the virus from the basolateral side of the HAE culture.”_

Meaning they did not see any evidence of the supposed virions breaching the cell wall membrane. Again suggesting this so called virus isn’t infectious in human beings.

It is not clear that SARS-CoV-2 is a human virus capable of causing illness. It may not even physically exist. Is it nothing more than a concept based upon predictive genetic sequences?

**

Full article here:
https://off-guardian.org/2020/11/17/...-global-fraud/

----------

OneDumbBlonde (08-28-2021),Rutabaga (08-28-2021),Thom Paine (08-28-2021),WarriorRob (08-28-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

ireland is real,,,i've seen pictures...

----------

OneDumbBlonde (08-28-2021),WarriorRob (08-28-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

I have had my doubts from the beginning, always thought it was a bad flu season, heard when "Covid-19" hit they lumped all deaths into Covid deaths, if you had "Covid" or flu when you died, you died of covid :Dontknow:  Here is how many people died in the U.S. 2019-2020

approximately 3,358,814 deaths† occurred in the United States. From 2019 to 2020

This is from "Covid-19" 2020

The COVID-19 pandemic caused approximately 375,000 deaths in the United States during 2020.


I also heard when "Covid-19" hit mostly old and people with underlining medical issues were dying, now after the vaccines are rolled out, young people are dying, so how do they explain that :Dontknow:  I really don't trust our Government especially with the current Administration, our founding fathers gave us the 2nd Amendment for a reason, it wasn't for shits and grins, they knew Government can become corrupt and tyrannical or drunk with power, my opinion :Dontknow:

----------

phoenyx (08-29-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> I have had my doubts from the beginning, always thought it was a bad flu season, heard when "Covid-19" hit they lumped all deaths into Covid deaths, if you had "Covid" or flu when you died, you died of covid Here is how many people died in the U.S. 2019-2020
> 
> approximately 3,358,814 deaths† occurred in the United States. From 2019 to 2020
> 
> This is from "Covid-19" 2020
> 
> The COVID-19 pandemic caused approximately 375,000 deaths in the United States during 2020.
> 
> 
> I also heard when "Covid-19" hit mostly old and people with underlining medical issues were dying, now after the vaccines are rolled out, young people are dying, so how do they explain that I really don't trust our Government especially with the current Administration, our founding fathers gave us the 2nd Amendment for a reason, it wasn't for shits and grins, they knew Government can become corrupt and tyrannical or drunk with power, my opinion


Yeah. What I find most surprising is the truth behind this alleged idea that there have been "excess deaths". I thought, surely there must be serious evidence for it globally. Turns out, there isn't. I just made a thread about it here:
Global Deaths- what do they tell us about the truth of Covid deaths?

----------

WarriorRob (08-28-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

People, PLEASE stop posting this highly unscientific CRAP in the science section!

Of COURSE Covid exists, it's plainly self evident that it exists.

Duh.

Come on people, this kinda stupid shit GIVES CONSERVATIVES A BAD NAME.

----------


## nonsqtr

:Geez: 

Where do you people find this crap?

Betcha you have to look hard to find it...

The other thing is, please CHECK into what you're posting, BEFORE you post it.

Adenocarcinoma cells are NOT "lung cells".

Please, don't post this crap if you don't understand what you're posting.

----------


## WarriorRob

> Yeah. What I find most surprising is the truth behind this alleged idea that there have been "excess deaths". I thought, surely there must be serious evidence for it globally. Turns out, there isn't. I just made a thread about it here:
> Global Deaths- what do they tell us about the truth of Covid deaths?


Your thread is what I was trying to get at, deaths don't actually match up to a "Worldwide Pandemic". I sadly believe since we are getting vaccinated, by this winter we will be getting double the deaths from "Covid" if I'm right that means the Vaccines are causing "Covid" and killing people, hope I'm wrong.

----------

OneDumbBlonde (08-29-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> Your thread is what I was trying to get at, deaths don't actually match up to a "Worldwide Pandemic". I sadly believe since we are getting vaccinated, by this winter we will be getting double the deaths from "Covid" if I'm right that means the Vaccines are causing "Covid" and killing people, hope I'm wrong.


Same. On a sidenote, someone on another site pointed out that the numbers for 2020 were estimated, not actual. I feel foolish, but I'm glad it was pointed out to me so I can retract what I said for now and wait until we get more accurate numbers.

----------

WarriorRob (08-28-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> Same. On a sidenote, someone on another site pointed out that the numbers for 2020 were estimated, not actual. I feel foolish, but I'm glad it was pointed out to me so I can retract what I said for now and wait until we get more accurate numbers.


We are all looking for answers, we know the vaccine crap is B.S., it just about making money. I do believe there is some truth to the depopulation conspiracy theory, Bill Gates holds seminars on just that, heard he bought the covid testing rights or something, him and Soros. I posted a link to it awhile back. I hate to see the death toll come winter, just hope I'm wrong about that.

----------

OneDumbBlonde (08-29-2021),phoenyx (08-29-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

Japan Pulls 1.6 Million Moderna Vaccines Over Contamination, Substance May Have Been Metal - National File


Its a substance that reacts to magnets, a ministry official said. It could be metal. :Thinking: 


This is why I refuse to put this poison in my body :Geez:

----------

nonsqtr (08-29-2021),Quark (08-28-2021)

----------


## Thom Paine

i probably shouldn't open my mouth .. but...
oops......     can't find corroboration.    sorry folks

shouldn't have opened my mouth..

Nice evening to y'all.

----------

Northern Rivers (08-28-2021)

----------


## Someguy

Reacts to magnets.   Does it react to 5G?

----------


## Quark

> Japan Pulls 1.6 Million Moderna Vaccines Over Contamination, Substance May Have Been Metal - National File
> 
> 
> “It’s a substance that reacts to magnets,” a ministry official said. “It could be metal.”
> 
> 
> This is why I refuse to put this poison in my body


Same here. That metal is the RFID chip for tracking and killing people who go off the communist reservation. Many people are complaining about magnet sticking to their arms and cell going bonkers. Yup yesterday's conspiracy is today's truth.

----------

WarriorRob (08-28-2021)

----------


## crayons

> Japan Pulls 1.6 Million Moderna Vaccines Over Contamination, Substance May Have Been Metal - National File
> 
> 
> Its a substance that reacts to magnets, a ministry official said. It could be metal.
> 
> 
> This is why I refuse to put this poison in my body


from asia.nikkei.com
Two die in Japan after shots from suspended Moderna vaccines

The ministry said later in the day that the substance that had been mixed in may have been metal. "It's a substance that reacts to magnets," a ministry official said. "It could be metal."

Takeda Pharmaceutical handles distribution of the U.S.-developed Moderna vaccine in Japan.

crayedit: yeppers the Davos crowd doesn't like the Japanese either>>>the rurals live to be over 100 yrs old...luci's don't like that.
It's either iron or graphene oxide attracting the magnets

----------

Quark (08-28-2021),WarriorRob (08-28-2021)

----------


## Physics Hunter

> How'd they get it?  Obviously because we weren't wearing enough masks!  Two isn't working...THREE MASKS!  SO ORDERS **THE SCIENCE**, THE LITTLE 80-YEAR-OLD GOVERNMENT-EMPLOYED MILLIONAIRE WITH A FIFTY-YEAR-OLD MD DEGREE!


Thought about it some more, Occam's Razor says flawed test...

----------


## phoenyx

> We are all looking for answers, we know the vaccine crap is B.S., it just about making money. I do believe there is some truth to the depopulation conspiracy theory, Bill Gates holds seminars on just that, heard he bought the covid testing rights or something, him and Soros. I posted a link to it awhile back. I hate to see the death toll come winter, just hope I'm wrong about that.


If the CDC's estimates of 2020 are accurate, the excess deaths have already arrived in the U.S.:
Provisional Mortality Data â United States, 2020  | MMWR

----------

WarriorRob (08-29-2021)

----------


## Old Tex

“It’s a substance that reacts to magnets,” a ministry official said. “It could be metal.” :Thinking: 

I knew it! It nothing more than watered down Ironman blood!

----------


## Old Ridge Runner

> How'd they get it?  Obviously because we weren't wearing enough masks!  Two isn't working...THREE MASKS!  SO ORDERS **THE SCIENCE**, THE LITTLE 80-YEAR-OLD GOVERNMENT-EMPLOYED MILLIONAIRE WITH A FIFTY-YEAR-OLD MD DEGREE!


I'd like to know that, the deer are in and open air environment.  There is going to be a lot of hell raised it PA. shuts down deer season this fall.

----------


## Authentic

> It certainly goes against the mainstream medical dogma, yes. That being said, your notion that the authors of the book don't have any kind of medical education is absolutely false. Here's the bio on Thomas S. Kowan:
> **
> Dr. Tom Cowan discovered the work of the      two   men who would have the most   influence on his  career while teaching   gardening as a Peace  Corps volunteer in     Swaziland, South Africa. He read _Nutrition   and PhysicalDegeneration_ by   Weston   A.Price, as well as Rudolf Steiner’s   work on   biodynamic agriculture. These events         inspired   him to pursue a medical degree.   Tom   graduated   from Michigan State     University   College of   Human Medicine in   1984. After his residency in Family Practice at Johnson City Hospital in Johnson City, New York, he set up an anthroposophical medical practice in Peterborough, New Hampshire. Dr. Cowan relocated to San Francisco in 2003.
> Dr. Cowan has served as vice president of the Physicians Association for Anthroposophical Medicine and is a founding board member of the Weston A. Price Foundation™.  During his career he has studied and written about many subjects in medicine. These include nutrition, anthroposophical medicine and herbal medicine. He is the author of three books published by Chelsea Green: _Cancer and the New Biology of Water; Vaccines, Autoimmunity and the Changing Nature of Childhood Illness, and Human Heart, Cosmic Heart. He is the principal author of The Fourfold Path to Healing, which was published in 2004 by New Trends Publishing, and is the co-author of The Nourishing Traditions Book of Baby & Child Care, published in 2013. He has lectured throughout the United States and is a frequent guest on health-related podcasts. He has three grown children and six grandchildren and practices medicine in San Francisco, where he resides with his wife, Lynda Smith._
> **
> Source:
> https://fourfoldhealing.com/pages/about-us
> 
> 
> ...


GcMAF - trust the science.

----------


## nonsqtr

> Japan Pulls 1.6 Million Moderna Vaccines Over Contamination, Substance May Have Been Metal - National File
> 
> 
> “It’s a substance that reacts to magnets,” a ministry official said. “It could be metal.”
> 
> 
> This is why I refuse to put this poison in my body


Contamination is a real and serious possibility.

----------

WarriorRob (08-29-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> Same here. That metal is the RFID chip for tracking and killing people who go off the communist reservation. Many people are complaining about magnet sticking to their arms and cell going bonkers. Yup yesterday's conspiracy is today's truth.


There is NO evidence for that. ZERO.

Cut the crap, will ya?

NO ONE HAS EVER FOUND ANY RFID, IN ANY OF THE VACCINES.

If there were any RFID, we would have found it by now. (People have been looking).

"Manufacturing issue at a plant in Spain".

Yes, metallic particulate contamination could be magnetic AND could respond to radio waves. (And oxygen and phosphorous are both paramagnetic).

----------

Hillofbeans (08-29-2021)

----------


## Hillofbeans

> There is NO evidence for that. ZERO.
> 
> Cut the crap, will ya?
> 
> NO ONE HAS EVER FOUND ANY RFID, IN ANY OF THE VACCINES.
> 
> If there were any RFID, we would have found it by now. (People have been looking).
> 
> "Manufacturing issue at a plant in Spain".
> ...


You have to chip Thoroughbreds now to register them, no way that chip went through the needle i got the shot with

----------


## Trinnity

*This thread is for the legal, societal and political aspects of COVID. Vaccines are in another STICKY in this forum. Please add to this thread or yours may be moved.*

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> Japan Pulls 1.6 Million Moderna Vaccines Over Contamination, Substance May Have Been Metal - National File
> 
> 
> “* It’s a substance that reacts to magnets,” a ministry official said. “It could be metal.* ”
> 
> 
> This is why I refuse to put this poison in my body


For those who are interested...



> * All substances exhibit some type of magnetism*. Magnetic materials are classified according to their bulk susceptibility.[1] Ferromagnetism is responsible for most of the effects of magnetism encountered in everyday life, but there are actually several types of magnetism. Paramagnetic substances, such as aluminum and oxygen, are weakly attracted to an applied magnetic field; diamagnetic substances, such as copper and carbon, are weakly repelled; while antiferromagnetic materials, such as chromium and spin glasses, have a more complex relationship with a magnetic field. The force of a magnet on paramagnetic, diamagnetic, and antiferromagnetic materials is usually too weak to be felt and can be detected only by laboratory instruments, so in everyday life, these substances are often described as non-magnetic.


High school or 1st/2nd semester physics... or bathroom reading... for those with an interest.

----------


## phoenyx

> Where do you people find this crap?
> 
> Betcha you have to look hard to find it...
> 
> The other thing is, please CHECK into what you're posting, BEFORE you post it.
> 
> Adenocarcinoma cells are NOT "lung cells".



For you edification:
**
*Lung adenocarcinoma* is a cancer that occurs due to abnormal and uncontrolled cell growth in the lungs. It is a subtype of non-small cell lung cancer that is often diagnosed in an outer area of the lung. Early lung cancers may not be associated with any signs and symptoms. As the condition progresses, affected people can experience chest pain, a persistent cough, fatigue, coughing up blood, loss of appetite, unexplained weight loss, shortness of breath, and/or wheezing. The underlying cause of lung adenocarcinoma is generally unknown; however, risk factors for developing a lung cancer include smoking; exposure to secondhand smoke and other toxic chemicals; a family history of lung cancer; previous radiation treatment to the chest or breast; and HIV infection. Treatment varies based on the severity of the condition, the associated signs and symptoms and the affected person's overall health. It may include a combination of surgery, radiation therapy, chemotherapy, targeted therapy, and/or watchful waiting.[1][2][3]
**

Source:
Lung adenocarcinoma             | Genetic and Rare Diseases Information Center (GARD) â an NCATS Program

----------


## WarriorRob

BREAKING: Joe Rogan Got COVID, Treated It With Vitamins, Ivermectin, And Other Drugs, Recovered In THREE Days - National File


So we immediately threw the kitchen sink at it, all kinds of meds, monoclonal antibodies, ivermectin, Z-Pak, prednisone, everything, Rogan continued. Uh, and I also got an NAD drip and a vitamin drip and I did that three days in a row. And so, here we are on Wednesday, and I feel great. I really only had one bad day, Sunday sucked, but Monday was better, Tuesday felt better than Monday, and today I actually feel good. I feel pretty f**king good. Uh, thats the good news. The bad news is we have to move the Friday show in Nashville.

----------

dinosaur (09-01-2021),Hermannsdenkmal (09-01-2021),phoenyx (09-02-2021),Physics Hunter (09-02-2021),Rutabaga (09-01-2021)

----------


## Hermannsdenkmal

> BREAKING: Joe Rogan Got COVID, Treated It With Vitamins, Ivermectin, And Other Drugs, Recovered In THREE Days - National File
> 
> 
> “So we immediately threw the kitchen sink at it, all kinds of meds, monoclonal antibodies, ivermectin, Z-Pak, prednisone, everything,” Rogan continued. “Uh, and I also got an NAD drip and a vitamin drip and I did that three days in a row. And so, here we are on Wednesday, and I feel great. I really only had one bad day, Sunday sucked, but Monday was better, Tuesday felt better than Monday, and today I actually feel good. I feel pretty f**king good. Uh, that’s the good news. The bad news is we have to move the Friday show in Nashville.”


But those aren't making billions of dollars for Big Pharma which owns Anthony Fauci and Rochelle Wolensky, so we can't take this seriously. 

RonaBux.png

----------

dinosaur (09-01-2021),Hillofbeans (09-02-2021),phoenyx (09-02-2021),WarriorRob (09-01-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> But those aren't making billions of dollars for Big Pharma which owns Anthony Fauci and Rochelle Wolensky, so we can't take this seriously. 
> 
> RonaBux.png


Exactly, my opinion they want to keep people sick so they can make Billions more, heard they are getting ready to roll out Covid-19 pills :Thinking:

----------

dinosaur (09-01-2021),Foghorn (09-02-2021),Hermannsdenkmal (09-01-2021),phoenyx (09-02-2021)

----------


## Hermannsdenkmal

> Exactly, my opinion they want to keep people sick so they can make Billions more, heard they are getting ready to roll out Covid-19 pills


It used to be In God We Trust, today it's In Greed We Trust. America is a corporation, not a country. Look at Joe Briben bringing in 200k new employees from Afghanistan.

----------

Rutabaga (09-01-2021),WarriorRob (09-01-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

i had covid...2 weeks later i didnt...


my body worked exactly as designed, no mystery dope necessary.

----------

Foghorn (09-02-2021),keymanjim (09-01-2021),phoenyx (09-02-2021),WarriorRob (09-01-2021)

----------


## keymanjim

> i had covid...2 weeks later i didnt...
> 
> 
> my body worked exactly as designed, no mystery dope necessary.


Two weeks? Mine was a day and a half.
I had a rougher time with a stomach virus my niece brought home.

----------

Foghorn (09-02-2021),phoenyx (09-02-2021),Rutabaga (09-02-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

> Two weeks? Mine was a day and a half.
> I had a rougher time with a stomach virus my niece brought home.


2 weeks...no appetite, sleep alot, water tasted bad, shortness of breath, mild fever...no nausea, shits or puke.

----------

Foghorn (09-02-2021)

----------


## El Guapo

> So we immediately threw the kitchen sink at it, all kinds of meds, monoclonal antibodies, ivermectin, Z-Pak, prednisone, everything,” Rogan continued. “Uh, and I also got an NAD drip and a vitamin drip and I did that three days in a row.



 Sounds like a total headcase.

----------


## TLSG

Prednisone is an anti-inflammatory drug. I was put on that back in May when I had a rib injury.

----------


## kazenatsu

The big pharmaceutical company Pfizer is now developing a COVID pill that is meant to be taken alongside the COVID vaccines that have already made the company a staggering amount of money. The new pill is expected to be released by the end of the year and will be required to be taken twice per day.

https://nationalfile.com/pfizer-is-n...side-vaccines/


Pfizer's pill is based on an older anti-viral technology, using something called a protease inhibitor.
These type of protease inhibitor pills have been used for many years to treat HIV and hepatitis C.

source here:
Pfizer taps HIV, hep C antiviral research for COVID-19 pill trial | FierceBiotech


Interestingly, the mechanism of action of ivermectin against Covid is also as a protease inhibitor.
Ivermectin is the so-called "de-wormer" that the Progressive Left media ridicules Conservatives for supporting as an alternative treatment for Covid.

source here: Identification of 3-chymotrypsin like protease (3CLPro) inhibitors as potential anti-SARS-CoV-2 agents | Communications Biology (nature.com)

Some of you may not know this, but it's very common for pharmaceutical companies to take something that they think works, and then develop an alternate version of it that they are able to patent. It takes a tremendous investment of money to get it to pass all the clinical tests. So often the natural or older medications are simply ignored for new treatments, because there is no way to secure a patent on them.

Ivermectin was discovered in the late 1970s and Merck's patent on it expired in 1996.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-02-2021),dinosaur (09-02-2021),Fall River (09-02-2021),WarriorRob (09-02-2021)

----------


## Kodiak

So the shots aren't working and now it's Plan B.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-02-2021),dinosaur (09-02-2021),FNguy (09-02-2021),phoenyx (09-02-2021),Rebel Yell (09-02-2021),TLSG (09-02-2021),WarriorRob (09-02-2021)

----------


## Traddles

*Evidence mounts that MMR and TDAP vaccines strengthen protection against severe COVID-19*

https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-...-vaccines.html




> Vaccines are designed to induce a strong and long-lasting immune response through the creation of memory T cells and B cells. The Measles-Mumps-Rubella (MMR) vaccine, given during early childhood, and Tetanus-Diphtheria-Pertussis (Tdap) vaccine, given every 10 years, are known to elicit a protective response against the diseases from which the vaccines get their names. But these vaccines may have an unexpected bonus: It's possible that they also elicit cross-reactive memory T cells capable of responding to protein targets called antigens that are present in other microbes that cause diseasesincluding the viral antigens in SARS-CoV-2. The concept is that pre-existing memory T cells generated by prior MMR or Tdap vaccination and activated by SARS-CoV-2 infection give the immune system a head start in responding to SARS-CoV-2, thereby lowering the risk of severe COVID-19.


There has been speculation about this for quite a while. In addition to the actual vaccine active ingredients, one or both may include an adjuvant, which is a general immune system booster whose purpose is to improve the effectiveness of the vaccine's active ingredients.

It's interesting that three of the six diseases are caused by bacteria, and therefore the Tdap vaccine targets proteins created by those bacteria or are part of those bacteria. IOW, the Tdap vaccine, which has been around for quite a while, does not use traditional dead/inactivated virus vaccine technology.

----------

donttread (09-02-2021),Sunsettommy (09-02-2021)

----------


## Traddles

> So the shots aren't working and now it's Plan B.


Since this drug was first synthesized in July 2020, it could not be related to the success or non-success of the BioNTech/Pfizer vaccine, https://cen.acs.org/acs-news/acs-mee...ARS-CoV/99/i13 .

----------


## nonsqtr

Is it a blue pill or a red pill?

----------


## Fall River

"....vaccines have already made the company a staggering amount of money."

But Pfizer has to spend a staggering amount of money in order to make a staggering amount of money.

They do expensive research on a lot of promising new drugs that don't pan out.  And that's figured into the cost and price of drugs that do get approved.

----------

Hillofbeans (09-02-2021),Oceander (09-02-2021),WarriorRob (09-02-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> "....vaccines have already made the company a staggering amount of money."
> 
> But Pfizer has to spend a staggering amount of money in order to make a staggering amount of money.
> 
> They do expensive research on a lot of promising new drugs that don't pan out.  And that's figured into the cost and price of drugs that do get approved.


Exactly.  Drug companies are not typically alchemists turning dross into gold.  It's like the difference between single-entry and double-entry bookkeeping; focusing on only one side of the ledger is completely misleading.

----------


## donttread

> *Evidence mounts that MMR and TDAP vaccines strengthen protection against severe COVID-19*
> 
> https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-...-vaccines.html
> 
> 
> 
> There has been speculation about this for quite a while. In addition to the actual vaccine active ingredients, one or both may include an adjuvant, which is a general immune system booster whose purpose is to improve the effectiveness of the vaccine's active ingredients.
> 
> It's interesting that three of the six diseases are caused by bacteria, and therefore the Tdap vaccine targets proteins created by those bacteria or are part of those bacteria. IOW, the Tdap vaccine, which has been around for quite a while, does not use traditional dead/inactivated virus vaccine technology.


Well that might explain the kids near immunity

----------


## East of the Beast

> *Evidence mounts that MMR and TDAP vaccines strengthen protection against severe COVID-19*
> 
> https://medicalxpress.com/news/2021-...-vaccines.html
> 
> 
> 
> There has been speculation about this for quite a while. In addition to the actual vaccine active ingredients, one or both may include an adjuvant, which is a general immune system booster whose purpose is to improve the effectiveness of the vaccine's active ingredients.
> 
> It's interesting that three of the six diseases are caused by bacteria, and therefore the Tdap vaccine targets proteins created by those bacteria or are part of those bacteria. IOW, the Tdap vaccine, which has been around for quite a while, does not use traditional dead/inactivated virus vaccine technology.


I've had the TDAP....Had to have it in order to be around my newborn grandbabies. Might be why I'm COVID resistant.

----------

12icer (09-02-2021),Oceander (09-02-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

Just about making more money :Geez: wonder what the side effects are going to be for this, Bell Palsy, heart Disease, stroke, Kidney failure, sudden death :Thinking:

----------


## Fall River

> Exactly.  Drug companies are not typically alchemists turning dross into gold.  It's like the difference between single-entry and double-entry bookkeeping; focusing on only one side of the ledger is completely misleading.


Perhaps you could give us an example on exactly how this "double-entry bookkeeping" works.  (Don't leave out any details.)

----------


## WarriorRob

VACCINATED ARE.. DROPPING LIKE FLIES... .. [.]


Are we really surprised :Dontknow:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),East of the Beast (09-05-2021),Gracie (09-06-2021),Hermannsdenkmal (09-05-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),Quark (09-05-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021)

----------


## East of the Beast

What say ye provaxxers?

Offer up your best explanation.

----------

Hermannsdenkmal (09-05-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),Quark (09-05-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-05-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> VACCINATED ARE.. DROPPING LIKE FLIES... .. [.]
> 
> 
> Are we really surprised


The media is putting the public at risk with their FAILURE to report accurately and their ACTIVE CENSORSHIP of important information.

The MSM is CREATING a public health risk.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),JustPassinThru (09-06-2021),Kodiak (09-05-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),Quark (09-05-2021),WarriorRob (09-05-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> VACCINATED ARE.. DROPPING LIKE FLIES... .. [.]
> 
> 
> Are we really surprised


No, we're not.

West Virginia Gov. Jim Justice opposes vaccine mandate for state employees | WV News | wvnews.com

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-05-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

Most of the US data so far shows about a 10:1 ratio of unvaccinated to fully vaccinated in the hospital. 

However this data is markedly different from that in Israel, and we need to understand why

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),Old Tex (09-05-2021),WarriorRob (09-05-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

Investigative Report: Rolling Stone Issues  After Horse De-wormer Hit Piece Debunked


MSM are the enemy of the people :Angry20:  11 people got minor ailments like Nausea and Diarrhea, none died :Angry20:

----------

Camp (09-06-2021),Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),Lone Gunman (09-05-2021),tlmjl (09-05-2021)

----------


## Conservative Libertarian

> Most of the US data so far shows about a 10:1 ratio of unvaccinated to fully vaccinated in the hospital. 
> 
> However this data is markedly different from that in Israel, and we need to understand why


Honesty in data reporting?

----------

East of the Beast (09-06-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-05-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> Most of the US data so far shows about a 10:1 ratio of unvaccinated to fully vaccinated in the hospital. 
> 
> However this data is markedly different from that in Israel, and we need to understand why


If that's true, heard some hospitals are turning away unvaccinated, so how can the hospitals be full of unvaccinated :Thinking:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),East of the Beast (09-06-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),tlmjl (09-05-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> If that's true, heard some hospitals are turning away unvaccinated, so how can the hospitals be full of unvaccinated


No US hospitals are turning away the unvaccinated, that would be completely illegal.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021),Sunsettommy (09-05-2021),WarriorRob (09-05-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> No US hospitals are turning away the unvaccinated, that would be completely illegal.



The hospitals are full of people who have been vaccinated.


This Doctor says vaccinated are in Hospitals, hard to hear him though, it's a different state, would imagine it's the same everywhere. I know it's against the law for not taking in people that aren't vaccinated, heard some Hospitals might or they already have :Dontknow:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),East of the Beast (09-06-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),Quark (09-05-2021)

----------


## tlmjl

Really boggled down with this MSM rhetoric....what compels them to be that way?  Don't they care about Americans...people?  The more time goes by the more I see the presence of evil within our country.  You would think they would want to help people instead of leading them astray.  

Before long one might think their horns would start to show....geesh!

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),Lone Gunman (09-05-2021),WarriorRob (09-05-2021)

----------


## Old Tex

> Most of the US data so far shows about a 10:1 ratio of unvaccinated to fully vaccinated in the hospital. 
> However this data is markedly different from that in Israel, and we need to understand why


I'll throw out my theory. Here goes: Israel's government doesn't lie as much as our government. But then Israel's politicians didn't have the inside track to buy stock in those drug companies like our politicians did.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),East of the Beast (09-06-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021),Quark (09-05-2021),Sunsettommy (09-05-2021),WarriorRob (09-05-2021)

----------


## Hermannsdenkmal

> What say ye provaxxers?
> 
> Offer up your best explanation.


1630753241600.jpg

This is them in 2022.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-05-2021),East of the Beast (09-05-2021),Kodiak (09-05-2021),phoenyx (09-05-2021),Quark (09-05-2021),WarriorRob (09-05-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> Most of the US data so far shows about a 10:1 ratio of unvaccinated to fully vaccinated in the hospital. 
> 
> However this data is markedly different from that in Israel, and we need to understand why


Not sure of the quantitative effect on covid ... but Palestinians make up about 20% of the population and only 10% of them have been vaccinated

----------


## Hermannsdenkmal

> Israel's government doesn't lie as much as our government.


 :Smiley ROFLMAO:

----------


## nonsqtr

https://www.newsmax.com/newsfront/ro...05/id/1035166/

----------


## Quark

> VACCINATED ARE.. DROPPING LIKE FLIES... .. [.]
> 
> 
> Are we really surprised


Yup that's a fact Jack.

----------

WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

> No, we're not.
> 
> West Virginia Gov. Jim Justice opposes vaccine mandate for state employees | WV News | wvnews.com


The Governor wishes everybody would be vaccinated just at the same time he admits the vaccinated are dropping like flies. No wonder intelligent people don't believe any crap coming out of government. Government has no idea of what they are saying.

----------

East of the Beast (09-06-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-06-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> The hospitals are full of people who have been vaccinated.
> 
> 
> This Doctor says vaccinated are in Hospitals, hard to hear him though, it's a different state, would imagine it's the same everywhere. I know it's against the law for not taking in people that aren't vaccinated, heard some Hospitals might or they already have


Wait.. in another thread I read this:



> It's been that way from day one. Hospitals list all deaths as COVID to get more government funds.


And in yet another thread, this:



> Right.    Died with Covid as measured by a flawed phony test.



So... *which is it?* Are the hospitalizations really from COVID or are the hospitals just making it up using flawed phony tests to get more money?

It's intellectual honesty time. I think this question: "*which is it?*" may be the equivalent of this scene to the antivax fear mongers.



 :Drinkupbitchesuo1:

----------


## Dan40

> VACCINATED ARE.. DROPPING LIKE FLIES... .. [.]
> 
> 
> Are we really surprised


Absolutely meaningless statistics.  HOW MANY IS A 25% INCREASE?  Wht % is 5 if there were 4 before?  What % is 125 if there were 100 before?  This is a POLITICIAN speaking.  What % of them are truthful?

----------


## Dan40

> The Governor wishes everybody would be vaccinated jest at the same time he admits the vaccinated are dropping like flies. No wonder intelligent people don't believe any crap coming out of government. Government has no idea of what they are saying.


The Government liars KNOW they are lying, and WHY  they are lying!

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## Dan40

> What say ye provaxxers?
> 
> Offer up your best explanation.


I'm not a provaxxer, individual choice is how it should be.  See post#17.  We CANNOT choose to believe any politician just because you like what they say for once.  25% is what EXACT number more than previous?  From 3 deaths to 4 deaths?  From 300,000 deaths to 400,000 deaths?  When a politician quotes percentages,  he's lying to you!

----------


## nonsqtr

> Absolutely meaningless statistics.  HOW MANY IS A 25% INCREASE?  Wht % is 5 if there were 4 before?  What % is 125 if there were 100 before?  This is a POLITICIAN speaking.  What % of them are truthful?


W Va has about 3000 hospitalizations (ballpark).

About 1500 of them are unvaccinated.

About 1200 only got one dose of the vaccine 

About 300 are fully vaccinated.

----------


## Dan40

> If that's true, heard some hospitals are turning away unvaccinated, so how can the hospitals be full of unvaccinated


You heard bullshit  There's plenty of it to hear.  From ALL sides.

----------


## nonsqtr

https://www.vdh.virginia.gov/coronav...nation-status/

----------


## Dan40

> W Va has about 3000 hospitalizations (ballpark).
> 
> About 1500 of them are unvaccinated.
> 
> About 1200 only got one dose of the vaccine 
> 
> About 300 are fully vaccinated.


So 300 out of 3000 hospitalized.  1 in 10.  Which agrees with a previous post.  And 300 is an increase of what former  number?

----------


## QuaseMarco

If at first you don't succeed, try try again........ Israel is gearing up for a 4th vaccine..... another booster.

What was that definition of stupidity again?

*Israel Preparing to Administer FOURTH Covid Jab to Fight New Variants*

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

Oops, wrong state. Well, you can do the duckduckgo yourself. 

Remember, it's the hospitalizations that concern these people, not the deaths. They just take the dead bodies out in trucks, but God forbid if they don't have enough hospital beds. (It means people aren't dying fast enough).

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

> Really boggled down with this MSM rhetoric....what compels them to be that way?  Don't they care about Americans...people?  The more time goes by the more I see the presence of evil within our country.  You would think they would want to help people instead of leading them astray.  
> 
> Before long one might think their horns would start to show....geesh!


They view themselves as lieutenants of the Elites.  Their trusted right-hand men...and wombynz...

The Elites are CRAZED about getting that poison in the bodies of their lessers.  Why, you can speculate.  We do know it's not good for people; that it doesn't do its supposed purpose, vaccination against the Wu Flu.

Independent intelligent Americans, with encyclopedias of drugs to fall back on, found at least two that worked just-dandy in knocking these viral infections down.  DAMMIT!  There goes the Globalists' plans.

So, the Fake Noozers have to swing into action.  HCQ, around for 70 years, just GIVEN to troops in the tropics to ward off (viral) malaria...suddenly it had to be made out to be poison, and Trump insane for suggesting trying it.

Ivermectin was found effective a few months later; but this time, it was kept on the hush-hush.  Quietly it was leaked out in survival blogs and healthcare-worker social-media sites.

India pushed it into the forefront when they gave up on vaccines and ventilators, because of the piles of bodies...and started using ivermectin.  Everything's under control, now - and that's why the Nooze Liars have suddenly shut up completely about India.

Now we have completely fabricated pieces of people dying of taking horse paste.  srsly?  You feed it to horses, in much greater quantities, and they get better, not worse.

It's made in tablets designated for humans, too.  Been around so long the patent is expired (which is part of the problem for Big Pharma)  Nobody ever got sick on it, until Rolling Stone pulled out the Jayson Blair Journalism Ethics handbook, and wrote that giant lie.

I have been taking it for six months, and I'm fine.

----------

Sunsettommy (09-09-2021)

----------


## Quark

> Wait.. in another thread I read this:
> 
> And in yet another thread, this:
> 
> 
> 
> So... *which is it?* Are the hospitalizations really from COVID or are the hospitals just making it up using flawed phony tests to get more money?
> 
> It's intellectual honesty time. I think this question: "*which is it?*" may be the equivalent of this scene to the antivax fear mongers.


Well hospitals are getting paid for the more COVID patients they have. That is true as I've had medical personnel tell me that.

----------

WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Dan40

> Well hospitals are getting paid for the more COVID patients they have. That is true as I've had medical personnel tell me that.


I know that hospitals get paid according to the diagnosis by Medicare.  I don't know what the payment is for covid compared to flu or any respiratory problem.  But insurers will follow Medicare reimbursement pretty closely. (Wife has a Masters in  health care finance and has been a hospital CFO)

----------


## East of the Beast

> I'm not a provaxxer, individual choice is how it should be.  See post#17.  We CANNOT choose to believe any politician just because you like what they say for once.  25% is what EXACT number more than previous?  From 3 deaths to 4 deaths?  From 300,000 deaths to 400,000 deaths?  When a politician quotes percentages,  he's lying to you!


Im all about personal choice.What was the governors goal here? Im not sure of anyone or anything.Just last month two WVians were made instant millionaires in the state vaccination lottery.

It would be the irony of all ironies if one of the fatalities of vaccinated people was one of them.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

> I know that hospitals get paid according to the diagnosis by Medicare.  I don't know what the payment is for covid compared to flu or any respiratory problem.  But insurers will follow Medicare reimbursement pretty closely. (Wife has a Masters in  health care finance and has been a hospital CFO)


Back in 2020 when we had the big shutdown/lockdown and hospitals were not taking any patients especially elective surgery patients the national government was paying the hospitals extra money for COVID patients. This was a big deal in Montana because many of our smaller hospitals in the boonies were afraid of going broke with no patients especially elective surgery patients. So every patient that had to go to the hospital for anything magically had COVID and if they died it was always COVID no matter the cause of death for that extra money.

----------

Karl (09-06-2021),Northern Rivers (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Jen

We have a vaccinated friend who spent two weeks in bed with Covid....he is just now starting to feel better but still not back to normal yet.  He was very sick.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Karl

> We have a vaccinated friend who spent two weeks in bed with Covid....he is just now starting to feel better but still not back to normal yet.  He was very sick.


They say it's the "Vaccine" people now IN "ICU"..

Kickers here the "Patients" are only 35/55 of Age..

Early On we Masked up for the "Elderly"..

Today the most "Accute" Patients are 35 to 55 years Old

----------

WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## East of the Beast

My sister has been in the hospital for over a week on oxygen.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> My sister has been in the hospital for over a week on oxygen.


Vaxxed? Which one?

----------


## QuaseMarco

The # of beds available in a hospital is also based on staffing. If not enough nurses are available those empty beds are not counted as available. Hospitals are losing staff for various reasons....such as retirement,  firings, resignations & illness. There are a good number of healthcare workers who will not take the vaccine and are leaving....one way or another.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021),YellowRose (09-06-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> My sister has been in the hospital for over a week on oxygen.


Very sorry to hear this. Hope she pulls through.

----------

WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Old Tex

I'll just say this:

The reason to get the shots in the beginning (the claim) was that while it won't stop you from getting covid, it would stop you from dying from covid.

Well people are getting covid after they have had the shots but now they are dying from covid after the shots. The claim is now void (I guess).

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## East of the Beast

> Vaxxed? Which one?


non vaxxed

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## East of the Beast

> Very sorry to hear this. Hope she pulls through.


her blood/oxygen is holding steady around 95%.Will we coming home in a couple of days.She had no other symptoms except mild headache and general feeling of nausea.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

Dr Stella Immanuel who specializes now in treating Covid said it's about 70/30 unvax to vax getting sick. She also said that once vaxxed get sick it is not necessarily milder as the talking point goes.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> her blood/oxygen is holding steady around 95%.Will we coming home in a couple of days.She had no other symptoms except mild headache and general feeling of nausea.


Wow....hope she's getting good treatment. Do you know how they treated the illness?

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## East of the Beast

> Wow....hope she's getting good treatment. Do you know how they treated the illness?


She was/is on oxygen.I really don't of any specific drug although I'm sure that she is on a drug regimen.
It is important to note that she has always suffered with upper respiratory infections her entire life.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> She was/is on oxygen.I really don't of any specific drug although I'm sure that she is on a drug regimen.
> It is important to note that she has always suffered with upper respiratory infections her entire life.


I see. It's good she's getting out soon.  :Smiley20:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-06-2021),East of the Beast (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> The media is putting the public at risk with their FAILURE to report accurately and their ACTIVE CENSORSHIP of important information.
> 
> The MSM is CREATING a public health risk.


The vaccinated are running around as if they are invulnerable. Do they not know?

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> Well hospitals are getting paid for the more COVID patients they have. That is true as I've had medical personnel tell me that.


Then how do you know that all those that this thread is about really have COVID.  

BTW... kudos for responding.  Not everyone had the integrity to address what appears to be their inconsistent narrative

----------


## Fall River

Fact Check-There is no evidence to suggest COVID-19 vaccines will kill people by causing antibody- dependent enhancement, current evidence demonstrates the opposite | Reuters

----------

dinosaur (09-06-2021)

----------


## Conservative Libertarian

What is your personal view of this "fact check"?

----------

dinosaur (09-06-2021),Fall River (09-06-2021)

----------


## Foghorn

I'm developing a phobia of alphabet soup abbreviations.


The CDC says no ADE but CNN is confirming with the FDA.



 :Nono:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-06-2021),dinosaur (09-06-2021),Fall River (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),Thom Paine (09-06-2021)

----------


## Fall River

> What is your personal view of this "fact check"?


Having given it a second look, I don't think it's very good because it is too limited in scope. 

Here's another one, see what you think.  

The claim that COVID-19 vaccines will cause more severe disease through antibody-dependent enhancement is not yet supported

The short coming of this one may be the date on the report is Dec. 2020

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-06-2021),dinosaur (09-06-2021)

----------


## dinosaur

The OP article is from May.  With the "Delta" variant now infecting the vaccinated, I wonder if there is now "evidence" of this ADE, or have the vaccines simply lost potency and protection over time?

This article is from January, but has been helpful to me trying to understand exactly what ADE is and how it works.

Antibody-dependent Enhancement (ADE) and Vaccines | Children's Hospital of Philadelphia

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-06-2021),Fall River (09-06-2021)

----------


## Dan40

FEAR of the vaccine is just as life disrupting as FEAR of covid itself.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

> What is your personal view of this "fact check"?


Fact Check sources are run by Communist propogandists. They are not to be believed.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

It's been known for some time that we become anti-body resistant the more anti-biotic medicine we take. So yes those who have taken the magic jab are more likely to be susceptible to the newer Wuhan flu viruses.

----------


## Fall River

Error

----------


## Thom Paine

> Fact Check sources are run by Communist propogandists. They are not to be believed.


Wait !   Whut ??!! ...

My fact checks are good.
when I get my lazy finger to attack the keyboard.
Not often of late...  tired of giving a damn...
Got no more F $#&* left to give.   

meh ...  

I'm gonna' have a great day
wish the same for y'all.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## Fall River

> The OP article is from May.  With the "Delta" variant now infecting the vaccinated, I wonder if there is now "evidence" of this ADE, or have the vaccines simply lost potency and protection over time?
> 
> This article is from January, but has been helpful to me trying to understand exactly what ADE is and how it works.
> 
> Antibody-dependent Enhancement (ADE) and Vaccines | Children's Hospital of Philadelphia



I found your link helpful too. Scroll down to where it says, *"Can the new COVID-19 vaccines cause ADE"*

It says, *"Neither COVID-19 disease nor the new COVID-19 vaccines have shown evidence of causing ADE.....clinical trials in people have not found evidence of ADE."*

----------

dinosaur (09-06-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> What is your personal view of this "fact check"?


Dumbass fucking politicians doing the usual thing: trampling on science.

Fact checkers are liberals who couldn't find another job. They're not MD's. They're not ALLOWED to give medical advice. 

Secondly, NO ONE ever said ADE kills people. No one ever said that. These fucked up liberal fact checkers are fear mongering. 

They should REGULATE these fact checking assholes. Make them get a license

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> I found your link helpful too. Scroll down to where it says, *"Can the new COVID-19 vaccines cause ADE"*
> 
> It says, *"Neither COVID-19 disease nor the new COVID-19 vaccines have shown evidence of causing ADE.....clinical trials in people have not found evidence of ADE."*


This is a false statement.

I have seen at least SIX such studies.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> Wait.. in another thread I read this:
> 
> And in yet another thread, this:
> 
> 
> 
> So... *which is it?* Are the hospitalizations really from COVID or are the hospitals just making it up using flawed phony tests to get more money?
> 
> It's intellectual honesty time. I think this question: "*which is it?*" may be the equivalent of this scene to the antivax fear mongers.


Ok Genius which is it? We would like to know :Thinking:

----------


## Fall River

Do the mRNA vaccines cause Antibody Dependent Enhancement (ADE) with COVID-19 disease? | Immunize BC

*Friday, July 30, 2021:  ADE is not expected to be a concern for SARS-CoV-2 infections or vaccinations.*

----------


## dinosaur

> I found your link helpful too. Scroll down to where it says, *"Can the new COVID-19 vaccines cause ADE"*
> 
> It says, *"Neither COVID-19 disease nor the new COVID-19 vaccines have shown evidence of causing ADE.....clinical trials in people have not found evidence of ADE."*


I read that, but being from January, I don't know that I want to take that statement as fact.  Did you read the part about Dengue fever?  The vaccines made people more susceptible to one of the other Dengue variants.  Back in January, we didn't have Covid variants, or at least not in wide circulation.  Now, with variants, and the ineffectiveness of vaccines, I don't know.

----------

Fall River (09-07-2021),nonsqtr (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

> My sister has been in the hospital for over a week on oxygen.


I hope your sister recovers and all goes well.

----------


## WarriorRob

To the ProVaxxers, if you want shots every 6 months for the rest of your lives, knock yourself out. One day you will wake up to this worthless vaccine crap that they are pushing, hopefully you won't get to sick or die from all of the poison they are going to pump into you. this has gotten Political and it's a money making scheme so it won't matter how many people die or have debilitating Illnesses :Angry20:

----------

phoenyx (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

> Dr Stella Immanuel who specializes now in treating Covid said it's about 70/30 unvax to vax getting sick. She also said that once vaxxed get sick it is not necessarily milder as the talking point goes.


 I keep saying the pneumonia shot is more important than any flu shot. If you have a good immune system, strong and healthy lugs, good oxygen levels, and your pneumonia shot you should be good to go.

----------


## Quark

> The vaccinated are running around as if they are invulnerable. Do they not know?


 They don't know. God Fauci said they were invulnerable if they got the magic jab and could go back to a normal life. Goes to show what happens if you listen to God.

----------


## Quark

> Then how do you know that all those that this thread is about really have COVID.  
> 
> BTW... kudos for responding.  Not everyone had the integrity to address what appears to be their inconsistent narrative


I don't and neither does anyone else. It's all about fear and money. We had people die last year from everything from A to Z and everything was listed as a COVID death. I'm talking about Montana only where I live.

----------

East of the Beast (09-06-2021)

----------


## YellowRose

> The OP article is from May.  With the "Delta" variant now infecting the vaccinated, I wonder if there is now "evidence" of this ADE, or have the vaccines simply lost potency and protection over time?
> 
> This article is from January, but has been helpful to me trying to understand exactly what ADE is and how it works.
> 
> Antibody-dependent Enhancement (ADE) and Vaccines | Children's Hospital of Philadelphia


Did you ever wonder WHY no vaccine has ever been developed for the common cold?
The common cold virus is a coronavirus. The virus causing covid and its variants are also coronaviruses. Coronaviruses mutate rapidly, and are ever-changing, which makes effective vaccines almost impossible. This is probably why we are seeing poor long-term effectiveness of the vaccines, and I don't expect that will change. 

The GOOD thing is that virus mutations normally cause a more contagious organism, but also less lethal, so if things go as would normally be expected, this will probably eventually be about the equivalent of a common cold or a flu virus infection, which is already the case for a good many of us.

----------

dinosaur (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

> FEAR of the vaccine is just as life disrupting as FEAR of covid itself.


I agree.

----------


## Quark

> To the ProVaxxers, if you want shots every 6 months for the rest of your lives, knock yourself out. One day you will wake up to this worthless vaccine crap that they are pushing, hopefully you won't get to sick or die from all of the poison they are going to pump into you. this has gotten Political and it's a money making scheme so it won't matter how many people die or have debilitating Illnesses


 You are right and that's it right there.

----------

WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Fall River

Why ADE Hasn't Been a Problem With COVID Vaccines | MedPage Today

*Why ADE Hasn't Been A Problem With COVID Vaccines*

----------


## Quark

> Did you ever wonder WHY no vaccine has ever been developed for the common cold?
> The common cold virus is a coronavirus. The virus causing covid and its variants are also coronaviruses. Coronaviruses mutate rapidly, and are ever-changing, which makes effective vaccines almost impossible. This is probably why we are seeing poor long-term effectiveness of the vaccines, and I don't expect that will change. 
> 
> The GOOD thing is that virus mutations normally cause a more contagious organism, but also less lethal, so if things go as would normally be expected, this will probably eventually be about the equivalent of a common cold or a flu virus infection, which is already the case for a good many of us.


That's it right there! Flu vaccines are a big money maker for the Big Pharma oligarchy and nothing more.

----------

QuaseMarco (09-06-2021),YellowRose (09-06-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> I read that, but being from January, I don't know that I want to take that statement as fact.  Did you read the part about Dengue fever?  The vaccines made people more susceptible to one of the other Dengue variants.  Back in January, we didn't have Covid variants, or at least not in wide circulation.  Now, with variants, and the ineffectiveness of vaccines, I don't know.


Exactly.

I don't know either.

However, at this point there is definitely "substantial" evidence, and it should warrant concern.

Dismissiveness is MEDICALLY IRRESPONSIBLE.

The fact is, no one knows yet.

But another fact is, we're going to find out. There are what, a billion vaccinated people so far? We're going to find out, and there will be plenty of test subjects.

The third fact is, it has more to do with the virus than it does with human immunity. The human immune system is pretty well understood, but viruses are not, and all the possible combinations of viral chemicals with human chemicals are DEFINITELY not.

----------

dinosaur (09-07-2021),Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

> Why ADE Hasn't Been a Problem With COVID Vaccines | MedPage Today
> 
> *Why ADE Hasn't Been A Problem With COVID Vaccines*


Why are you pushing this (apparently false) narrative?

Do you work for the pHarmaceutical industry or something?

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021)

----------


## East of the Beast

> I hope your sister recovers and all goes well.


Thanks...She was on high flow oxygen.They have to ween her of it for about another week.Her O2 staying around 96%.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> Ok Genius which is it? We would like to know


I didn't make the claims . That antivaxers did.

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> I don't and neither does anyone else. It's all about fear and money. We had people die last year from everything from A to Z and everything was listed as a COVID death. I'm talking about Montana only where I live.


So the claim that it's mostly the vaccinated that are hospitalized for covid is likely bullshit.  Agreed?

----------


## WarriorRob

> So the claim that it's mostly the vaccinated that are hospitalized for covid is likely bullshit.  Agreed?


I think it's more like 50/50 or 30/70 or whatever it is, what's the difference the vaccinated are going in the Hospitals, doesn't matter if it's 20/80 and the 80 are unvaccinated, the point of all of this is,The Vaccines Don't Work!!!!

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> I think it's more like 50/50 or 30/70 or whatever it is, what's the difference the vaccinated are going in the Hospitals, doesn't matter if it's 20/80 and the 80 are unvaccinated, the point of all of this is,The Vaccines Don't Work!!!!


Since you believe that hospital reports of covid are bullshit, using hospital reports of covid to defend your position seems a bit specious... doncha think?

PS.. I haven't made any claims one way or the other but watching people use contradictions to make their case just bugs me .

----------


## phoenyx

> I think it's more like 50/50 or 30/70 or whatever it is, what's the difference the vaccinated are going in the Hospitals, doesn't matter if it's 20/80 and the 80 are unvaccinated, the point of all of this is,The Vaccines Don't Work!!!!



I think the argument that pro covid vaccine folk make is that they work, but not so well, or that they work, but only for a short period of time, or a combination of the 2.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> Since you believe that hospital reports of covid are bullshit, using hospital reports of covid to defend your position seems a bit specious... doncha think?


So you actually still believe the Vaccines work :Thinking:

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> I think the argument that pro covid vaccine folk make is that they work, but not so well, or that they work, but only for a short period of time, or a combination of the 2.


That's what they want you to believe, they are going to be taking Vaccines for the rest of their lives, however long that will be is anyone's guess :Dontknow:

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> That's what they want you to believe, they are going to be taking Vaccines for the rest of their lives, however long that will be is anyone's guess


I imagine some will get tired of it. To give some perspective on this:

My father got the first dose of some covid vaccine but never got the second.

I know some people who had a rough time either on the first or the second dose (or both) and so would be reluctant to go for a third or more.

Finally, the more these vaccines are out there, the more obvious all their side effects are becoming.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> I imagine some will get tired of it. To give some perspective on this:
> 
> My father got the first dose of some covid vaccine but never got the second.
> 
> I know some people who had a rough time either on the first or the second dose (or both) and so would be reluctant to go for a third or more.
> 
> Finally, the more these vaccines are out there, the more obvious all their side effects are becoming.


I'm not against all Vaccines if they are tested properly, I'm against the experimental Covid vaccines, millions around the World have been deceived to take this poison without it being fully tested. I have no idea why they need a vaccine if like they say 70 to 80% of Americans have some immunity towards "Covid", makes no sense accept to make money.

----------

phoenyx (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> So you actually still believe the Vaccines work


I added a PS to my post below. 

Fully Vaccinated are getting sick from Covid-19 in West Virginia. - Page 6
I am neither pro vaccine or antivax.  I believe in personal choice. But that doesn't mean I have to pretend to be an moron when I see people posting nonsense or contradictory statements to defend their position.

----------


## Jen

> I'm not against all Vaccines if they are tested properly, I'm against the experimental Covid vaccines, millions around the World have been deceived to take this poison without it being fully tested. I have no idea why they need a vaccine if like they say 70 to 80% of Americans have some immunity towards "Covid", makes no sense accept to make money.


Same here.  I recently had the second pneumonia shot and I will get the yearly flu vaccine if my doctor offers it to me (and he will).  

I consider that the Covid vaccine is now being tested and the test subjects are the public.  When I am satisfied of the test results, then I will take the vaccine.

So far, vaccinated people are still getting Covid..........so that says the vaccine doesn't really work.
So far many people who take the vaccine are having some major side effects....  that says some work needs to be done to make the vaccine safer for everyone.

I appreciate everyone who has participated in this vaccine test.  I simply do not choose to be a guinea pig at this point in time and with this vaccine.

My body my choice.  Your body your choice.....

----------

phoenyx (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> I added a PS to my post below. 
> 
> Fully Vaccinated are getting sick from Covid-19 in West Virginia. - Page 6
> I am neither pro vaccine or antivax.  I believe in personal choice. But that doesn't mean I have to pretend to be an moron when I see people posting nonsense or contradictory statements to defend their position.


My point is the Vaccines are "experimental vaccines" and are not working, why else do you think they want more vaccines and booster shots. I guess you can't see that they are using humans as Guinea pigs, they are just making up vaccines as they go along to see what works. I agree in personal choice, who is pretending to be a moron :Thinking:

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> Same here.  I recently had the second pneumonia shot and I will get the yearly flu vaccine if my doctor offers it to me (and he will).  
> 
> I consider that the Covid vaccine is now being tested and the test subjects are the public.  When I am satisfied of the test results, then I will take the vaccine.
> 
> So far, vaccinated people are still getting Covid..........so that says the vaccine doesn't really work.
> So far many people who take the vaccine are having some major side effects....  that says some work needs to be done to make the vaccine safer for everyone.
> 
> I appreciate everyone who has participated in this vaccine test.  I simply do not choose to be a guinea pig at this point in time and with this vaccine.
> 
> My body my choice.  Your body your choice.....


Like you read my mind, we are the Guinea Pigs, they are making up vaccines as the go to see what works, that's scary and what's really scary is millions are volunteering to be Guinea pigs :Geez:

----------

Jen (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021)

----------


## Jen

> Like you read my mind, we are the Guinea Pigs, they are making up vaccines as the go to see what works, that's scary and what's really scary is millions are volunteering to be Guinea pigs


It is their choice to be the Guinea pigs.  I am appreciative of it.  Someone needs to do that job.

----------


## phoenyx

> It is their choice to be the Guinea pigs.  I am appreciative of it.  Someone needs to do that job.


Usually lesser evolved animals were given that position. You know, -actual- guinea pigs. Why are people being coerced into taking on their role?

----------

Jen (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Jen

> Usually lesser evolved animals were given that position. You know, -actual- guinea pigs. Why are people being coerced into taking on their role?


At some point many experiments call for human test subjects.  That comes after the mice or other animals have survived.  

The coercion is quite another thing.......and that is what is worrisome to me.  That coercion is what makes me suspicious.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> At some point many experiments call for human test subjects.  That comes after the mice or other animals have survived.  
> 
> The coercion is quite another thing.......and that is what is worrisome to me.  That coercion is what makes me suspicious.


Yeah. And then there's this...
Paris police beat woman for shopping without vaccine passport

----------

Jen (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> At some point many experiments call for human test subjects.  That comes after the mice or other animals have survived.  
> 
> *The coercion is quite another thing.......and that is what is worrisome to me.  That coercion is what makes me suspicious.*


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Yes that ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

That is why I am so up in arms about this thing. My body my choice !!! 
And don't deny me drugs that have been approved and can be cross used safely and effectively. 
Many drugs have cross uses for other illnesses than which they were originally developed.

----------

phoenyx (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

I said from day one all we are is human Guinea pigs or lab rats. We are test subjects and more and more people are coming to realize that.

----------

dinosaur (09-07-2021),phoenyx (09-06-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> My point is the Vaccines are "experimental vaccines" and are not working, why else do you think they want more vaccines and booster shots. I guess you can't see that they are using humans as Guinea pigs, they are just making up vaccines as they go along to see what works. I agree in personal choice, who is pretending to be a moron


You might be right. You might be wrong. 

I simply said that using data that you call bullshit to defend your position is a specious argument.

----------


## Quark

> So the claim that it's mostly the vaccinated that are hospitalized for covid is likely bullshit.  Agreed?


Not necessarily bullshit but it certainly does seem that a good many vaxxed people are getting the Wuhan flu and ending up in the hospital and even dying. Something the experimental gene therapy was suppose to prevent and help us all get back to normal pre-Wuhan flu days. It's done nothing of the sort. I'll agree bringing in all the foreign Wuhan flu infected aliens is not helping matters any.

I'll tell you what I do know is ALL flu shots are useless. If flu shots worked we would have a vaccine against the common cold as one of our members pointed out.

----------

East of the Beast (09-06-2021),QuaseMarco (09-06-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> You might be right. You might be wrong. 
> 
> I simply said that using data that you call bullshit to defend your position is a specious argument.


I certainly don't trust a lot of data out there, but that doesn't always mean that it's mistaken. Furthermore, there's generally nothing better than using data that one's -opponent- trusts against them.

----------

Quark (09-06-2021)

----------


## Quark

> I imagine some will get tired of it. To give some perspective on this:
> 
> My father got the first dose of some covid vaccine but never got the second.
> 
> I know some people who had a rough time either on the first or the second dose (or both) and so would be reluctant to go for a third or more.
> 
> Finally, the more these vaccines are out there, the more obvious all their side effects are becoming.


That's true. After my reaction to Neosporin in the shingles shot I said no to a second shot. Also when I found out just how dangerous the so-called seasonal flu shot and how ineffective the shot was I said no to any more flu shots.

All drugs and vaccines are poison and have to be considered very carefully before they are put into one's body.

----------

East of the Beast (09-06-2021),phoenyx (09-06-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> *Not necessarily bullshit but it certainly does seem that a good many vaxxed people are getting the Wuhan flu and ending up in the hospital and even dying.* 
>  .


How do you know?  You people already said you can't trust the data on who has covid.

----------


## Quark

> How do you know?  You people already said you can't trust the data on who has covid.


I don't know for sure but my highly developed common sense and intuition tells me a good many vaxxed people are getting sick and being hospitalized than anybody wants to let on. I also know that the seasonal flu vaccine is useless and highly dangerous. I'll believe in flu vaccines being effective just as soon as a well tested common cold vaccine is developed and marketed.

----------

WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Dan40

> Same here.  I recently had the second pneumonia shot and I will get the yearly flu vaccine if my doctor offers it to me (and he will).  
> 
> I consider that the Covid vaccine is now being tested and the test subjects are the public.  When I am satisfied of the test results, then I will take the vaccine.
> 
> So far, vaccinated people are still getting Covid..........so that says the vaccine doesn't really work.
> So far many people who take the vaccine are having some major side effects....  that says some work needs to be done to make the vaccine safer for everyone.
> 
> I appreciate everyone who has participated in this vaccine test.  I simply do not choose to be a guinea pig at this point in time and with this vaccine.
> 
> My body my choice.  Your body your choice.....


I totally agree, your body your choice.  But because SOME vaccinated people still get covid does not mean the vaccine "is not REALLY working."  Not working as good as hoped would be fair..  It was rushed and experimental.  No one should be surprised that it is not 100% effective.  Stats have been posted that 1 in 10 hospitalized have been fully vaccinated.  That's 90% effective.  In the early days provaxxers claimed 95% effective.  Pretty close.  Conservatives telling lies about ineffective or dangerous covid vaccines is 110% as bad as any liberal lies about everything.

----------

potlatch (09-06-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> I don't know for sure but my highly developed common sense and intuition tells me a good many vaxxed people are getting sick and being hospitalized than anybody wants to let on.


You don't need to rely on your intuition, there's a court case alleging that around 45,000 people died within 3 days of getting a Covid vaccine in the U.S. Here's a link to an article on this:
Federal Lawsuit Seeks Immediate Halt of COVID Vaccines, Cites Whistleblower Testimony Claiming CDC Is Under-Counting Vaccine Deaths s Health Defense

----------

Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Jen

> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Yes that ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> 
> That is why I am so up in arms about this thing. My body my choice !!! 
> And don't deny me drugs that have been approved and can be cross used safely and effectively. 
> Many drugs have cross uses for other illnesses than which they were originally developed.


It is odd that we are denied drugs that have been proven to be safe while those not proven yet are pushed on us.

----------

Gracie (09-06-2021),phoenyx (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> It is odd that we are denied drugs that have been proven to be safe while those not proven yet are pushed on us.


I think it makes more sense when you consider the big bucks that the pharmaceutical companies making these covid vaccines are raking in.

----------

Jen (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Jen

> I totally agree, your body your choice.  But because SOME vaccinated people still get covid does not mean the vaccine "is not REALLY working."  Not working as good as hoped would be fair..  It was rushed and experimental.  No one should be surprised that it is not 100% effective.  Stats have been posted that 1 in 10 hospitalized have been fully vaccinated.  That's 90% effective.  In the early days provaxxers claimed 95% effective.  Pretty close.  Conservatives telling lies about ineffective or dangerous covid vaccines is 110% as bad as any liberal lies about everything.


Some people choose to take it now.  I choose to wait until it has been further tested.  Each of us should be free to make that choice without being yelled at about it.

----------

FNguy (09-06-2021),Gracie (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Jen

> I think it makes more sense when you consider the big bucks that the pharmaceutical companies making these covid vaccines are raking in.


Follow the money.

----------

Gracie (09-06-2021),phoenyx (09-06-2021),Quark (09-06-2021),WarriorRob (09-06-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> I don't know for sure but my *highly developed common sense and intuition* tells me a good many vaxxed people are getting sick and being hospitalized than anybody wants to let on. I also know that the seasonal flu vaccine is useless and highly dangerous. I'll believe in flu vaccines being effective just as soon as a well tested common cold vaccine is developed and marketed.


You said Trump's impeachment would result in conviction too.
Trump Convicted and Put in Prison....

----------


## Quark

> You said Trump's impeachment would result in conviction too.
> Trump Convicted and Put in Prison....


Yup I sure did and thought with Congress hating Trump it was a sure bet. I was wrong which is why I say there is no way that Biden will be convicted. I now realize that if Trump was not convicted after two impeachments and being as hated as he was the odds of any president being convicted is so high that winning the power ball lottery is more of a hands on favorite.

----------


## Gracie

Becausde its ALL a crock of shit. Every bit of it. Vaccines stop you front getting whatever it is you need to be vaccinated against. This stuff DOES NOT WORK. Yet, people still defend it, flock to get jabbed and believe all the media has to say. Dems are not stupid. They have been planning this for a long long time and when Trump got in the way, they had to get him out. Hence..cheating.But first, a fake pandemic.


> VACCINATED ARE.. DROPPING LIKE FLIES... .. [.]
> 
> 
> Are we really surprised

----------

WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## Gracie

Jen is a gem. 

Love the post, too.


> Some people choose to take it now.  I choose to wait until it has been further tested.  Each of us should be free to make that choice without being yelled at about it.

----------

Jen (09-06-2021)

----------


## Gracie

It's not odd. Its highly suspicious and planned from the very beginning. But who knew just how many sheep there are in each country that jumped on the bandwagon of being vaxxed. I will NEVER get that shot. Even if they throw me in some camp. I won't get a flu shot this year either because they will probably sneak the jab in with it. I'll take my chances with my own body dealing with whatever comes its way and if I die....oh damn well. I am not afraid of death and look forward to it when it finally comes. What I am afraid of is HOW I die. I want it on my own terms, no someone elses.


> It is odd that we are denied drugs that have been proven to be safe while those not proven yet are pushed on us.

----------

Jen (09-06-2021),JustPassinThru (09-06-2021)

----------


## Dan40

> You don't need to rely on your intuition, there's a court case alleging that around 45,000 people died within 3 days of getting a Covid vaccine in the U.S. Here's a link to an article on this:
> Federal Lawsuit Seeks Immediate Halt of COVID Vaccines, Cites Whistleblower Testimony Claiming CDC Is Under-Counting Vaccine Deaths s Health Defense


The 45,000 number is not a count.  It is his ESTIMATE based on his beliefs.  No EVIDENCE to actually prove his estimate.  And children's health is a highly biased source.  One reason I hate the left is constant lies.  Lies by the right are as bad or worse.  Neither the hysterics over covid or the hysterics over the vaccine are warranted.

----------

nonsqtr (09-06-2021)

----------


## Jen

> It's not odd. Its highly suspicious and planned from the very beginning. But who knew just how many sheep there are in each country that jumped on the bandwagon of being vaxxed. I will NEVER get that shot. Even if they throw me in some camp. I won't get a flu shot this year either because they will probably sneak the jab in with it. I'll take my chances with my own body dealing with whatever comes its way and if I die....oh damn well. I am not afraid of death and look forward to it when it finally comes. What I am afraid of is HOW I die. I want it on my own terms, no someone elses.


Death: Yes.  I am concerned about how I will reach the point of death, but I'm not afraid of death itself.

----------


## Gracie

Pfizer refused to supply South America with covid vaccines until governments removed all liability for injuries, deaths â NaturalNews.com

_As a condition of supplying them here on the taxpayer dime, large multinational corporations like Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna forced the American government to exempt them from lawsuits arising from injuries and deaths caused by the injections._
_In Columbia, similar contracts were agreed upon amounting to nearly $240 million in revenue for Pfizer-BioNTech and AstraZeneca. Nearly 25 million doses of Wuhan coronavirus (Covid-19) injections are now being distributed there, all liability-free._

----------

phoenyx (09-07-2021),WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> Death: Yes.  I am concerned about how I will reach the point of death, but I'm not afraid of death itself.


I've said that I'm not afraid of death either, but I -am- afraid of the dying part. Specifically pain, I've always hated pain :-p.

----------


## phoenyx

Just found this article, it's from August, but the policy brought up should be going into effect very soon...

**
An officer with the U.S. Navy is warning of a full-blown “national security threat” if the military moves ahead with its planned universal COVID-19 vaccination mandate, in a paper obtained exclusively by _Revolver News._
In a memorandum released on Monday, Biden Secretary of Defense Lloyd Austin announced his intention to require a COVID-19 vaccination for all servicemembers by mid-September, or immediately should any COVID vaccines clear FDA approval (the vaccines are currently only authorized for emergency use). Servicemen who refuse to submit to the vaccine will potentially face court martials, prison time, and even less-than-honorable discharge from the service.


If that plan goes ahead, though, CDR J.H. Furman warns the results could conceivably be catastrophic.
“The forced vaccination of all military personnel with the present COVID-19 vaccines may compromise U.S. national security due to the unknown extent of serious vaccine complications,”writes Furman. “Further study is needed before committing the Total Force to one irreversible experimental group. Initial reports leave more concern for the COVID-19 vaccinations than the virus itself for the (at present) exceptionally healthy military population.”
Furman is a career United States naval officer, naval aviator, and foreign area officer with extensive experience advising senior military, diplomatic, and international organization leadership. The commander has spent years serving throughout Africa, Asia, Europe, the Middle East at sea, ashore and airborne. He also holds a Master of Arts in Security Studies from the Naval Postgraduate School.
Furman’s paper is not long, weighing in at just two and a half pages plus an equally long list of citations. But he nevertheless hits all the key points for why imposing COVID-19 vaccines on the entire general populace is driven by hysteria, not real concern for saving lives or stamping out the virus.
Furman’s key points are:

The average member of the U.S. military is young and in excellent physical fitness, two categories that are nearly immune to the dangers of COVID. So far, only 24 people out of 2.2 million military personnel have died of COVID-19, a rate of less than one per 91,000.There is reason to believe severe or even fatal side-effects from existing COVID-19 vaccines are more common than reported, and could even prove deadlier to otherwise-healthy servicemen than COVID-19.There is also the outlier possibility that mRNA vaccines (the kind used by the Moderna and Pfizer shots) may have unanticipated negative effects on the immune systems of recipients.Currently, the U.S. military has proven completely capable of weathering COVID-19 without any loss of effectiveness, so forcibly making the entire service a test case for a novel type of vaccine is a pointless risk.
We invite readers to read CDR Furman’s entire paper below, made available exclusively to _Revolver News_
[snip]
**

Full article here:
Revolver Exclusive: Navy Commander Warns of National Security Threat from Mandatory Vaccination - Revolver

----------

Old Ridge Runner (09-07-2021)

----------


## Northern Rivers

Biden/Harris '24!!!

----------


## Gator Monroe

Harris 47 by Christmas

----------


## QuaseMarco

Someone with common sense.

----------

Old Ridge Runner (09-07-2021)

----------


## Jen

> I've said that I'm not afraid of death either, but I -am- afraid of the dying part. Specifically pain, I've always hated pain :-p.


I have a pretty high pain tolerance.  I gave birth to two children naturally. But that doesn't mean I want to endure huge pain and then just die.  When my dad died, he was here in our home. His organs were shutting down.  The hospice nurse gave us little containers with morphine to squeeze into his mouth (he was no longer actively able to swallow).  And when my brother in law died in a VA hospital, he had an IV with morphine to ease the pain.  If there is pain, there is the means to remove it at the end of a life.  

I have not lived a violent life, so I hope I don't end life in a violent situation....

And I think I have wondered way off topic.  My apologies.

----------

phoenyx (09-07-2021)

----------


## Jen

In order to take down the most powerful country in the world, its military must be taken down first.

----------

Big Dummy (09-07-2021),Old Ridge Runner (09-07-2021)

----------


## Freewill

Is this commander also an epidemiologist?  Or has a degree in infectious disease?  Is he even a doctor?

The people I know who have received the jab have not fallen over yet.  Maybe it is a delayed action, who can know?

Could it be that this new type of vaccine, mRNA, will result in better treatment of other diseases, such as cancer?  I realize that the world is being used as a grand experiment but maybe, just maybe, some good will come from what we are doing.

Is that too positive of thought for the dark world we now live?

----------


## Freewill

Back in boot camp 1969 the military gave recruits many injections most of which we didn't know what it was.  We would just stand in line and a corpman would inject men one at a time.

I remember vividly getting a double does of penicillin.  Huge needle.  We stood in line and dropped our drawers and bent over.  It was actually kind of nightmarish.  Some of the fatter men would reach around and pull the needle back out, which only resulted in getting injected twice.  For a couple of days it felt as if a baseball had been injected into your butt, hurt like hell.

----------


## phoenyx

> Is this commander also an epidemiologist?  Or has a degree in infectious disease?  Is he even a doctor?


I don't know. But you don't have to be any of those things to report on the evidence we have so far. I was looking at Commander Furhman's letter and found some things I hadn't heard of before. Bolding the part I found to be most interesting:

**
The UK government agency Public Health England recently published a report showing that, *“people who received the COVID-19 shot are more than three times as likely to die than those who have not received the vaccine.”** Early signs in Israel indicate the same. Officials there recently reported that at least 85% of all severe and new COVID-19 hospitalizations are prior vaccinated individuals. The inventor of m-RNA technology, Dr. Robert Malone, recently disclosed that “[…] new data indicates that people who have taken the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are at greater risk of getting Covid than someone who is not vaccinated.”* The Johnson & Johnson and AstraZeneca vaccines also demonstrate significant problems as compared to the negligible military COVID-19 mortality rates. In the European Union (EU), more than 22,000 vaccination-associated deaths are now documented in the EU drug adverse events database. Which caused _Doctors for COVID Ethics (an international doctors group from over 30 countries) to conclude on July 9, 2021 “[…] the benefits of vaccination are highly doubtful. In contrast, the harm the vaccines do is very well substantiated […]” Vaccine-enhanced herd immunity is in question. On August 3, Iceland’s Chief Epidemiologist announced that their 95% nation-wide full vaccination rate, “[…] has not led to the herd immunity that experts hoped for. In the past two to three weeks, the Delta variant has outstripped all others in Iceland and it has become clear that vaccinated people can easily contract it as well as spread it to others,”_


_There is precedence for vaccine failure in respiratory viruses as noted in the journal Nature Microbiology last September, “Data from the study of SARS-CoV and other respiratory viruses suggest that anti-SARS-CoV-2 antibodies could exacerbate COVID-19 through antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE), resulting in failed vaccine trials.” Evidence suggests ADE could cause viral interference and along with other (influenza) vaccines alter our immune systems non-specifically to increase susceptibility to other infections. The mRNA vaccines may redirect our cells away from suppressing latent immunity issues from previous infections (e.g., chicken pox). Consider along with what Dr. Malone describes as an “entire population [that] has been trained via a universal vaccination strategy to have the same basic immune response, then once a viral escape mutant is selected, it will rapidly spread through the entire population – whether vaccinated or not.” It could mean massive problems ahead for the global COVID-19 vaccinated as they encounter variations and even simple viruses like the flu, in combination._
**





> The people I know who have received the jab have not fallen over yet.  Maybe it is a delayed action, who can know?


The people I know who have received the jab haven't died yet either. That being said, many reported the jabs making them feel pretty ill and there is evidence that while many will survive the jabs, their life expectancy may be significantly reduced because of them.




> Could it be that this new type of vaccine, mRNA, will result in better treatment of other diseases, such as cancer?  I realize that the world is being used as a grand experiment but maybe, just maybe, some good will come from what we are doing.
> Is that too positive of thought for the dark world we now live?



Based on all the evidence I've seen, I think it is. That being said, I -do- believe that the hard lessons we learn from these vaccines will serve future generations. As in, people need to stop trusting their governments so much and think more for themselves, do their own research.

----------


## phoenyx

> Back in boot camp 1969 the military gave recruits many injections most of which we didn't know what it was.  We would just stand in line and a corpman would inject men one at a time.
> 
> I remember vividly getting a double does of penicillin.  Huge needle.  We stood in line and dropped our drawers and bent over.  It was actually kind of nightmarish.  Some of the fatter men would reach around and pull the needle back out, which only resulted in getting injected twice.  For a couple of days it felt as if a baseball had been injected into your butt, hurt like hell.


Yeah, the military seems to have a bit of a history of tossing informed consent out the window.

----------


## Fall River

> Did you ever wonder WHY no vaccine has ever been developed for the common cold?
> The common cold virus is a coronavirus. The virus causing covid and its variants are also coronaviruses. Coronaviruses mutate rapidly, and are ever-changing, which makes effective vaccines almost impossible. This is probably why we are seeing poor long-term effectiveness of the vaccines, and I don't expect that will change. 
> 
> The GOOD thing is that virus mutations normally cause a more contagious organism, but also less lethal, so if things go as would normally be expected, this will probably eventually be about the equivalent of a common cold or a flu virus infection, which is already the case for a good many of us.


The common cold is usually caused by rhinoviruses whereas COVID-19 was caused by SARS-CoV-2.

I believe they said the vaccine only lasts about 6 to 8 months so even without variants it might have kept on infecting and reinfecting.  

The Delta variant may be less lethal but it's still lethal enough to kill lots of people, according to recent news reports.

----------


## Fall River

> That's it right there! Flu vaccines are a big money maker for the Big Pharma oligarchy and nothing more.


Yeah man, I heard that Big Pharma had a conference with the coronavirus and said, "you keep infecting people and we'll cut you in on the profits!   :Smiley ROFLMAO:

----------


## Quark

> The common cold is usually caused by rhinoviruses whereas COVID-19 was caused by SARS-CoV-2.
> 
> I believe they said the vaccine only lasts about 6 to 8 months so even without variants it might have kept on infecting and reinfecting.  
> 
> The Delta variant may be less lethal but it's still lethal enough to kill lots of people, according to recent news reports.


True but the rhinovirus is still a COVID virus and is listed as such. Develop a safe and good and effective common cold vaccine and I might believe and consider again flu shots but that's not likely.

----------


## Quark

> Yeah man, I heard that Big Pharma had a conference with the coronavirus and said, "you keep infecting people and we'll cut you in on the profits!


Big Pharma oligarchy knows that so-called flu vaccines are useless and so doesn't the government so ya it's all about the money.

----------


## Oceander

> True but the rhinovirus is still a COVID virus and is listed as such. Develop a safe and good and effective common cold vaccine and I might believe and consider again flu shots but that's not likely.


No, the rhinovirus is not a coronavirus.  See, e.g., this article, which briefly discusses the virology of each type of virus:  Respiratory Viral Infections: Update on Human Rhinovirus and Coronavirus Infections

----------

Fall River (09-08-2021)

----------


## Kodiak

> The common cold is usually caused by rhinoviruses whereas COVID-19 was caused by SARS-CoV-2.
> 
> I believe they said the vaccine only lasts about 6 to 8 months so even without variants it might have kept on infecting and reinfecting.  
> 
> The Delta variant may be less lethal but it's still lethal enough to kill lots of people, according to recent news reports.


Not near enough to warrant forcing businesses to close down or making kids wear masks that don't work.  That is if they can even go to school.

----------


## Fall River

> Big Pharma oligarchy knows that so-called flu vaccines are useless and so doesn't the government so ya it's all about the money.


No, they didn't know because they didn't test their vaccines long enough to know how long it would protect against the virus.  With hind-sight we now know. 

You must be getting your information from Clay & Buck because I heard them say "vaccines don't work!"  What they really mean is that the protection against the virus has expired.  It was always known that could happen. That's why the mRNA vaccine was considered experimental.

----------


## tiny1

> Do the mRNA vaccines cause Antibody Dependent Enhancement (ADE) with COVID-19 disease? | Immunize BC
> 
> *Friday, July 30, 2021:  ADE is not expected to be a concern for SARS-CoV-2 infections or vaccinations.*


These effing people have lied to you from the start.  How, on God's Green Earth can you sit there and tell me you are confident enough in these people to believe their lies?  It would be asinine to believe them.
Wise up.  YOu are being Duped.

----------


## Fall River

> Not near enough to warrant forcing businesses to close down or making kids wear masks that don't work.  That is if they can even go to school.


I was just trying my best to tell the truth about the virus as I see it. What people should or shouldn't do about it, after the facts are known, isn't up to me. Although, I live in Florida and I'm not complaining about the job DeSantis is doing. I like living in Florida.

----------


## Fall River

> These effing people have lied to you from the start.  How, on God's Green Earth can you sit there and tell me you are confident enough in these people to believe their lies?  It would be asinine to believe them.
> Wise up.  YOu are being Duped.


Please excuse the delay but I had to go back to the top to see if we are still on the science board. 

When I started this thread, I didn't know if ADE was really a problem or not, and I was curious about it. So I started looking for links to see what I might find. 

I'm still open for suggestions. Where did you find the truth about ADE?

----------


## nonsqtr

> I was just trying my best to tell the truth about the virus as I see it. What people should or shouldn't do about it, after the facts are known, isn't up to me. Although, I live in Florida and I'm not complaining about the job DeSantis is doing. I like living in Florida.


Oh come on, give us a break.

The "truth" from a fact checker?

You were born yesterday?

----------


## El Guapo

> There is no evidence to suggest


+


> A baseless quote


=





 Editorial opinion pretending to be news

----------


## YellowRose

> The common cold is usually caused by rhinoviruses whereas COVID-19 was caused by SARS-CoV-2.
> 
> I believe they said the vaccine only lasts about 6 to 8 months so even without variants it might have kept on infecting and reinfecting.  
> 
> The Delta variant may be less lethal but it's still lethal enough to kill lots of people, according to recent news reports.


From the Cedars-Sinai site:

Coronavirus is an entire family of viruses, which like the flu, mainly spreads through respiratory droplets. Four of these viruses are similar to the common cold in terms of symptoms and severity. The novel coronavirus, or SARS-CoV-2, is a potentially deadly virus that can lead to COVID-19.Oct 7, 2020


And...


A recent study conducted by investigators from Yale University’s School of Medicine has discovered that the rhinovirus, the most common cause of the common cold, can help to protect against the SARS-CoV-2 virus and combat COVID-19.

Results from the study were published in the Journal of Experimental Medicine.


The Common Cold Helps Protect Against COVID-19

----------

Fall River (09-08-2021)

----------


## TLSG

More proof this vaccine was never about keeping you safe. It's just a new way to push conformity and compliance.




> Rutgers University has banned a student from attending virtual classes because he was unvaccinated.
> 
> Logan Hollar, 22, is taking online classes over 70 miles away from the New Brunswick campus, but the university claims that the vaccine mandate still applies to him.


Gateway Pundit

----------

Big Dummy (09-07-2021),Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),dinosaur (09-07-2021),Foghorn (09-07-2021),Lone Gunman (09-07-2021),phoenyx (09-07-2021),Quark (09-07-2021),QuaseMarco (09-07-2021),Rebel Yell (09-07-2021),Rutabaga (09-07-2021),WVYankee (09-07-2021)

----------


## WVYankee

C'mon, man! Haven't you ever heard of computer viruses?

----------

Authentic (09-07-2021),Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),dinosaur (09-07-2021),Foghorn (09-07-2021),Lone Gunman (09-07-2021),nonsqtr (09-07-2021),phoenyx (09-07-2021),Quark (09-07-2021),Rebel Yell (09-07-2021),Rutabaga (09-07-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

:Smiley ROFLMAO: 


its like when progs overreact to a shooting 45 miles away from a school...



they close it down and hide and the children, call the police/parents, bring in counselors and other pseudo science practitioners, all the while running around like a chicken with its head cut off screaming,,


​"WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN!!!!"

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),dinosaur (09-07-2021),Foghorn (09-07-2021),Lone Gunman (09-07-2021),phoenyx (09-07-2021),Quark (09-07-2021),WVYankee (09-07-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

> C'mon, man! Haven't you ever heard of computer viruses?


oh yea!

give me covid, any day...

----------

dinosaur (09-07-2021),Foghorn (09-07-2021),Lone Gunman (09-07-2021),phoenyx (09-07-2021),WVYankee (09-07-2021)

----------


## Rebel Yell

Critical thinking and the Scientific Method have been replaced with the ever-changing canon of Woke dogma.

----------

Big Dummy (09-07-2021),Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),dinosaur (09-07-2021),Foghorn (09-07-2021),Lone Gunman (09-07-2021),nonsqtr (09-07-2021),Quark (09-07-2021),Rutabaga (09-07-2021),WVYankee (09-07-2021)

----------


## Big Dummy

Hopefully he is the next lawsuit millionaire.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),dinosaur (09-07-2021),Foghorn (09-07-2021),Lone Gunman (09-07-2021),Quark (09-07-2021),QuaseMarco (09-07-2021),Rebel Yell (09-07-2021),Rutabaga (09-07-2021)

----------


## Quark

> Critical thinking and the Scientific Method have been replaced with the ever-changing canon of Woke dogma.


Science has become a religion and one of the head "gods" is God Fauci.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),dinosaur (09-07-2021),Foghorn (09-07-2021),Lone Gunman (09-07-2021),Rebel Yell (09-07-2021),Rutabaga (09-07-2021)

----------


## WVYankee

> Critical thinking and the Scientific Method have been replaced with the ever-changing canon of Woke dogma.


Well, just speaking from personal experience and not in any way inferring that anyone else has (haha), but--more than once I admit to having *"woken"* up with a hangover the morning after, with absolutely no idea of the occurrences of the evening before, feeling as though my head would implode any second. Then I grew up, awakened to some very sobering facts that this sort of behavior has to end. Abruptly.

Sound eerily familiar, kind of like the hangover the nation is experiencing with China Joe and his puppet masters, our military's "leaders," our agencies (cia, fbi), "educational system," super inflation, border crises,  liberal courts and MSM that has produced, in just eight months after the coup that unseated the man everyone is now regretting in their "waking" nightmare of buyer's remorse?

Me thinks so!

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),dinosaur (09-07-2021),Foghorn (09-07-2021),Lone Gunman (09-07-2021),Quark (09-07-2021),Rebel Yell (09-07-2021),Rutabaga (09-07-2021)

----------


## Foghorn

Liberals are the Mooo variant.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),Lone Gunman (09-07-2021),Quark (09-07-2021),Rebel Yell (09-07-2021),Rutabaga (09-07-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

NIH Began Study on Vaccine Safety For Pregnant Women AFTER Many Moms Had Taken The Jab - National File


The World is upside down :Geez:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),dinosaur (09-07-2021),Quark (09-07-2021)

----------


## dinosaur

Vax researcher 1:  Why are we not testing for birth defects?
Vax researcher 2:  No need, they will all self abort.

 :Geez:

----------

WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

The New England Journal of medicine already did a study on the effects of Covid vaccines on pregnant women. Here's an excerpt:


**
A horrifying study published in the New England Journal of Medicine reveals that when pregnant women are given COVID vaccines during their first or second trimesters, they suffer an 82% spontaneous abortion rate, killing 4 out of 5 unborn babies.This stunning finding, explained below, is self-evident from the data published in a new study entitled, “Preliminary Findings of mRNA Covid-19 Vaccine Safety in Pregnant Persons.”
Just as disturbing as the data is the fact that the study authors apparently sought to deliberately obfuscate the truth about vaccines causing spontaneous abortions by obfuscating numbers in their own calculations.
Originally brought to our attention by a Life Site News article, we checked with our own medical contacts to review the data and double check all the math. In doing so, we were able to confirm two things:
Yes, the study shows an 82% rate of spontaneous abortions in expectant mothers given COVID vaccines during their first or second trimesters.
Yes, the study authors either deliberately sought to hide this fact with dishonest obfuscation (explained below) or they are incompetent and made a glaring error that brings into question their credibility.
In other words, this study was almost certainly a cover-up to try to claim vaccinating pregnant women is perfectly safe. But the study data actually show quite the [opposite].
[snip]
**

Full article:
Despite 82% Miscarriage Rate among 1st and 2nd Trimester Pregnant Women after Vax, CDC Urges Pregnant to Get Vax | johnccarleton.org

----------

WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

*YOU CANNOT TOP THIS!!! AFTER TELLING PREGNANT WOMEN THAT THE VACCINE IS SAFE....... 
*
*NIH Began Study on Vaccine Safety For Pregnant Women AFTER Many Moms Had Taken The Jab*


National Institutes of Health (NIH), of which Dr. Anthony Fauci’s NIAID is a member, launched its study on the effects and “vaccine safety” of the Coronavirus vaccine on pregnant women and their babies AFTER many pregnant women got the jab. NIH materials from June 23, 2021 announcing the “MOMI-VAX” study quote Fauci as saying the following: “Tens of thousands of pregnant and breastfeeding people in the United States have chosen to receive the COVID-19 vaccines available under emergency use authorization. However, we lack robust, prospective clinical data on vaccination in these populations. The results of this study will fill gaps in our knowledge and help inform policy recommendations and personal decision-making on COVID-19 vaccination during pregnancy and in the postpartum period.”

https://nationalfile.com/nih-began-s...taken-the-jab/

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-07-2021),Quark (09-07-2021),WarriorRob (09-07-2021),YellowRose (09-07-2021)

----------


## Traddles

I went and found the NEJM study @phoenyx's article referenced but didn't link, https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2104983 . I found nothing in it even resembling this claim:




> A horrifying study published in the New England Journal of Medicine reveals that when pregnant women are given COVID vaccines during their first or second trimesters, they suffer an 82% spontaneous abortion rate, killing 4 out of 5 unborn babies.

----------

Hillofbeans (09-08-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> I went and found the NEJM study @phoenyx's article referenced but didn't link, https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2104983 . I found nothing in it even resembling this claim:


Hardly surprising- the article I referenced made it clear that the study made no such claim. As I quoted from the article in my last post:


**
Yes, the study authors either deliberately sought to hide this fact with dishonest obfuscation (explained below) or they are incompetent and made a glaring error that brings into question their credibility.
In other words, this study was almost certainly a cover-up to try to claim vaccinating pregnant women is perfectly safe. But the study data actually show quite the [opposite].

**


Here's how they claim the authors of the study misled people as to the true results of their study:
**
Here’s how:
700 of the 827 women were vaccinated in the third trimester
Table 4 from the study, shown below, reveals that a total of 827 pregnant women were studied.
Out of the 827 women, 700 of them received their first vaccine in their third trimester of pregnancy. This means 127 women (which is 827 – 700) received a vaccine during their first or second trimesters.
Out of the 127 women receiving vaccines during their first or second trimesters, 104 spontaneous abortions occurred before their pregnancies hit the 20-week mark. These are indicated as “spontaneous abortions” in the table.
In simple math, 104 spontaneous abortions (during the first 20 weeks) out of 127 women who received vaccines in their first or second trimesters calculates to an 82% rate of spontaneous abortions among these pregnant women who were vaccinated.
It is important to note that deaths of unborn babies during the third trimester are known as “stillbirths” and not spontaneous abortions. Thus, the spontaneous abortions could not have possibly occurred in women vaccinated during their third trimester, by definition.
Thus, the study authors dishonestly used the wrong denominator of 827 in their “spontaneous abortions” calculation, when they should have used a denominator of 127, which is the number of women receiving vaccines during their first or second trimesters.


Put another way, it is impossible for a woman who was vaccinated for the first time during her third trimester to have a “spontaneous abortion” in the first 20 weeks, since they weren’t vaccinated during the first 20 weeks (and pregnant women aren’t time travelers). Thus, those women shouldn’t be included in the denominator used to calculate the spontaneous abortion rate.
The authors of this study should receive an award in the category of, “How to lie with statistics,” because they apparently tried to pull a sleight-of-hand trick to make it appear that vaccines are safe for pregnant women. In reality, they seem to be killing more than 4 out of 5 unborn babies in the first 20 weeks of gestation, at least in this data set. (It’s a small set of 127 pregnant women, so we’d like to see a larger review of many thousands of pregnancies in order to get a more clear picture.)
**


Now, I'm the first to admit that I haven't checked all that math. If you're interested, go ahead and double check their math and see if you can find a flaw.

----------

WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## Traddles

Existing thread on this topic, NIH are just now beginning study on Vaccine effects on Pregnant women? .

----------


## Quark

> *YOU CANNOT TOP THIS!!! AFTER TELLING PREGNANT WOMEN THAT THE VACCINE IS SAFE....... 
> *
> *NIH Began Study on Vaccine Safety For Pregnant Women AFTER Many Moms Had Taken The Jab*
> 
> 
> National Institutes of Health (NIH), of which Dr. Anthony Fauci’s NIAID is a member, launched its study on the effects and “vaccine safety” of the Coronavirus vaccine on pregnant women and their babies AFTER many pregnant women got the jab. NIH materials from June 23, 2021 announcing the “MOMI-VAX” study quote Fauci as saying the following: “Tens of thousands of pregnant and breastfeeding people in the United States have chosen to receive the COVID-19 vaccines available under emergency use authorization. However, we lack robust, prospective clinical data on vaccination in these populations. The results of this study will fill gaps in our knowledge and help inform policy recommendations and personal decision-making on COVID-19 vaccination during pregnancy and in the postpartum period.”
> 
> https://nationalfile.com/nih-began-s...taken-the-jab/


The death vaccine. After tens of thousands of vaccinating pregnant women and breast feeding women NOW WE ARE GOING TO SEE IF THE DAMN VACCINE IS SAFE!!!!!!!!!

----------

QuaseMarco (09-07-2021),WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## JMWinPR

Wellll it duzn't appear to be safe for men who identify as men either. The Fauch is competing with Mengele.

----------

JustPassinThru (09-10-2021),Quark (09-07-2021),QuaseMarco (09-07-2021),WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## Dan40

First, Barb and I are vaccinated, months ago. Barb is 81 years old.  We had to fill out sheets of papers and answer many questions.  They asked my 81 year old wife if she was pregnant or intended to become pregnant. BECAUSE if so she could NOT be vaccinated.  So back in 2/21 they were not vaxxing preggers women.  They even asked me if I was preggers, just  forms they had to fill out and each of us sign.     No rumors, no guesses, no opinions, no hysteria,  actual live experience.

----------

dinosaur (09-08-2021),Hillofbeans (09-08-2021),Quark (09-07-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

Missed it:  :Geez: 
https://thepoliticsforums.com/thread...Pregnant-women

Maybe @Trinnity can merge them.............. :Dontknow:

----------

Trinnity (09-07-2021),WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## Quark

> First, Barb and I are vaccinated, months ago. Barb is 81 years old.  We had to fill out sheets of papers and answer many questions.  They asked my 81 year old wife if she was pregnant or intended to become pregnant. BECAUSE if so she could NOT be vaccinated.  So back in 2/21 they were not vaxxing preggers women.  They even asked me if I was preggers, just  forms they had to fill out and each of us sign.     No rumors, no guesses, no opinions, no hysteria,  actual live experience.


I don't doubt that some places and States are very conscious about giving the shots to people. But other places and States not so much especially those States that mandate shots and vaccine passports.

----------

WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> First, Barb and I are vaccinated, months ago. Barb is 81 years old.  We had to fill out sheets of papers and answer many questions.  They asked my 81 year old wife if she was pregnant or intended to become pregnant. BECAUSE if so she could NOT be vaccinated.  So back in 2/21 they were not vaxxing preggers women.  They even asked me if I was preggers, just  forms they had to fill out and each of us sign.     No rumors, no guesses, no opinions, no hysteria,  actual live experience.


Well that is not the way it ended up. This is not a fake news article. I heard many times on the Mockingbird media over the last several months that the vaccine is A OKAY for pregnant women. I just shook my head in disbelief.

We are experiencing the worst national mania I've ever experienced.
 Illogical to the n'th degree..... Fraud....hoax....lies... collusion..... greed...... megalomania...... evil.

----------

Quark (09-07-2021),WarriorRob (09-07-2021)

----------


## nonsqtr

It would seem to be risky and highly irresponsible to turn a baby's stem cells into S-protein factories

----------


## QuaseMarco

*Not a Life and Death Issue: NIH Orders $1.67 Million Study on How Coronavirus Vaccines Affect Menstrual Cycles

*Since early 2021, women have reported strange side effects after receiving their first two doses of the coronavirus vaccines, though those reports have been largely anecdotal. Fearing an increase in vaccine hesitancy among women, the NIH said in an announcement last week that it will further investigate claims that the vaccines negatively affect a womans reproductive health:

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...strual-cycles/

*Shoot first, ask questions later.*

----------


## phoenyx

> *‘Not a Life and Death Issue’: NIH Orders $1.67 Million Study on How Coronavirus Vaccines Affect Menstrual Cycles
> 
> *Since early 2021, women have reported strange side effects after receiving their first two doses of the coronavirus vaccines, though those reports have been largely anecdotal. Fearing an increase in vaccine hesitancy among women, the NIH said in an announcement last week that it will further investigate claims that the vaccines negatively affect a woman’s reproductive health:
> 
> https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...strual-cycles/
> 
> *Shoot first, ask questions later.*



I'd think an 82% miscarriage rate after getting one of these vaccines definitely counts as life or death, for the pregnancy anyway:
NIH are just now beginning study on Vaccine effects on Pregnant women?

----------


## Fall River

> From the Cedars-Sinai site:
> 
> Coronavirus is an entire family of viruses, which like the flu, mainly spreads through respiratory droplets. Four of these viruses are similar to the common cold in terms of symptoms and severity. The novel coronavirus, or SARS-CoV-2, is a potentially deadly virus that can lead to COVID-19.Oct 7, 2020
> 
> 
> And...
> 
> 
> A recent study conducted by investigators from Yale University’s School of Medicine has discovered that the rhinovirus, the most common cause of the common cold, can help to protect against the SARS-CoV-2 virus and combat COVID-19.
> ...



Thanks for providing that study. It was interesting and maybe they are on to something if only they would take the time to do more in extensive studies.  So far, it has only worked in a lab using infected lab-grown tissue.

One thing I heard last year is that if you were vaccinated for the seasonal flu, your symptoms would be less if you contracted COVID-19.  I was vaccinated for the seasonal flu in oct. of 2019. And when I contracted the virus in Feb. of 2020, basically, it only took me one day to recover from the major symptoms with just occasional coughing the next day.  So that might also be worth looking into. I'm not aware of any study for that.

----------


## QuaseMarco

*THIS IS CRAZY! IT WAS NEVER ABOUT THE VIRUS  JUST IN: Rutgers University Has Banned A Student From Attending Virtual Classes Because He Was Unvaccinated*


Rutgers University has banned a student from attending virtual classes because he was unvaccinated.
22-year-old Logan Hollar is taking online classes over 70 miles away from the New Brunswick campus, however, the university asserts that the vaccine mandate still applies to him.
Im not in an at-risk age group. Im healthy and I work out. I dont find COVID to be scary, Hollar said. If someone wants to be vaccinated, thats fine with me, but I dont think they should be pushed.
Rutgers was the first university to mandate vaccines for all students last Spring but originally did not require them for students who were learning remotely.
Hollar believed that those exceptions would still apply since he will not be on campus.
When they put out the guidance in March, I was reading through all the verbiage, which was if you plan to return to campus, you need to be vaccinated, he said. I figured I wouldnt be part of that because all my classes were remote.
As reported by NJ.com Hollar said he checked his Rutgers email without issue at the beginning of August and he successfully switched out of a class on Aug. 6.
Then, he was required to fill out a questionnaire about the vaccine.
Hollar discloses that he had checked a box saying that the mandate did not apply to him since he was only taking the online classes.
After submitting the survey, I got no pop-up indication that I still needed the vaccine  like I had seen in the past  and since I was online and the survey said I was all set, I assumed the emails in my inbox pertaining to (the vaccine) must apply to in-person students, Hollar said.
This turned out not to be the case, he added.
When Hollar went to pay his tuition bill on August 27 he was locked out of his university email and other accounts.
The senior was informed that he would need to get vaccinated to have his accounts restored and continue his education unless he obtained an exemption letter from a doctor.
Days later, I called back since I hadnt received anything. They told me that unfortunately, they had decided that they would not grant waivers for anyone who had put in for them past Aug. 23, even though I was told that I could get one with no problem on the 27th, he continued explaining.
Hollar has not been able to attend any of his classes that started on September 1.
At the moment, Hollar believes that he will have to move to another university.
I find it concerning for the vaccine to be pushed by the university rather than my doctor, he said. Ill probably have to transfer to a different university.
I dont care if I have access to campus. I dont need to be there. They could ban me. I just want to be left alone, he added

https://worthypolitics.com/this-is-c...-unvaccinated/

----------


## Dan40

> Well that is not the way it ended up. This is not a fake news article. I heard many times on the Mockingbird media over the last several months that the vaccine is A OKAY for pregnant women. I just shook my head in disbelief.
> 
> We are experiencing the worst national mania I've ever experienced.
>  Illogical to the n'th degree..... Fraud....hoax....lies... collusion..... greed...... megalomania...... evil.


Agreed,  and from BOTH sides.

----------


## Dan40

> I don't doubt that some places and States are very conscious about giving the shots to people. But other places and States not so much especially those States that mandate shots and vaccine passports.


Can't comment on "other places" as I am no longer able to believe any reports about covid or vaccines.  Too much hysterical bullshit from all sides.  My life experience IS that they were very careful about pregnancy HERE.

----------


## Sunsettommy



----------

Oceander (09-08-2021)

----------


## Sunsettommy

Pj Media

*The CDC Just Made an Orwellian Change to the Definition of Vaccine and Vaccination'*
BY MATT MARGOLIS SEP 08, 2021



Excerpt:


For your entire life, youve known that when you get vaccinated, youre protected from a particular disease. Youve probably been vaccinated for such diseases as polio, tetanus, measles, diphtheria, and others, and you no longer have to worry about them, because the whole reason your parents took you to the doctor to get those shots was to protect you from those diseases. Polio, in particular, has been completely wiped out in the United States thanks to the immunity created by vaccination.


This is why the CDC says that vaccines provide immunity, which means that we can be exposed to a disease without becoming infected by it.


At least they used to.



LINK


========

What a pathetic attempt to prop up their failing experimental vaccines of today!

----------

12icer (09-08-2021),dinosaur (09-08-2021),East of the Beast (09-08-2021),Foghorn (09-08-2021),Lone Gunman (09-08-2021),QuaseMarco (09-08-2021),Rutabaga (09-08-2021),Thom Paine (09-08-2021),WarriorRob (09-08-2021)

----------


## Oceander

I am not aware of a single vaccine that has ever been given a claim of 100% certifiable protection from the disease vaccinated against.  And I'm not alone:  Top 20 Questions about Vaccination | History of Vaccines
(that article was last updated in 2018, so unless one believes in time machines, it was not slanted for pro-covid political purposes).

----------

Call_me_Ishmael (09-08-2021),Fall River (09-08-2021),Foghorn (09-08-2021),Rutabaga (09-08-2021),Swedgin (09-08-2021),Thom Paine (09-08-2021)

----------


## Knightkore

So I don't get it.  Do they WANT us to trust the vaccine or not?  Because every time they do some dumbass explanation, change definitions or hype it up they make taking the vaccine less & less appealing.

Either they NEED to shut the hell up.....& let people decide for themselves or.....finally admit these shots are at best worthless & worst harmful.

----------

WarriorRob (09-08-2021)

----------


## Swedgin

The Flu Vaccine never really worked that way.

Thus the reason we need one, every year.

There is also a vaccine to Pnuemonia (spelling), but, we only need that every so many years.

It is advised to take boosters for Tetanus, as well.

----------

Fall River (09-08-2021),Knightkore (09-08-2021),Rutabaga (09-08-2021),Sunsettommy (09-08-2021),WarriorRob (09-08-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

I'm always (recently) amazed how the very people who say they don't trust the government, feel hurt, offended, astounded,  shocked, angry when the gubmint changes something. 

Have those folks been thinking that the gooberment is gospel and infallible? And when the gooberment changes something or flip-flops, do these folks view it as discovering that there is no Santa Clause, that Mom and Dad make mistakes, and their girlfriend picks their nose? I'm baffled.  I mean I take whatever information makes sense to me. Sometimes the gooberment provides information that helps.  Sometimes they say nonsense.  So I am never astounded, shocked, disappointed, or confused if the gooberment changes definitions or recommendations or guidelines.  

I first noticed it with the masks. 

Just a suggestion.... don't expect the gooberment to hold your hand in life. And don't expect that it will always do the right thing.  It seldom does. Protect yourself from disappointment by doing your own research, your own vetting, your own thinking.  Sure you still have to face living within the laws or exercising civil disobedience . But it should be for something that makes sense to you.. not because the gooberment disappointed you by indecision or flip-flopping.

----------


## Fall River

> Investigative Report: Rolling Stone Issues  After Horse De-wormer Hit Piece Debunked
> 
> 
> MSM are the enemy of the people 11 people got minor ailments like Nausea and Diarrhea, none died



Just because the Rolling stone story was found to be a lie, does that mean ivermectin is safe & effective?   :Thinking:

----------

WarriorRob (09-08-2021)

----------


## Fall River

> 



The article says "Pfizer initiates phase 1 study".  A phase 1 study is so incredibly small it is unlikely to prove anything as far as safety and effectiveness.  It's only a first little baby step. Then comes phase 2 and phase 3.  

Then the first 3 phases should be followed by much bigger studies involving thousands of people.  

And if they do the same as they did with the nRNA vaccines like shorten the study time and approve it quickly, it will be considered experimental and will have risks like getting vaccinated has risks.

----------

WarriorRob (09-08-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> Just because the Rolling stone story was found to be a lie, does that mean ivermectin is safe & effective?


Has to be better than the Jab, which is 0% affective in fighting Covid-19.

----------


## WarriorRob

> The article says "Pfizer initiates phase 1 study".  A phase 1 study is so incredibly small it is unlikely to prove anything as far as safety and effectiveness.  It's only a first little baby step. Then comes phase 2 and phase 3.  
> 
> Then the first 3 phases should be followed by much bigger studies involving thousands of people.  
> 
> And if they do the same as they did with the nRNA vaccines like shorten the study time and approve it quickly, it will be considered experimental and will have risks like getting vaccinated has risks.


Why are the even doing this :Thinking: They already have millions of Guinea Pigs :Thinking:

----------


## WarriorRob

Maybe those vaccines work for, polio, tetanus, measles, diphtheria because :Thinking:  they tested those years in advance before they used them on the public and they aren't a Virus :Thinking:  "These vaccines" Plural have never been tested yet at least on a grand scale like the rest of the vaccines :Thinking:  plus in my opinion no vaccine can work against Viruses even the flu, if that was the case why is there still flu viruses and the common cold :Thinking: these vaccines are similar to the flu vaccine. I've seen people catch the flu after taking a flu vaccine, they say it lessens the symptoms :Thinking: I'm not a Doctor but think these vaccines are all a big pile of Horse sh*t :Angry20:

----------


## Oceander

> Maybe those vaccines work for, polio, tetanus, measles, diphtheria because they tested those years in advance before they used them on the public and they aren't a Virus "These vaccines" Plural have never been tested yet at least on a grand scale like the rest of the vaccines plus in my opinion no vaccine can work against Viruses even the flu, if that was the case why is there still flu viruses and the common coldthese vaccines are similar to the flu vaccine. I've seen people catch the flu after taking a flu vaccine, they say it lessens the symptomsI'm not a Doctor but think these vaccines are all a big pile of Horse sh*t


What isn't a "Virus"?

----------

WarriorRob (09-08-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> Has to be better than the Jab, which is 0% affective in fighting Covid-19.


Bullshit.

----------


## WarriorRob

> What isn't a "Virus"?


_polio, tetanus, measles, diphtheria_

----------


## WarriorRob

> Bullshit.



So how do you explain more covid-19 shots and now they want you to take booster shots :Thinking:  Oh!!! and now they are making them in the pill form :Smiley ROFLMAO:

----------


## Oceander

> So how do you explain more covid-19 shots and now they want you to take booster shots Oh!!! and now they are making them in the pill form


Because "effective" does not mean "guaranteed 100% magic bullet."

There is *no* vaccine - and no natural immunity - that gives guaranteed 100% protection against a subsequent infection.

So, if "effective" means that there is no chance of getting an infection, then even natural immunity is not "effective".

That's a pretty stupid conclusion to arrive at, and yet that is the conclusion you appear to be logically committed to.

----------

Fall River (09-09-2021),Swedgin (09-09-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> _polio, tetanus, measles, diphtheria_


 :Smiley ROFLMAO: 


I guess poliomyelitis and poliovirus are just figments of the imagination of Jonas Salk.

And Measles morbillivirus that of someone else.

Diptheria and tetanus are bacterial infections, that is true.

----------

tlmjl (09-08-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> Because "effective" does not mean "guaranteed 100% magic bullet."
> 
> There is *no* vaccine - and no natural immunity - that gives guaranteed 100% protection against a subsequent infection.
> 
> So, if "effective" means that there is no chance of getting an infection, then even natural immunity is not "effective".
> 
> That's a pretty stupid conclusion to arrive at, and yet that is the conclusion you appear to be logically committed to.


I guess if you want to take vaccines every six months for the rest of your life, that seems like a pretty stupid logical thing to commit to as well, that's if you are one of the stupid ones to do that, that is :Dontknow:

----------


## WarriorRob

> I guess poliomyelitis and poliovirus are just figments of the imagination of Jonas Salk.
> 
> And Measles morbillivirus that of someone else.
> 
> Diptheria and tetanus are bacterial infections, that is true.


I guess we need extra booster shots for them as well then :Smiley ROFLMAO: and throw in the pill form while you're at it :Smiley ROFLMAO:

----------


## Oceander

> I guess we need extra booster shots for them as well thenand throw in the pill form while you're at it


A quick search indicates that a booster for measles may in fact be warranted.

So, once again, why adhere to a stupid conclusion?

----------


## Oceander

> I guess if you want to take vaccines every six months for the rest of your life, that seems like a pretty stupid logical thing to commit to as well, that's if you are one of the stupid ones to do that, that is


Wow.  You really like to set up your own pretty little strawmen just to knock them down.

Like I said, for whatever reason, you've committed yourself to a stupid conclusion.

Oh well, play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

----------

Fall River (09-09-2021),Swedgin (09-09-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> A quick search indicates that a booster for measles may in fact be warranted.
> 
> So, once again, why adhere to a stupid conclusion?


Lets do some Booster shots along with 3 or 4 Vaccine shots, let also throw in a pill form. I guess since you seem like a small fella, does that sound like some sound advice in combating Covid or is that some stupid advice?

----------


## Oceander

> Lets do some Booster shots along with 3 or 4 Vaccine shots, let also throw in a pill form. I guess since you seem like a small fella, does that sound like some sound advice in combating Covid or is that some stupid advice?


Dig, dig, dig.

First rule of not being stupid:  when you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.

High time you stopped digging.

----------


## Authentic

Viruses are real (the government doesn't exist).

----------


## WarriorRob

> Wow.  You really like to set up your own pretty little strawmen just to knock them down.
> 
> Like I said, for whatever reason, you've committed yourself to a stupid conclusion.
> 
> Oh well, play stupid games, win stupid prizes.


So you say I committed myself to stupid conclusions. I'm not the one that wants to keep taking Vaccines that obviously do not work to fight covid-19 that has a 99.97% recovery rate :Thinking:  If you have taken the Vaccine and want to keep on taking them knock yourself out, that to me isn't very smart :Dontknow:  this isn't petty this is reality, you will find out eventually that this is mostly all about making money, maybe :Dontknow:

----------


## WarriorRob

> Dig, dig, dig.
> 
> First rule of not being stupid:  when you find yourself in a hole, stop digging.
> 
> High time you stopped digging.


I meant smart fella not small fella. Yep exactly, keep on digging :Smiley ROFLMAO:

----------


## WarriorRob

> Viruses are real (the government doesn't exist).



Yep and they been on earth for probably millions of years, the DemonRats are using this Flu Virus for Political Purposes :Angry20:

----------


## Oceander

> I meant smart fella not small fella. Yep exactly, keep on digging


Like I said, high time you stopped digging.  Too much longer, and your IQ will enter negative territory.

----------


## WarriorRob

> Like I said, high time you stopped digging.  Too much longer, and your IQ will enter negative territory.


 :Notworthy:  :Yap:

----------


## Oceander

> So you say I committed myself to stupid conclusions. I'm not the one that wants to keep taking Vaccines that obviously do not work to fight covid-19 that has a 99.97% recovery rate If you have taken the Vaccine and want to keep on taking them knock yourself out, that to me isn't very smart this isn't petty this is reality, you will find out eventually that this is mostly all about making money, maybe


You keep making facetious claims about what does and does not "work" without explaining what you mean by "work", other than what can be gleaned by inference from your statements, in which "work" appears to mean 100% protection.

But then, by your very own words, that means that natural immunity "does not work" - and that is a rather stupid position to take.

So, keep digging.  We'll get an object lesson in what the limit of posting is as IQ approaches 0.

----------

Fall River (09-09-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> You keep making facetious claims about what does and does not "work" without explaining what you mean by "work", other than what can be gleaned by inference from your statements, in which "work" appears to mean 100% protection.
> 
> But then, by your very own words, that means that natural immunity "does not work" - and that is a rather stupid position to take.
> 
> So, keep digging.  We'll get an object lesson in what the limit of posting is as IQ approaches 0.


You keep calling me stupid, we might get both banned from this forum. I suggest you stop calling me stupid and insulting my intelligence, if you believe in these experimental vaccines more power to you. I refuse to believe in Experimental Vaccines that have pretty bad side effects.

----------

Sunsettommy (09-09-2021)

----------


## tlmjl

Just to clear the air...the before mentioned diseases are viruses.

----------

WarriorRob (09-08-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> Just to clear the air...the before mentioned diseases are viruses.


I stand corrected, thought they were diseases not viruses. I guess they should be labeled diseases caused by viruses :Dontknow:

----------


## WarriorRob

CDC Quietly Changes Definition Of  As COVID-19 Continues To Infect Vaccinated People - National File




The CDC vaccine and vaccination definition changes come as vaccinated people continue to be infected and spread coronavirus. As was previously reported by National File, a new study has revealed that people who are fully vaccinated carry a staggering 251 times the normal viral load of COVID-19. Experts are concerned that this may pose a risk to those who have not received the COVID-19 vaccine, and it also seems likely these increased viral loads could result in more so-called breakthrough cases of those who have been vaccinated contracting COVID-19.

A study by the Oxford University Clinical Research Group published on August 10th in The Lancet found that fully vaccinated people carry 251 times the viral load of coronavirus as compared to those who have not received one of the controversial vaccines. Viral loads of breakthrough Delta variant infection cases were 251 times higher than those of cases infected with old strains detected between March-April 2020, reads the study. The vaccines seem to allow vaccinated individuals to carry unusually high viral loads without becoming sick, transforming them into super spreaders who experience symptoms later on, as reported by Daily Veracity (READ MORE: Jen Psaki Calls Coronavirus The  Global Plandemic)


 :Thinking:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-08-2021),Knightkore (09-09-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

We already have a thread on this, maybe @Trinnity can merge them

----------


## JustPassinThru

I am convinced on the value of ivermectin.

Fark the media liars.  They will be shown in their lies, soon....

----------


## phoenyx

Just came out on Mercola.com today, constructive feedback welcome...

**





*STORY AT-A-GLANCE*


Former Clinton adviser and author Naomi Wolf warns that mandatory COVID-19 passports will spell the end of human liberty in the WestIBM has partnered with COVID-19 vaccine maker Moderna to develop a digital Health Pass system that ties our biometric IDs to our health data through its smartphone app and shares data between governments, health care providers, life science organizations, individuals, food supply chains and global financial systemsIBM aided the Nazi regime in its efforts to eradicate Jews. Without its information technology, Hitler would not have been able to accomplish this genocide at the scale he was able toAt the time of Hitlers rise to power, the world was unaware that massively organized information capabilities had emerged to become a means of social control and weapon of war. Today, we cannot be accused of not understanding that massive data collection can be used to manipulate societies across the globe, and must look to history to see how personal data can be misusedIt would be naïve to think that digital vaccine certificates, tied to our biometric IDs, banking, credit histories, health and food allocation data could not end up being used as a tool for social control and the destruction of certain groups of people



This article was previously published on April 8, 2021, and has been updated with new information.
In a March 28, 2021, interview with Fox News' Steve Hilton, former Clinton adviser and author Naomi Wolf warned that mandatory COVID-19 passports will spell the "end of human liberty in the West":1,2_"'Vaccine passport' sounds like a fine thing if you don't understand what those platforms can do,"_ she said._ "I'm [the] CEO of a tech company, I understand what these platforms can do. It is not about the vaccine, it's not about the virus, it's about your data.__Once this rolls out, you don't have a choice about being part of the system. What people have to understand is that any other functionality can be loaded onto that platform with no problem at all. It can be merged with your Paypal account, with your digital currency.__Microsoft is already talking about merging it with payment plans. Your network can be sucked up. It geolocates you everywhere you go. Your credit history can be included. All of your medical and health history can be included.__This has already happened in Israel, and six months later, we're hearing from activists that it's a two-tiered society and that basically, activists are ostracized and surveilled continually. It is the end of civil society, and they are trying to roll it out around the world.__It is absolutely so much more than a vaccine pass  I cannot stress enough that it has the power to turn off your life, or to turn on your life, to let you engage in society or be marginalized."_*The Forgotten History of IBM*


Wolf also points out the horrific history of IBM,3 whose Digital Health Pass will tie our biometric IDs to our health data through its smartphone app. This "health pass" will then grant or deny us access to public spaces and events, based on our vaccination status.
This is essentially the modern-day version of the punch card system  the forerunner to digital entry on computers  that IBM developed for the Nazi regime, which allowed them to create a census of Jews and other undesirables, who could then be identified, tracked and sorted into groups slated for incarceration or extermination.
In no uncertain terms, IBM's technology facilitated the Third Reich's genocide of the Jewish nation, and IBM leadership aided and abetted the Nazi's reign of terror with full knowledge of what it was doing.
While it's hard to understand how a company playing such an integral role in genocide was allowed to survive past the end of the war, it's even harder to fathom why it would be entrusted to create the same kind of system decades later.
You don't need a tinfoil hat to wonder whether IBM might have been purposely chosen for the task of creating a "health pass" system, for the simple reason that the purpose of the system itself is near-identical to that deployed in Nazi Germany. IBM also has a relationship with the CIA,4 which has a history of mind control abuses and assassination programs.5

*IBM Played Strategic Role in the Holocaust*

IBM's connection to the Third Reich is no secret, and IBM has never denied even the most incriminating details of its involvement in the holocaust. In 2001, Edwin Black, a historian and investigative author, published the book "IBM and the Holocaust,"6 in which he detailed the company's pivotal role in this criminal tragedy.
The book was based on documentation obtained from archives in seven different countries. In 2012, Black obtained another cache of correspondence that revealed just how much IBM knew about what was going on in the Nazi concentration camps. In a February 2012 article in HuffPost, Black wrote:7_"Newly-released documents expose more explicitly the details of IBM's pivotal role in the Holocaust  all six phases: identification, expulsion from society, confiscation, ghettoization, deportation, and even extermination.__Moreover, the documents portray with crystal clarity the personal involvement and micro-management of IBM president Thomas J. Watson in the company's co-planning and co-organizing of Hitler's campaign to destroy the Jews "_The fact that Watson received a 1% commission on all business profits made from the company's business with the Nazis may help explain his eagerness to take on such a hands-on role in this gruesome business. Black continues:_"The new 'expanded edition' [of 'IBM and the Holocaust'] contains 32 pages of never-before-published internal IBM correspondence, State Department and Justice Department memos, and concentration camp documents that graphically chronicle IBM's actions and what they knew during the 12-year Hitler regime __Among the newly-released documents and archival materials are secret 1941 correspondence setting up the Dutch subsidiary of IBM to work in tandem with the Nazis, company President Thomas Watson's personal approval for the 1939 release of special IBM alphabetizing machines to help organize  the deportation of Polish Jews, as well as the IBM Concentration Camp Codes including IBM's code for death by Gas Chamber.__Among the newly published photos of the punch cards is the one developed for the statistician who reported directly to Himmler and Eichmann."_*IBM Guilty of Genocide*

As explained by Black, the population census and identification of Jews were managed by IBM directly, first at its New York headquarters, and later through subsidiaries in Germany, Poland, Holland, France, Switzerland and other European countries. IBM headquarters also directed the activities of a Dutch subsidiary charged with identifying and liquidating Jews in Holland._"Particularly powerful are the newly-released copies of the IBM concentration camp codes,"_ Black writes.8_ "IBM maintained a customer site  in virtually every concentration camp to sort or process punch cards and track prisoners. The codes show IBM's numerical designation for various camps __Various prisoner types were reduced to IBM numbers, with 3 signifying homosexual, 9 for anti-social, and 12 for Gypsy. The IBM number 8 designated a Jew. Inmate death was also reduced to an IBM digit: 3 represented death by natural causes, 4 by execution, 5 by suicide, and code 6 designated 'special treatment' in gas chambers.__IBM engineers had to create Hollerith codes to differentiate between a Jew who had been worked to death and one who had been gassed, then print the cards, configure the machines, train the staff, and continuously maintain the fragile systems every two weeks on site in the concentration camps."_A particularly noteworthy memo came from the U.S. Justice Department, which post-war launched a federal investigation into IBM's relationship with the Hitler regime. The memo, written by Howard J. Carter, the chief investigator of the Economic Warfare Section to his superiors, read:_"What Hitler has done to us through his economic warfare, one of our own American corporations has also done ... Hence IBM is in a class with the Nazis  The entire world citizenry is hampered by an international monster."_Black adds:9_"It is important to remember that Thomas Watson and his corporate behemoth were guilty of genocide. The Treaty on Genocide, Article 2, defines genocide as 'acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial, or religious group.'__In Article 3, the treaty states that among the 'acts [that] shall be punishable,' are the ones in subsection (e), that is 'complicity in genocide.'__As for who shall be punished, the Treaty specifies the perpetrators in Article 4: 'Persons committing genocide or any of the other acts enumerated in Article 3 shall be punished, whether they are constitutionally responsible rulers, public officials, or private individuals.' International Business Machines, and its president Thomas J. Watson, committed genocide by any standard."_*Massively Organized Information as a Means of Social Control*

As noted in Black's introduction to his book, "IBM and the Holocaust: The Strategic Alliance between Nazi Germany and America's Most Powerful Corporation,"10 at the time of Hitler's rise to power, the world was unaware that "massively organized information" had "emerged to become a means of social control, a weapon of war, and a roadmap for group destruction."
Today, we cannot be accused of not understanding that massive data collection can be and is being used to manipulate societies across the globe.
Therefore, it would be insanely naïve to think that digital vaccine certificates, tied to our biometric IDs, banking, credit histories and health data would not end up being used as a tool for social control and a weapon for group destruction.
As Black points out, were it not for IBM and its information technology, Hitler, like other tyrants before him, would not have been nearly as successful in his plan to eradicate the Jews. Hitler also received help from other unexpected quarters:_"In the upside-down world of the Holocaust, dignified professionals were Hitler's advance troops. Police officials disregarded their duty in favor of protecting villains and persecuting victims.__Lawyers perverted concepts of justice to create anti-Jewish laws. Doctors defiled the art of medicine to perpetrate ghastly experiments and even choose who was healthy enough to be worked to death  and who could be cost-effectively sent to the gas chamber,"_ Black writes.11_"Scientists and engineers debased their higher calling to devise the instruments and rationales of destruction. And statisticians used their little known but powerful discipline to identify the victims, project and rationalize the benefits of their destruction, organize their persecution, and even audit the efficiency of genocide."_*Will You Allow Yourself To Be Turned Into a Monster?*

Eighteenth-century Irish philosopher and statesman Edmund Burke once said, "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."12 Put another way, good people need to gather their wherewithal and refuse to follow instructions they suspect to be harmful or know will lead to evil ends.
Unfortunately, as demonstrated in the 1962 Milgram Experiment, featured in an internet blog titled "Will You Obey the Criminal Authoritarians?" most people simply follow orders when given by a perceived authority. "I was just following orders" was indeed a hallmark excuse during the Nuremberg Trials that followed the end of World War II.
That excuse won't suffice this time around, so just about everyone, at this point, probably needs to engage in some preemptive internal reflection to orient their ethical compass in preparation for what might come next.
I have no doubt that the months and years ahead will test your ethics and humanity, and having a clear picture of recent history  how the greatest genocide in modern history was actually implemented and carried out using information technology  can be a valuable guide that can help you sidestep serious mistakes in judgment.
*The Central Role of Information Technology in the Holocaust*

In his book introduction, Black summarizes the key role of IBM's information technology in the holocaust:13_"When Hitler came to power, a central Nazi goal was to identify and destroy Germany's 600,000 Jews. To Nazis, Jews were not just those who practiced Judaism, but those of Jewish blood, regardless of their assimilation, intermarriage, religious activity, or even conversion to Christianity.__Only after Jews were identified could they be targeted for asset confiscation, ghettoization, deportation, and ultimately extermination. To search generations of communal, church, and governmental records all across Germany  and later throughout Europe  was a cross-indexing task so monumental, it called for a computer. But in 1933, no computer existed.__When the Reich needed to mount a systematic campaign of Jewish economic disenfranchisement and later began the massive movement of European Jews out of their homes and into ghettos, once again, the task was so prodigious it called for a computer. But in 1933, no computer existed.__When the Final Solution sought to efficiently transport Jews out of European ghettos along railroad lines and into death camps, with timing so precise the victims were able to walk right out of the boxcar and into a waiting gas chamber, the coordination was so complex a task, this too called for a computer. But in 1933, no computer existed.__However, another invention did exist: the IBM punch card and card sorting system  a precursor to the computer. IBM, primarily through its German subsidiary, made Hitler's program of Jewish destruction a technologic mission the company pursued with chilling success.__IBM Germany, using its own staff and equipment, designed, executed, and supplied the indispensable technologic assistance Hitler's Third Reich needed to accomplish what had never been done before  the automation of human destruction __I was haunted by a question whose answer has long eluded historians. The Germans always had the lists of Jewish names. Suddenly, a squadron of grim-faced SS would burst into a city square and post a notice demanding those listed assemble the next day at the train station for deportation to the East. But how did the Nazis get the lists? For decades, no one has known. Few have asked.__The answer: IBM Germany's census operations and similar advanced people counting and registration technologies. IBM was founded in 1898 by German inventor Herman Hollerith as a census tabulating company. Census was its business. But when IBM Germany formed its philosophical and technologic alliance with Nazi Germany, census and registration took on a new mission.__IBM Germany invented the racial census  listing not just religious affiliation, but bloodline going back generations. This was the Nazi data lust. Not just to count the Jews  but to identify them.__People and asset registration was only one of the many uses Nazi Germany found for high-speed data sorters. Food allocation was organized around databases, allowing Germany to starve the Jews.__Slave labor was identified, tracked, and managed largely through punch cards. Punch cards even made the trains run on time and cataloged their human cargo. German Railway  dealt directly with senior management in Berlin. Dehomag maintained punch card installations at train depots across Germany, and eventually across all Europe."_Using a mere 2,000 precomputer automatic tabulators, the Third Reich was able to efficiently identify, sort, track and catch Jews of every stripe in multiple countries. Now fast-forward to today, where virtually every person on the planet has had their personal data siphoned off, hour by hour, day by day, year by year.
Decades' worth of data are catalogued and cross-tabulated in ways we probably cannot even imagine. How efficient do you reckon a modern-day holocaust by would-be dictators might be, using the technologies of today? I'll leave that for you to ponder.
*IG Farben, Another Genocide Enabler*

So far, no Big Tech company has vowed to ban their technologies from being used in an attempt to repeat the Holocaust, and that includes IBM, which played a central role in it.
In a 2002 Village Voice article,14 Black addressed this shortcoming, pointing out that while IBM has refused to discuss its role in Hitler's regime, other companies, such as the German media conglomerate Bertelsmann and Ford Motor have at least had the couth to correct their company histories, admitting to (and apologizing for) sponsoring Hitler.
While technology played a determining role in the Holocaust, leaders in the chemical and pharmaceutical industry were also working with Hitler. One of the most prominent ones was the German chemical and drug company IG Farben, which had a factory complex near Monowitz (the slave labor camp at Auschwitz) and actually housed the IBM facilities there.
IG Farben used slave labor from the Monowitz camp and IBM's technology to keep track of them. "The Monowitz systems were customized for the specific coding Farben needed to process the thousands of slave workers who labored and died there," Black explains.15 Auschwitz archivist Piotr Setkiewicz further told Black:16_"The Hollerith office at IG Farben in Monowitz used the IBM machines as a system of computerization of civil and slave labor resources. This gave Farben the opportunity to identify people with certain skills, primarily skills needed for the construction of certain buildings in Monowitz."_Of course, IG Farben was also in the business of pharmaceuticals, and prisoners from Auschwitz were used for horrific medical experiments at the company's facility.17
While IG Farben executives were put on trial after the war, their sentences were light. As just one example, Fritz Ter Meer, a high-ranking executive charged with slavery and mass medical murder, served just three of his seven-year sentence, and after release became chairman of Bayer's advisory board.
Some have speculated18 that the reason they got off so lightly was because of their connections to other powerful figures, such as John Rockefeller, founder of Standard Oil and one of the masterminds behind the creation of Big Pharma.19 (There was actually a Standard Oil IG Farben company. Without the fossil fuels of Standard Oil, IG Farben couldn't have made synthetic fertilizers or fuels.) As noted by Jon Rappoport:20_"You could say that, after the War, the emerging global pharmaceutical colossus was a reincarnation of the Farben pattern: Profit before safety; lethal medical experimentation beyond any legal limit; the use of drugs/vaccines as a means of control."_*IBM Partners With Moderna*

IBM has now partnered with COVID-19 vaccine maker Moderna and, together, they are producing digital COVID-19 vaccine passes to track vaccinated individuals in real time. A pilot program has already been rolled out in the state of New York.21,22,23,24
IBM and Moderna will "explore technologies, including artificial intelligence, blockchain and hybrid cloud" to "support smarter COVID-19 vaccine management," according to a press release.25 In short, the partnership is aimed at facilitating data sharing between "governments, health care providers, life science organizations and individuals," but this data is not restricted to health data.
As reported by Raul Diego in a March 10, 2021, Mint Press News article,26 other "multiple blockchain ledger applications" being leveraged include IBM'sBlockchain Transparent Supply and Food Trust services, which shares food sourcing and supply-chain data, and its Blockchain World Wire cross-border payment processing service.
Considering how similar kinds of data (but far less voluminous) were used to carry out Hitler's genocide, we really need to start thinking about how all of this data collecting and sharing today might be misused. While not discussed much, the collection of genetic data is part and parcel of this program as well,27,28 which opens all sorts of unpleasant possibilities.



Already, in Israel, the requirement of vaccine certificates has resulted in the creation of a two-tier society where unvaccinated individuals are ostracized and forbidden from entering certain public venues such as bars, restaurants, hotels and public exercise facilities. 
Although right now in the U.S., vaccine passports are voluntary on a federal level, several counties and states have already either rolled out their own regional vaccine passports, or are considering them. IBM is also looking at its health pass as a model for what it predicts will be mandatory in the future.
According to IBM's U.S. public and federal market leader, Steve LaFleche, the passes will cease to be voluntary "once government guidelines and regulations force the private sector to enforce their implementation."29 As noted by Diego:30_"Conveniently, IBM's strong presence in the law enforcement space, as one of the largest providers of digital profiling technologies and AI_ _policing systems in the world, may also help with any obstacles Moderna may face among vaccine-hesitant populations."_When you look at the big picture, IBM is the best and worst candidate for the job of creating vaccine passports. It has a history of enabling genocide by misusing census data (which was its original business) and creating technologies to identify, track and capture individuals based on specific parameters such as bloodlines and religious affiliation.
They also used their technology to identify areas of food production where Jews lived in order to starve them, and now they're planning to leverage theirBlockchain Transparent Supply and Food Trust services that shares food sourcing and supply-chain data, and its Blockchain World Wire cross-border payment processing service. How might all of that be misused?

To get an idea, simply look at the services they rendered Nazi Germany. When you dissect IBM's history and compare it to its current role in the COVID-19 pandemic, it's virtually impossible to not reach the conclusion that they're perfectly equipped to carry out a flawless repeat of the Holocaust, but at an unimaginable scale, and with unfathomable efficiency.
The only difference is they would not be helping to hunt a specific national, religious or racial profile. To start, they'll hunt down vaccine dissenters. After that, there's no telling what the target group might be. But whatever it is, they'll be able to identify and track them down with near-effortless ease.
As noted by Black in the introduction to his book, "Only through exposing and examining what really occurred can the world of technology finally adopt the well-worn motto: Never Again."31 We need to do that, and come to a global consensus that we're simply not going to allow a repeat of history.
One small bright spot amid all this darkness is Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis, who March 29, 2021, announced32 he will issue an executive order forbidding local governments and businesses from requiring vaccine certificates._"It's completely unacceptable for either the government or the private sector to impose upon you the requirement that you show proof of vaccine to just simply participate in normal society,"_ he said.Although a federal judge blocked DeSantis' executive order in August 2021, he's calling on the state legislature to create a measure that will allow him to sign it into law. Hopefully, such laws will be put into place, and other states will follow suit.
***

[Part 1 of 2]*

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dinosaur (09-09-2021),JMWinPR (09-09-2021)

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## phoenyx

Had to post the second part separately, was longer than chess.com allows for a single post...

**
*IBM and Bill Gates*

In case you are unaware, Bill Gates in the early '80s was responsible for providing IBM with the DOS operating system for its then-new personal computers, which heralded in the massive explosion of computer technology. I remember it quite well. I got my first IBM clone PC around 1985.
The reason why this is important is that, eventually, computer hardware became a commodity and computer software became the source of most of the technology revenues. Gates' nefarious strategies eventually led him to become the richest man in the world. That mantle now shifts between Jeff Bezos of Amazon fame and Elon Musk, CEO of Tesla Motors.
However, the current market cap of IBM is $110 billion while the market cap of Microsoft is 10 times that at over $1 trillion. So, while IBM has a clearly sordid history going back to World War II, the likely more serious threat is Gates himself, who is largely responsible for engineering and profiting from this entire COVID wealth transfer play through his strategic partnering with the World Health Organization, as we have carefully articulated in previous articles.
It is interesting that IBM is repeating its egregious contribution to the extermination of millions of Jews in Germany, but that may pale to the likely unintended consequences of Gates' plans, which will probably far exceed the lives lost in Nazi Germany. We need to do everything we can to make sure he doesn't succeed. Too harsh? Then I suggest you review Gary Barnett's article on Lew Rockwell, where he states:33_"The extermination of societies through genocide and democide is achieved in many ways, from war, forced starvation, psychological destruction, mass imprisonment, and sterilization; from chemical agents, bombs, nuclear weapons, and now the killing will be due to 'vaccination.'__Surely I jest you say, but I do not, as the indiscriminate killing of hundreds of millions or billions of people around the world at the hands of the powerful is sought.__Some call it population control, some call it depopulation, but it is simply planned mass murder to benefit the agendas of the few. The tool being used to accomplish this goal is the untested, experimental, mind-altering, gene-changing, toxic poison called the Covid-19 'vaccine,' and it is the newest weapon of mass destruction.__Many are having horrible effects due to these injections, and many others are dying. Some are dying immediately after taking this shot, some are dying after a few hours or days, others after a few weeks, and the long-term effects at this point are virtually unknown. (In nearly every case the media denies the association.)__It is as if people are deaf, dumb, and blind when it comes to logic, as this falsely claimed affliction called COVID that supposedly has a survival rate of 99.98%, is being treated as a deadly pandemic, and the 'cure' recommended is a 'vaccine' that kills many more than the purposely created fake virus scam."_Sources and References


1 Real Clear Politics March 29, 20212 The Epoch Times March 29, 20213 Mic.com May 9, 20164 Nextgov.com November 20, 20205 FFF.org August 13, 20206, 10, 11, 13, 31 New York Times Books, IBM and the Holocaust (Archived)7, 8, 9 HuffPost February 27, 201212 Open Culture Quote14, 15, 16 Village Voice October 8, 200217, 18, 20 No More Fake News January 4, 202119 History of the Pharma Cartel May 10, 200721, 24, 26, 27, 29, 30 Mint Press News March 10, 202122, 25 IBM News Room March 4, 202123 Governor.ny.gov Excelsior Pass28 Mint Press News March 3, 202132 Bay News 9 March 29, 202133 Lew Rockwell March 31, 2021

**

Original source (is removed within 48 hours of being posted):
https://articles.mercola.com/sites/a...holocaust.aspx

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dinosaur (09-09-2021),JMWinPR (09-09-2021)

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## UKSmartypants

its true but TL;DR

all you need to know


In 1937, IBM's tabulating equipment enabled organizations to process huge amounts of data. Its clients included Hitler's Third Reich, for the tracking of Jews and other persecuted groups, largely through the German subsidiary Dehomag. The business gave an 81% increase in revenue from 1935 to 1939.

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dinosaur (09-09-2021),phoenyx (09-09-2021)

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## dinosaur

If I understand (and it is too long, I skip read) the author creates a boogeyman out of IBM, and links that boogeyman to another boogeyman (Gates) to tell us vaccine passports are bad, as if we didn't know that fact already.

All the while, the real boogeyman, our own damn government, will find a way, any way, to finally track our every move.

Technology is technology.  It is evil people who use technology for evil purpose and design.  Hitler was the evil person of his day.  Let's put a face to the evil of our day.  You pick the face.  I don't like Mr Gates, but I use his technology for good.  It helps me.  Other than his profit from MS, I don't contribute to whatever other evil he does.  I am able to separate the good from the evil.  Facebook could be good, but with evil people controlling it, not so much.  I'm there, but the worse it gets, the less I use it and the less it I am subject to that evil.  

The worst of the evil faces are those in government who have forgotten who our Constitution was written to protect, and who our Constitution was intended to limit.  Those are the real evil faces of our day.  And they will use good technology for evil purposes, just like Mr Hitler did.  Pick your boogeyman carefully.  Until the vote is completely lost and irrelevant (as it may already be in some locations) I know how to fight the boogeymen that are today.  If we lose the right to fair and honest elections, I know how to fight that boogeyman too.

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## Sunsettommy

> The article says "Pfizer initiates phase 1 study".  A phase 1 study is so incredibly small it is unlikely to prove anything as far as safety and effectiveness.  It's only a first little baby step. Then comes phase 2 and phase 3.  
> 
> Then the first 3 phases should be followed by much bigger studies involving thousands of people.  
> 
> And if they do the same as they did with the nRNA vaccines like shorten the study time and approve it quickly, it will be considered experimental and will have risks like getting vaccinated has risks.


The abstract has already stated that Ivermectin is an effective blocker of virus replication and more, also states that it is an effective drug for treating COVID-19 just as many doctors have been saying for months.

*A five-day course of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19 may reduce the duration of illness*




> A 5-day course of ivermectin was found to be safe and effective in treating adult patients with mild COVID-19.


and,

*Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of COVID-19 Infection: A Systematic Review, Meta-analysis, and Trial Sequential Analysis to Inform Clinical Guidelines*


> *Conclusions:*Moderate-certainty evidence finds that large reductions in COVID-19 deaths are possible using ivermectin. Using ivermectin early in the clinical course may reduce numbers progressing to severe disease. The apparent safety and low cost suggest that ivermectin is likely to have a significant impact on the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic globally.


Meanwhile the nRNA is still experimental and unproven to be safe or have long lasting vaccination effect, yet used on the public in mass quantities even under some duress too, that is hypocrisy and idiotic.

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WarriorRob (09-09-2021)

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## Sunsettommy

Here is more:

*Review of the Emerging Evidence Demonstrating the Efficacy of Ivermectin in the Prophylaxis and Treatment of COVID-19*


> *Conclusions:*Meta-analyses based on 18 randomized controlled treatment trials of ivermectin in COVID-19 have found large, statistically significant reductions in mortality, time to clinical recovery, and time to viral clearance. Furthermore, results from numerous controlled prophylaxis trials report significantly reduced risks of contracting COVID-19 with the regular use of ivermectin. Finally, the many examples of ivermectin distribution campaigns leading to rapid population-wide decreases in morbidity and mortality indicate that an oral agent effective in all phases of COVID-19 has been identified.

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WarriorRob (09-09-2021)

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## Swedgin

> Has to be better than the Jab, which is 0% affective in fighting Covid-19.


That statement is incorrect.

The vaccine IS effective.  Tests and actual studies have proven as much.

The vast majority of doctors advise for vaccination.

While there are still 'unknown factors,' most of the vaccines DO aid in both immunity, and fighting off Covid, if infected.

Just like most other vaccines.

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## Swedgin

> So how do you explain more covid-19 shots and now they want you to take booster shots Oh!!! and now they are making them in the pill form


Why Booster Shots:  (AS YET, there are still studies being done, and most doctors do NOT advise for the booster shot, yet.  The UN of course, does not want Americans taking the third booster, because they want the vaccine for Turd World Nations.)  Now IF and when, we need the booster, it will be for the exact same reason we need annual Flu shots, as well as shots for Pneumonia and Tetanus, every so many years....

Why make the vaccine in Pill form:  Because a lot of people don't like taking shots.


Now, I readily admit that the Pharmaceuticals have the BEST reason for pushing vaccines, above and beyond any safety benefits:  Profit Margin......

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WarriorRob (09-09-2021)

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## Swedgin

> I guess if you want to take vaccines every six months for the rest of your life, that seems like a pretty stupid logical thing to commit to as well, that's if you are one of the stupid ones to do that, that is


Haven't heard anyone suggest that.

Not yet.

Although...taking a shot every 6 months would be better than being dead.

I should know, as I have to take multiple shots, every day.  At first it was a horrible experience, but, without it, I would not have made it to 16 years of age.

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WarriorRob (09-09-2021)

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## Sunsettommy

> That statement is incorrect.
> 
> The vaccine IS effective.  Tests and actual studies have proven as much.
> 
> The vast majority of doctors advise for vaccination.
> 
> While there are still 'unknown factors,' most of the vaccines DO aid in both immunity, and fighting off Covid, if infected.
> 
> Just like most other vaccines.



Suuure if you say so, meanwhile people fully vaccinated still get infected anyway, which hardly ever happened with real vaccines of previous decades.


Take TB vaccine, you are IMMUNE!


Take Small Pox Vaccine, you are IMMUNE at 99% rate.


Take nRNA vaccine, you can still be infected and require hospitalization and now booster shots are already in the works for this "wonder" drug! 


Meanwhile because the nRNA vaccine is leaky we are getting variants from the original virus that escapes, meaning it is never going to end thus PHARMA will be pleased for unending massive profits of numerous booster shots coming fourth.


Come on don't be a suck up for these so called vaccines......


Meanwhile....,


*Says the Case for COVID Vaccine Passports Was Just Demolished*


New research found that natural immunity offers exponentially more protection than COVID-19 vaccines



It will be interesting where this one goes in a few months.

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## Sunsettommy

> Haven't heard anyone suggest that.
> 
> Not yet.
> 
> Although...taking a shot every 6 months would be better than being dead.
> 
> I should know, as I have to take multiple shots, every day.  At first it was a horrible experience, but, without it, I would not have made it to 16 years of age.



You shouldn't need to take booster shots over a true immunity vaccines at all, since that is what a VACCINE immunization is about in the first place.


the experimental nRNA vaccine isn't a true vaccine since a lot of people still get sick and some bad enough to be in hospital even when FULLY vaccinated.

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Swedgin (09-09-2021)

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## Oceander

> You shouldn't need to take booster shots over a true immunity vaccines at all, since that is what a VACCINE immunization is about in the first place.
> 
> 
> the experimental nRNA vaccine isn't a true vaccine since a lot of people still get sick and some bad enough to be in hospital even when FULLY vaccinated.


Nonsense.  Perhaps you should have read the wikipedia article you cited to.  Specifically, only some vaccines "offer full sterilizing immunity, in which infection is prevented completely."  I.e., many do not.

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Swedgin (09-09-2021)

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## Swedgin

> You shouldn't need to take booster shots over a true immunity vaccines at all, since that is what a VACCINE immunization is about in the first place.
> 
> 
> the experimental nRNA vaccine isn't a true vaccine since a lot of people still get sick and some bad enough to be in hospital even when FULLY vaccinated.


Well, this is because of POOR messaging, often chock-full of contradictions and flip-flops.

All I know, is that there are several "vaccines," (They may not be called "true immunity vaccines...?") that we need to take every year or so.

Flu
Pneumonia
Tetanus

Just to list three.

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Oceander (09-09-2021)

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## Swedgin

Flu Vaccine:

Vaccine Effectiveness: How Well Do Flu Vaccines Work? | CDC

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## Swedgin

Flu Vaccine:

Vaccine Effectiveness: How Well Do Flu Vaccines Work? | CDC



Covid is very similar to Influenza in how it operates.

Sounds to me, that the Covid Vaccine is very similar to the Influenza vaccine.

But, all I know is what I know, and observe.  (And I did NOT stay at a Holiday Inn, last night!  I am also not an actor, so, I am not an expert on all things!)

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Oceander (09-09-2021)

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## Dan40

> So how do you explain more covid-19 shots and now they want you to take booster shots Oh!!! and now they are making them in the pill form


The bullshit is you saying 0% effective.  That's like Main Stream Media reporting.  Bullshit hyperbole.  No question the various vaccines are not as effective as touted but better than 0%.

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## Sunsettommy

> Well, this is because of POOR messaging, often chock-full of contradictions and flip-flops.
> 
> All I know, is that there are several "vaccines," (They may not be called "true immunity vaccines...?") that we need to take every year or so.
> 
> Flu
> Pneumonia
> Tetanus
> 
> Just to list three.


Yes, Flu is a CORONA VIRUS! which is why a new "vaccine" is needed every year, but since the corona virus family is large and changes over time, there is no way to create a full immunity.

The Flu shots vaccine is a hit and miss process, taking it too early could miss out a newer strain that suddenly shows up not covered by the shot or wait too long to get sick before the shot was used.

I have had Pneumonia twice, shots for it is in childhood and after age 65, you don't take them yearly or otherwise.

Tetanus vaccine when a child, then a 10 year booster shot every 10 years as adult, it isn't on a yearly schedule at all.

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## Sunsettommy

> Why Booster Shots:  (AS YET, there are still studies being done, and most doctors do NOT advise for the booster shot, yet.  The UN of course, does not want Americans taking the third booster, because they want the vaccine for Turd World Nations.)  Now IF and when, we need the booster, it will be for the exact same reason we need annual Flu shots, as well as shots for Pneumonia and Tetanus, every so many years....
> 
> Why make the vaccine in Pill form:  Because a lot of people don't like taking shots.
> 
> 
> Now, I readily admit that the Pharmaceuticals have the BEST reason for pushing vaccines, above and beyond any safety benefits:  Profit Margin......



The CDC says it is coming this fall,

*COVID-19 Vaccine Booster Shot*
Updated Sept. 1, 2021

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Swedgin (09-10-2021)

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## Oceander

> Yes, Flu is a CORONA VIRUS! which is why a new "vaccine" is needed every year, but since the corona virus family is large and changes over time, there is no way to create a full immunity.
> 
> The Flu shots vaccine is a hit and miss process, taking it too early could miss out a newer strain that suddenly shows up not covered by the shot or wait too long to get sick before the shot was used.
> 
> I have had Pneumonia twice, shots for it is in childhood and after age 65, you don't take them yearly or otherwise.
> 
> Tetanus vaccine when a child, then a 10 year booster shot every 10 years as adult, it isn't on a yearly schedule at all.


No, flu is not a coronavirus.  This is such a simple issue to confirm, so why persist in making such a childish mistake?

Flu is caused by the influenza virus, of which there are four main varieties, and many variants within each class.  This is why a classic attenuated or live vaccine is not permanently effective against flu.

The coronavirus family is a completely different family of viruses.  The only similarity is that they can, under the right circumstances, give rise to a similar set of symptoms.

Calling the flu a coronavirus is a little like saying car tires are truck tires because they're all made of vulcanized rubber.  They're not, and you'll have the devil's own time explaining what you did if you try to put a tractor-trailer tire on your prius.

----------


## tiny1

It occurs to me that if you have to bribe/extort/coerce or otherwise manipulate others to immunize, there is a problem with the perception of this vaccine.  People do not trust it.

It occurs to me that all the big Pharma companies have thrown up "Red Flags" as to the safety and effectiveness of their vaccine.  I have a known link to thrombosis.  This vaccine is known to cause blood clots.  Last thing I need.

No, I will not be taking the jab.  This is not a well tested vaccine.  Everyone wants to dictate what meds we take, what food we eat, and what drugs we are allowed to put in our bodies.  Yet, when we make an informed decision about a vaccine we are concerned about, the Prog dogs come out in force.  Now, we are villains for wanting to keep our bodies "pure".
Well, frankly Scarlett........
I eat what I want, drink what I like, medicate in my own way, and everyone who doesn't like it, can osculate my fundament.

----------

Oceander (09-09-2021),Sunsettommy (09-09-2021)

----------


## Authentic

The common cold is coronavirus.

----------


## Oceander

> It occurs to me that if you have to bribe/extort/coerce or otherwise manipulate others to immunize, there is a problem with the perception of this vaccine.  People do not trust it.
> 
> It occurs to me that all the big Pharma companies have thrown up "Red Flags" as to the safety and effectiveness of their vaccine.  I have a known link to thrombosis.  This vaccine is known to cause blood clots.  Last thing I need.
> 
> No, I will not be taking the jab.  This is not a well tested vaccine.  Everyone wants to dictate what meds we take, what food we eat, and what drugs we are allowed to put in our bodies.  Yet, when we make an informed decision about a vaccine we are concerned about, the Prog dogs come out in force.  Now, we are villains for wanting to keep our bodies "pure".
> Well, frankly Scarlett........
> I eat what I want, drink what I like, medicate in my own way, and everyone who doesn't like it, can osculate my fundament.


Sounds fine to me.

----------


## Sunsettommy

> Nonsense.  Perhaps you should have read the wikipedia article you cited to.  Specifically, only some vaccines "offer full sterilizing immunity, in which infection is prevented completely."  I.e., many do not.


Many do not because they change too much to stop it such as the ANNUAL flu shot being needed, a corona virus......

TB is a Bacteria that is stable thus Fully Immunized is possible.

Small Pox is a Stable virus thus Fully Immunized is possible.

Covid-19 is already showing that it isn't stable with variants coming off it......., that is why BOOSTER shots are now in the works just months after the initial shot......

Vaccinated or not anyone can still be infected by it..., that is a fact you can't ignore.

----------


## Sunsettommy

> It occurs to me that if you have to bribe/extort/coerce or otherwise manipulate others to immunize, there is a problem with the perception of this vaccine.  People do not trust it.
> 
> It occurs to me that all the big Pharma companies have thrown up "Red Flags" as to the safety and effectiveness of their vaccine.  I have a known link to thrombosis.  This vaccine is known to cause blood clots.  Last thing I need.
> 
> No, I will not be taking the jab.  This is not a well tested vaccine.  Everyone wants to dictate what meds we take, what food we eat, and what drugs we are allowed to put in our bodies.  Yet, when we make an informed decision about a vaccine we are concerned about, the Prog dogs come out in force.  Now, we are villains for wanting to keep our bodies "pure".
> Well, frankly Scarlett........
> I eat what I want, drink what I like, medicate in my own way, and everyone who doesn't like it, can osculate my fundament.


Well said, nice to see you here!!!

----------

tiny1 (09-09-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> Many do not because they change too much to stop it such as the ANNUAL flu shot being needed, a corona virus......
> 
> TB is a Bacteria that is stable thus Fully Immunized is possible.
> 
> Small Pox is a Stable virus thus Fully Immunized is possible.
> 
> Covid-19 is already showing that it isn't stable with variants coming off it......., that is why BOOSTER shots are now in the works just months after the initial shot......
> 
> Vaccinated or not anyone can still be infected by it..., that is a fact you can't ignore.


Why are you so keen to make unwarranted assumptions about what I am or am not ignoring?  Geez, you people act like liberal know-it-alls.

Congratulations on citing to two (2) viruses that all fully immunized.  There are a few other diseases out there, however.  And, as your very own cited authority states, only some vaccines provide full sterilizing immunity.

Or don't you bother to read the links you post, beyond the click-bait headlines and bias-confirming opening paragraph?

----------


## Sunsettommy

> No, flu is not a coronavirus.  This is such a simple issue to confirm, so why persist in making such a childish mistake?
> 
> Flu is caused by the influenza virus, of which there are four main varieties, and many variants within each class.  This is why a classic attenuated or live vaccine is not permanently effective against flu.
> 
> The coronavirus family is a completely different family of viruses.  The only similarity is that they can, under the right circumstances, give rise to a similar set of symptoms.
> 
> Calling the flu a coronavirus is a little like saying car tires are truck tires because they're all made of vulcanized rubber.  They're not, and you'll have the devil's own time explaining what you did if you try to put a tractor-trailer tire on your prius.


Oop's, you are correct I confused it with the common cold, my bad!

----------

Authentic (09-09-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> The common cold is coronavirus.


No, it isn't.

----------


## Authentic

> No, it isn't.


Yes it is.

----------

Sunsettommy (09-09-2021)

----------


## Oceander

> Yes it is.


No, it isn't.

----------


## Authentic

> No, it isn't.


Yes it is.

----------


## Oceander

> Yes it is.


No, it isn't.

----------


## Sunsettommy

> Why are you so keen to make unwarranted assumptions about what I am or am not ignoring?  Geez, you people act like liberal know-it-alls.
> 
> Congratulations on citing to two (2) viruses that all fully immunized.  There are a few other diseases out there, however.  And, as your very own cited authority states, only some vaccines provide full sterilizing immunity.
> 
> Or don't you bother to read the links you post, beyond the click-bait headlines and bias-confirming opening paragraph?


Ha ha, my replies made it clear that I am aware of different types of vaccines.

Several times mention the Flu vaccine being annual, several times said there are Immunizing vaccines.

Wikipedia link show different TYPES of vaccines listed, I have known this for years.....

----------


## Authentic

There are variants of the common cold. One is caused by rhinovirus. Others are caused by coronavirus. 

Who knows, there may be a 5G variant waiting in the wings.

----------

Sunsettommy (09-09-2021)

----------


## Authentic

Or a ketogenic variant.

----------


## Sunsettommy

> No, it isn't.


He is correct.

CDC

*Common Human Coronaviruses*Excerpt:

Common human coronaviruses, including types 229E, NL63, OC43, and HKU1, usually cause mild to moderate upper-respiratory tract illnesses, like the common cold. Most people get infected with one or more of these viruses at some point in their lives. This information applies to common human coronaviruses and *should not be confused with*coronavirus disease 2019 (formerly referred to as 2019 Novel Coronavirus).

----------


## Authentic

> No, it isn't.


Is the Common Cold Caused by a Coronavirus? Doctors Explain

----------

Sunsettommy (09-09-2021)

----------


## tiny1

> Or a ketogenic variant.


Lame.

----------

Authentic (09-09-2021)

----------


## Fall River

> Has to be better than the Jab, which is 0% affective in fighting Covid-19.


You must have learned that from Clay & Buck, but it's not true.

----------


## JMWinPR

@dinosaur: All true but they already much of that info: Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, give them access to all manner of info. And pocahontas signature legislation the fraudulent consumer agency, grants them access to every bank transaction. They can target any individual and destroy them without leaving the office. Heck even the bedroom. 
As God said to Noah in Bill Cosby's Noah "How long can you tread water"?

----------

dinosaur (09-09-2021)

----------


## Fall River

> Why are the even doing thisThey already have millions of Guinea Pigs


It's a complex issue, so it's ripe for deception by talk-show hosts. If ivermectin were safe & effective for COVID-19, Pfizer wouldn't be taking the time to run expensive studies.

----------


## JMWinPR

The local English P.R. paper The Star has a column about this. Seems several Doctors are prescribing Ivermectin and the legislature wants to get involved. The paper quoted almost word for word the fake Ivermectin hit piece that was exposed as fraudulent earlier this week on this forum. It will be interesting to see the outcome.

----------


## Fall River

> You keep calling me stupid, we might get both banned from this forum. I suggest you stop calling me stupid and insulting my intelligence, if you believe in these experimental vaccines more power to you. I refuse to believe in Experimental Vaccines that have pretty bad side effects.


Oops! It wasn't me. Wrong post.

----------


## YellowRose

> Really boggled down with this MSM rhetoric....what compels them to be that way?  Don't they care about Americans...people?  The more time goes by the more I see the presence of evil within our country.  You would think they would want to help people instead of leading them astray.  
> 
> Before long one might think their horns would start to show....geesh!


They care about a leftist agenda, and nothing else.

----------


## FirstGenCanadian

It’s hysterical to watch this banter back and forth.  Perhaps we should stop using internet links to prove our sides, and go back to old fashioned books, that have peer reviews, prior to bought and paid for science of COVID-19.  Just a thought…

----------


## YellowRose

> No, it isn't.


From a CDC link:
_
Common human coronaviruses, including types 229E, NL63, OC43, and HKU1, usually cause mild to moderate upper-respiratory tract illnesses, like the common cold. Most people get infected with one or more of these viruses at some point in their lives. This information applies to common human coronaviruses and should not be confused withcoronavirus disease 2019 (formerly referred to as 2019 Novel Coronavirus)._

Are coronaviruses the ONLY cause? No, but they are a common cause, and natural immunity to the coronaviruses which cause the common cold also have a link with Covid immunity, as does immunity to "colds" caused by rhinoviruses.

----------

Sunsettommy (09-09-2021)

----------


## dinosaur

> @dinosaur: All true but they already much of that info: Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, give them access to all manner of info. And pocahontas signature legislation the fraudulent consumer agency, grants them access to every bank transaction. They can target any individual and destroy them without leaving the office. Heck even the bedroom. 
> As God said to Noah in Bill Cosby's Noah "How long can you tread water"?


I get all of that, and that just supports what I posted.  It's the government, not IBM, or Gates.  The abilities of computers and technology is good.  How government uses that technology is sometimes evil.  When they use that technology to destroy us, it is not the fault of the technology, but of those in charge who use the technology for their unconstitutional and evil purposes.


And I have been subjected to the IRS and their fraud detection, and have had to answer to the IRS to prove who I am.  Believe me, the IRS knows EVERYTHING about you.

----------

JMWinPR (09-10-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> I get all of that, and that just supports what I posted.  It's the government, not IBM, or Gates.


Who do you think runs the government, Biden? That guy can't even carry a coherent conversation. Corporations are running a lot of the show these days.

----------

JMWinPR (09-09-2021),TheOneOnly2 (09-09-2021),TLSG (09-09-2021)

----------


## TheOneOnly2

> Who do you think runs the government, Biden? That guy can't even carry a coherent conversation. Corporations are running a lot of the show these days.


Who owns them?

----------


## TLSG

This is exactly what the System had in mind in the novel _The Turner Diaries_.

----------


## phoenyx

> Who owns them?


Who owns the largest corporations? The type of people who I'd argue run most of the world. Don't get me wrong, I do believe that politicians -can- have real power, but they have to be politicians that aren't beholden to campaign contributions from corporations. Bernie Sanders fit the bill, but he didn't win.

----------


## TLSG

> Who owns them?


The System. Our government is essentially one big corporate/industrial complex.

----------


## phoenyx

> The System. Our government is essentially one big corporate/industrial complex.


Agreed. I should probably point out that in many ways, I'm left wing. I see the system as anything but. Now, that doesn't mean it can't use the -language- of the left in some ways. When it comes to anything Covid, though, I'd say I'd be classified as hard right wing, as the language they use is always "for the people's good" (I think it's anything but myself). I fully agree with the line the right is saying regarding vaccines- whatever happened to "my body, my choice?"

----------


## WarriorRob

> Haven't heard anyone suggest that.
> 
> Not yet.
> 
> Although...taking a shot every 6 months would be better than being dead.
> 
> I should know, as I have to take multiple shots, every day.  At first it was a horrible experience, but, without it, I would not have made it to 16 years of age.


I'm not against all vaccines just the covid experimental Vaccines, they need to tell the people what the side effects are for these vaccines, been hearing people getting Bell Palsy, blood clots, heart attacks, miscarriages and so on.

----------


## WarriorRob

Faucis Explains the Shocking Way That Delta Shows Up In the Vaccinated | DM CLIPS | Rubin Report


Insanity is what it it :Geez:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-09-2021),dinosaur (09-09-2021)

----------


## Physics Hunter

I watched the included Fauchi clip.  As I am partially deaf, I have been naturally been learning to read lips. 

The audio in the clip does not really match whatever he was actually saying, IMHO.

Now temper that with the fact that I am not very good at lip reading, and that all people are different.  Reading Fauchi is like reading a duck, not easy.  Perhaps there was a delay in the audio or something.

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

phoenyx (09-10-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

> 


I think this is where it ends.

You can't make money by destroying the productive people in a society, not for long.  That society fails, its money becomes worthless...what is a Spanish dollar worth, today?  We've never seen this on such a scale; but smaller-scale looters generally wound up as the first to be cleansed with a regime upheaval.

I've said from the first, one of the telltale signs will be that of live births after the vaccination numbers got broad.  Now, we're seeing it...it's dropping to NOTHING, and the bubblehead in the white house is ordering MOAR into the maw.  And punishing those who resist.

And starving them out.

We're out of options, now.  This is what I had hoped it would not come to; but it has.  We have a government that's crimiinal; psychotic; stupid in its visible leaders and hidden in who is really giving the orders.  This cannot be tolerated.

----------

QuaseMarco (09-10-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

VAERS BOMBSHELL!  They just bundled 726 DEATHS all into one ID#!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Assume one ID number means one death, 726 deaths bundled into one :Dontknow:  I'll let everyone decide your own opinion.

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> VAERS BOMBSHELL!  They just bundled 726 DEATHS all into one ID#!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Assume one ID number means one death, 726 deaths bundled into one I'll let everyone decide your own opinion.


My opinion is based on what VAERS is.

It's a data base that ANYONE can enter data into. 
There is no requirement that the data reflect a cause and effect between the vaccine and the reported "adverse event". None. 

But you think it's something else, it seems. Why?






> Online reporting is strongly encouraged. Please report clinically important adverse events that occur after vaccination of adults and children, *even if you are not sure whether the vaccine caused the adverse event*.


VAERS - Report an Adverse Event

----------


## WarriorRob

> My opinion is based on what VAERS is.
> 
> It's a data base that ANYONE can enter data into. 
> There is no requirement that the data reflect a cause and effect between the vaccine and the reported ailment/injury. None. 
> 
> But you think it's something else, it seems. Why?


I can't confirm what you are saying, if true it can be manipulated for good or evil. I just saw the video and wanted people the decide if this was true or not, not leaning one way or the other on this video :Dontknow:

----------


## QuaseMarco

> VAERS BOMBSHELL!  They just bundled 726 DEATHS all into one ID#!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> 
> 
> Assume one ID number means one death, 726 deaths bundled into one I'll let everyone decide your own opinion.


Vaccine deaths and injuries are likely 10X what is actually reported. VAERS has always been a respected source of Information......... UNTIL NOW .....OBVIOUSLY.

----------

Esdraelon (09-10-2021),Quark (09-11-2021),WarriorRob (09-10-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> I can't confirm what you are saying, if true it can be manipulated for good or evil. I just saw the video and wanted people the decide if this was true or not, not leaning one way or the other on this video


That's fine. I linked to the VAERS page.

----------


## WarriorRob

> Vaccine deaths and injuries are likely 10X what is actually reported. VAERS has always been a respected source of Information......... UNTIL NOW .....OBVIOUSLY.


I don't know what to believe anymore to tell you the truth, pretty sure if this is true, probably already deleted :Dontknow:

----------

Quark (09-11-2021),QuaseMarco (09-10-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> VAERS BOMBSHELL!  They just bundled 726 DEATHS all into one ID#!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Assume one ID number means one death, 726 deaths bundled into one I'll let everyone decide your own opinion.


Definitely worth a tad more investigation. Seems the CDC isn't all that interested in investigating serious adverse events though. Children's Health Defense has been after them for months trying to get some data on their alleged investigations on the thousands of death reports following Covid vaccinations. Here's a report on how that's been going:

**
*116 days and counting, CDC ignores The Defender’s inquiries
*
According to the CDC website, “the CDC follows up on any report of death to request additional information and learn more about what occurred and to determine whether the death was a result of the vaccine or unrelated.”
On March 8, The Defender contacted the CDC with a written list of questions about reported deaths and injuries related to COVID vaccines. After repeated attempts, by phone and email, to obtain a response to our questions, a health communications specialist from the CDC’s Vaccine Task Force contacted us on March 29 — three weeks after our initial inquiry.
The individual received our request for information from VAERS, but said she had never received our list of questions, even though employees we talked to several times said CDC press officers were working through the questions and confirmed the representative had received them. We provided the list of questions again along with a new deadline, but never received a response.
On May 19, a CDC employee said our questions had been reviewed and our inquiry was pending in their system, but would not provide us with a copy of the response. We were told we would be contacted by phone or email with the response.
On June 24, we contacted the CDC and were told nobody knew the specialist from the agency’s Vaccine Task Force who contacted us in March, and that our request was still pending in the system. It has been 116 days since we sent our first email inquiring into VAERS data and reports and we have yet to receive a response.
**

Source:
Latest CDC VAERS Data Show Reported Injuries Surpass 400,000 Following COVID Vaccines | Children's Health Defense

----------

QuaseMarco (09-10-2021),WarriorRob (09-10-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> Definitely worth a tad more investigation. Seems the CDC isn't all that interested in investigating serious adverse events though. Children's Health Defense has been after them for months trying to get some data on their alleged investigations on the thousands of death reports following Covid vaccinations. Here's a report on how that's been going:
> 
> **
> *116 days and counting, CDC ignores The Defender’s inquiries
> *
> According to the CDC website, “the CDC follows up on any report of death to request additional information and learn more about what occurred and to determine whether the death was a result of the vaccine or unrelated.”
> On March 8, The Defender contacted the CDC with a written list of questions about reported deaths and injuries related to COVID vaccines. After repeated attempts, by phone and email, to obtain a response to our questions, a health communications specialist from the CDC’s Vaccine Task Force contacted us on March 29 — three weeks after our initial inquiry.
> The individual received our request for information from VAERS, but said she had never received our list of questions, even though employees we talked to several times said CDC press officers were working through the questions and confirmed the representative had received them. We provided the list of questions again along with a new deadline, but never received a response.
> On May 19, a CDC employee said our questions had been reviewed and our inquiry was pending in their system, but would not provide us with a copy of the response. We were told we would be contacted by phone or email with the response.
> ...


No agency or vaccine producer is taking responsibility..... not Big Pharma, not the FDA , not the CDC, not the NIH....... and obviously not the dementia ladened President.

----------

Quark (09-11-2021),WarriorRob (09-10-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> No agency or vaccine producer is taking responsibility..... not Big Pharma, not the FDA , not the CDC, not the NIH....... and obviously not the dementia ladened President.


Agreed. There is one thing I'd like to point out though- some may not actually be aware of the damage these vaccines are apparently doing. I can easily imagine that Biden has no clue. The guy struggles to form cohesive sentences. I can easily imagine he's essentially just fed lines and does his best to repeat them in front of the camera (frequently failing badly). This is far less likely of Big Pharma and the various government agencies you mention.

----------

Quark (09-11-2021),WarriorRob (09-11-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> I think this is where it ends.
> 
> You can't make money by destroying the productive people in a society, not for long.  That society fails, its money becomes worthless...what is a Spanish dollar worth, today?  We've never seen this on such a scale; but smaller-scale looters generally wound up as the first to be cleansed with a regime upheaval.
> 
> I've said from the first, one of the telltale signs will be that of live births after the vaccination numbers got broad.  Now, we're seeing it...it's dropping to NOTHING, and the bubblehead in the white house is ordering MOAR into the maw.  And punishing those who resist.
> 
> And starving them out.
> 
> We're out of options, now.  This is what I had hoped it would not come to; but it has.  We have a government that's crimiinal; psychotic; stupid in its visible leaders and hidden in who is really giving the orders.  This cannot be tolerated.


I think the best we can do at the moment is try to educate those around us. Also, in the U.S. it appears that some states have governments that are resisting these vaccination mandates. Might be good to go to one of those if one isn't in one already. Personally, I'm Canadian and live in Canada, but I'm thinking of going to live in Mexico. It -seems- that things are better down there in terms of this avoiding this whole vaccine mania thing, but I'd actually be going more because all my family is down there now- I'm literally the only member of my family who's still living in Canada.

----------


## JustPassinThru

I'm in Montana - and that was a stroke of PURE...LUCK.

I was going to leave here.  I love Montana, but the winters are long and cold.

But this is not the year.  I'm still semi-free....and our infection rate is low...

----------


## WarriorRob

Doctor Wants To Be  - National File


In the clip, Fisher seems confused by questions raised by Rudyk regarding how COVID-19 patients are counted. After Fisher explains this process, Rudyk asserts that the hospitals should become scary in their messaging about COVID-19, inflate their total number of COVID-19 patients by counting those who have recovered, and suggest that people will die without taking one of the controversial COVID-19 vaccines. :Thinking:

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-10-2021),Esdraelon (09-11-2021),phoenyx (09-10-2021),Rutabaga (09-10-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco

> Agreed. There is one thing I'd like to point out though- some may not actually be aware of the damage these vaccines are apparently doing. I can easily imagine that Biden has no clue. The guy struggles to form cohesive sentences. I can easily imagine he's essentially just fed lines and does his best to repeat them in front of the camera (frequently failing badly). This is far less likely of Big Pharma and the various government agencies you mention.


It is the responsibility of the FDA and the drug companies to investigate these deaths and injuries from the vaccine. What is going on now is inconceivable. It's like the whole f'n world is in some type of mind fog.... trance.

----------

Quark (09-11-2021),WarriorRob (09-11-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> It is the responsibility of the FDA and the drug companies to investigate these deaths and injuries from the vaccine. What is going on now is inconceivable. It's like the whole f'n world is in some type of mind fog.... trance.


I think the best we can do is try to educate the people around us as to the evidence that's out there. That's what I try to do at any rate.

----------

Quark (09-11-2021),QuaseMarco (09-11-2021),WarriorRob (09-11-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> I'm in Montana - and that was a stroke of PURE...LUCK.
> 
> I was going to leave here.  I love Montana, but the winters are long and cold.
> 
> But this is not the year.  I'm still semi-free....and our infection rate is low...



I'm guessing that you're referring to the fact that Montana prohibits vaccine mandates for health care workers? For those in the audience:
Montana Stands Out In Prohibiting Vaccine Mandates For Health Care Workers | Montana Public Radio

----------


## phoenyx

> Doctor Wants To Be  - National File
> 
> 
> In the clip, Fisher seems confused by questions raised by Rudyk regarding how COVID-19 patients are counted. After Fisher explains this process, Rudyk asserts that the hospitals should become “scary” in their messaging about COVID-19, inflate their total number of COVID-19 patients by counting those who have recovered, and suggest that people will die without taking one of the controversial COVID-19 vaccines.


Crazy stuff :-/

----------

WarriorRob (09-10-2021)

----------


## Rutabaga

they are like rabid dogs, frothing at the mouth because everybody just wont follow their directions...

if they get too close they should be put down...

do it for the children...

----------

Esdraelon (09-11-2021)

----------


## JustPassinThru

> I'm guessing that you're referring to the fact that Montana prohibits vaccine mandates for health care workers? For those in the audience:
> Montana Stands Out In Prohibiting Vaccine Mandates For Health Care Workers | Montana Public Radio


There's that.  Then there was the soft lockdown.  Nobody was arresting people for walking the streets.   

Restaurants all got closed, but that didn't last long.  Part of that reason is the reality that tourism is the bread-and-butter of this area.  Even if restauranteurs could afford being closed a month, the business could well not return.  We're a get-off point from the Interstate, to both Glacier in the north and Yellowstone to the south.

Then there's been the miraculously-low penetration of the virus.  I think it's because we all get more than average Vitamin C from being outdoors.  In town, this is a government city, with some forms of government being most of the employers; but from the area, farming and ranching are far more common.

Outdoors...working in the dirt and muck all the time...muscles...constant exposure to parasites...good nutrition...all adds up to a healthy immune system.  So we haven't had that many cases.

I could have been in parts of Michigan or Wisconsin, where just being out without a reason that that Eva Perron governess doesn't like, gets you arrested.  Or where you're arrested and tased for not wearing a face diaper.  I could have been in a crowded city like Cleveland, with cases everywhere...and much-more likelihood of heavy exposure.

And much less likelihood of getting affordable ivermectin.

So...yeah.  I was very fortunate to have had the winds of fate blow me this way.

----------

phoenyx (09-11-2021)

----------


## Quark

When the Republican Party and that includes Trump is in control of the national government I have zero trust and confidence in the national government. When the Communist/Fascist are in charge national government I have ---zero trust and confidence in the national government.

This vaccine could be the safest vaccine in the world but without trust and confidence in the national government it most likely is the most unsafe vaccine that has ever been produce but who's to really know.

----------

WarriorRob (09-11-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> There's that.  Then there was the soft lockdown.  Nobody was arresting people for walking the streets.   
> 
> Restaurants all got closed, but that didn't last long.  Part of that reason is the reality that tourism is the bread-and-butter of this area.  Even if restauranteurs could afford being closed a month, the business could well not return.  We're a get-off point from the Interstate, to both Glacier in the north and Yellowstone to the south.
> 
> Then there's been the miraculously-low penetration of the virus.  I think it's because we all get more than average Vitamin C from being outdoors.  In town, this is a government city, with some forms of government being most of the employers; but from the area, farming and ranching are far more common.
> 
> Outdoors...working in the dirt and muck all the time...muscles...constant exposure to parasites...good nutrition...all adds up to a healthy immune system.  So we haven't had that many cases.
> 
> I could have been in parts of Michigan or Wisconsin, where just being out without a reason that that Eva Perron governess doesn't like, gets you arrested.  Or where you're arrested and tased for not wearing a face diaper.  I could have been in a crowded city like Cleveland, with cases everywhere...and much-more likelihood of heavy exposure.
> ...



Nice :-). Also, I notice that even 2 years ago, a Whitefish government official expressed concerns concerning 5g back in 2019, when many of us didn't know much about 5G- Kudos to her:

**
Jacobs notes that many people have health concerns regarding the operation of the 5G facilities, but says the FCC rule does not allow cities to regulate or reject such facilities based upon health effects of radio frequency emissions as long as they comply with FCC limits.

The rule also caps the fees local governments can charge related to the 5G facilities at $500 for a single application that includes up to five facilities and an additional $100 for each facility. The city can only charge $1,000 for a new pole and is capped in what it can charge for recurring fees.

“They gutted our ability to negotiate,” Jacobs said, noting that the city last year inked a deal for an annual lease of $18,000 to locate cellular equipment in the Emergency Services Center.

The rule also creates a fairly short time period for cities to process 5G applications — 60 days for collocation on pre-existing structures and 90 days for new construction. If the deadline, which begins as soon as an application is submitted and not when it’s deemed complete, is missed the request is immediately approved.

Dozens of cities and counties have filed a lawsuit seeking to overturn the FCC rule. The suit is currently in the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit.

**
Source:
Montana City Moves to Block â€˜Unsightlyâ€™ 5G Installations

----------


## phoenyx

> When the Republican Party and that includes Trump is in control of the national government I have zero trust and confidence in the national government. When the Communist/Fascist are in charge national government I have ---zero trust and confidence in the national government.
> 
> This vaccine could be the safest vaccine in the world but without trust and confidence in the national government it most likely is the most unsafe vaccine that has ever been produce but who's to really know.


I think there's a lot of evidence that these Covid vaccines are the most unsafe vaccines in modern times, from the amount of adverse events involving deaths and serious injuries alone. Take a look at the following graph of reported deaths following various vaccines over the years:

d3caba_422c9aa50b1a417a91efb99efd3b2fc2~mv2.jpg


Source:
https://www.fakemediareport.net/post...acking-website

----------

Quark (09-11-2021),QuaseMarco (09-11-2021),WarriorRob (09-11-2021)

----------


## Freewill

Just so I know which side to join, let me ask:

If the Corona-19 virus real?

Is the Delta virus real?

Is the pandemic real?

Will it only get real if we, or someone we know, becomes infected?

Are those dying actually dying of the annual Flu?

Do people actually die of the virus?  If so then the answers to the first two questions is yes.

If there is no basis for concern about the virus then how did the whole world, at least the governments, get drawn into the huge conspiracy?

----------


## ruthless terrier

i have seen studies that show the minorities are much more affected by the virus than the white folks .. with blacks leading the way. in some cases the blacks are 5 times more likely to die from covid than the whites. you won't hear this from CNN or NBC.

----------


## phoenyx

> Just so I know which side to join, let me ask:
> 
> If the Corona-19 virus real?
> 
> Is the Delta virus real?
> 
> Is the pandemic real?
> 
> Will it only get real if we, or someone we know, becomes infected?
> ...



I speak only for myself here. Also, I think that some of your questions are best answered with questions. So, here we go:

1- If you are defining the Corona virus as contagious, then no, I don't believe so. People are definitely dying of something new, but that doesn't require a contagious virus. I think that a great article getting into just how fraudulent a lot of the evidence is that a contagious coronavirus exists is this one:
COVID19 – Evidence Of Global Fraud | Children's Health Defense

2- Same answer as number 1.

3- Merriam Webster's first definition of a pandemic is something "occurring over a wide geographic area (such as multiple countries or continents) and typically affecting a significant proportion of the population". Something is definitely occurring over a wide geographic area, so in that sense, yes. The question is, what is occurring exactly? 

4- People are dying, and some are definitely dying in ways that haven't been seen much if ever before. What persuaded me of that was a video from Dr. Cameron Kyle-Sidell- as far as I know, when he posted it on youtube, it was his first youtube video ever. I'm not sure that video is still up, but he still has one video up on his own channel, which definitely gets into what he found:



Since that video came out, his findings have been talked about quite a bit. Here's an article on Linked in about it:
Almost 90% of COVID Patients Placed on Ventilators in New York City Died


A book I purchased called "The Truth about Contagion" also picked up on Dr. Cameron Kyle-Sidell's findings. Unlike Dr. Cameron, however, the authors of the book didn't come to the conclusion that a virus was somehow responsible. Here's what they had to say:
**
According to Dr. Cameron Kyle- Sidell, working in an Emergency Room (ER) in New York, the afflicted are literally gasping for air. "We've never seen anything like it!" he said (39). Covid-19 patients' symptoms resemble those of high altitude sickness rather than viral pneumonia. In fact, the ventilators that the hospitals have scrambled to obtain may do more harm than good and may be accounting for the high mortality rate, as they increase pressure on the lungs. These patients don't need help breathing- they need more oxygen when they take a breath. Many turn blue in the face. These are not signs of a contagious disease, but of disruption of our mechanism for producing energy and getting oxygen to the red blood cells. 

Remember that during the Spanish flu, the problem was the lack of blood coagulability; with Covid-19, a key problem is lack of oxygen in the blood- both conditions point to electrical toxicity rather than infection- iron-rich blood cells would be especially vulnerable to the effects of electromagnetism. 

And there's another symptom: fizzing. Many Covid patients report strange buzzing sensations throughout their body, "an electric feeling on the skin", or skin that feels like it is burning. Those who are electrically sensitive report similar sensations when they are near a cell phone or use GPS-guided cruise control in their cars. Other symptoms include a loss of smell and taste, fever, aches, breathlessness, fatigue, dry cough, diarrhea, strokes and seizures- all of which are also reported by those who are electrically sensitive. 

The correlation of 5G rollout and Covid-19 cases, and the similarity of symptoms, should give us pause. Shouldn't we look more closely before we institute mandatory vaccination and electronic ID chipping? Shouldn't we test to see whether this virus is actually contagious before we mandate social distancing and prescribe face masks? Today's pandemic raises many questions. What makes some people more vulnerable than others to the effects of [the 5G rollout]? Why did thirty five sailors on the battleship Arachne not get sick? Which environmental factors weaken our defenses? How should we treat this disease if it is not a viral disease? What about our diets? Can we protect ourselves with the right food choices? We will address these questions in subsequent chapters.

More importantly, we will show that the minute particles called viruses are actually exosomes- not invaders but toxin-gobbling messengers that our cells produce to adjust to environmental assaults, including electro-smog. After all, most people have adjusted to worldwide radio waves, electricity in their homes, and ubiquitous Wi-Fi (and the sparrow population rebounded after the flu of 1738); exosomes are what allow this to happen. These tiny messengers provide real-time and rapid genetic adaptation to environmental changes. Whether these exosomes can help us adapt to the extreme disruption of [the 5G rollout] is the question of the day.
**

Source: The Truth about Contagion, Kindle Edition

----------

Rutabaga (09-11-2021)

----------


## Sunsettommy

American Thinker

September 12, 2021


*Head of Tokyo Medical Association recommends ivermectin for COVID treatment**By Howard Richman


Excerpt:*


Dr. Haruo Ozaki, chairman of the Tokyo Medical Association recommends ivermectin for use with COVID patients. He notes that the parts of Africa that use ivermectin to control parasites have a COVID death rate of just 2.2 per 100,000 population, as compared to 13 times that death rate among African countries that do not use ivermectin. Similarly, worldometer.com statistics say that the COVID death rate in India (which uses HCQ and Ivermectin to treat COVID) is 32 while the COVID death rate in the U.S.A. is 6.5 times higher at 205 per 100,000 population.


LINK


========

More evidence that government and media has been LYING to us and been censoring the well known Ivermectin effectiveness.

----------

Big Dummy (09-12-2021),Conservative Libertarian (09-12-2021),Foghorn (09-12-2021),phoenyx (09-12-2021)

----------


## Foghorn

Maybe I'll order some online from Africa.



 :Tumbleweed:

----------


## phoenyx

Apparently it's not just Covid vaccines that can be harmful to one's health. The covid tests themselves can be as well. This isn't the first time I've heard of this type of thing happening either and the article does mention that it's happened previously. They assure us that it's an "extremely rare complication", but they've said that about serious Covid vaccine adverse events as well...


**
09 September 2021


A man's persistently runny nose following a COVID-19 test wasn't caused by allergies as he suspected, but rather cerebrospinal fluid leaking from his brain, according to a new report.

The man, who lives in the Czech Republic, received a COVID-19 nasal swab test in March 2020 after he had contact with a person infected with COVID-19, according to the report, published Thursday (Sept. 9) in the journal JAMA Otolaryngology–Head & Neck Surgery. The man's test was negative, but afterward he experienced a runny nose from just his right nostril. This symptom, which the patient mistakenly thought was due to allergies, lasted for months before he went to see a doctor in December 2020.
A CT scan of his skull showed that the man had an injury to the cribriform plate, a spongy bone that separates the nose and the brain. He was diagnosed with a cerebrospinal fluid (CSF) leak, a rare but serious condition in which the clear fluid that surrounds the brain and spinal cord leaks through a defect in the skull and out through the nose, according to Johns Hopkins University. Typically, the leakage happens from just one side of the nose, according to the Cleveland Clinic.

CSF leaks are dangerous because they can increase the risk of meningitis, which is an infection of the membranes that surround the brain and spinal cord. Still, patients can have a CSF leak for years before they develop serious problems, Live Science previously reported. 
[snip]
**


Full article:
COVID-19 test caused man's 9-month-long brain fluid leak | Live Science

----------

dinosaur (09-12-2021),donttread (09-12-2021),OneDumbBlonde (09-12-2021),QuaseMarco (09-12-2021),WarriorRob (09-12-2021)

----------


## Traddles

Actually the cause of the man's problem was whoever clumsily administered the test. And I'm amazed someone medical could be that clumsy.

I've only done the PCR test once, and the swabbing was done by me. I'm not medical, but I can figure out the necessary limits.

----------

phoenyx (09-12-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> Apparently it's not just Covid vaccines that can be harmful to one's health. The covid tests themselves can be as well. .....


Don't forget... they put poisons on that nasal swab too.  I'm sure   @QuaseMarco posted a video showing that.

I'll look for it.

----------

donttread (09-13-2021)

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## dinosaur

People flinch.  I've watched those tests.  No f'ing way that thing is going up my nose!

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-12-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

14-TIME WORLD CHAMPION WRESTLER GETS SMACK DOWN BY VAXXX INDUCED HHHEART ATTACK


He got the Jab April 14th 2021, heart attack Sept. 9th 2021 :Dontknow:

----------

Big Dummy (09-12-2021),Lone Gunman (09-12-2021),phoenyx (09-12-2021),Quark (09-12-2021)

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## donttread

> Apparently it's not just Covid vaccines that can be harmful to one's health. The covid tests themselves can be as well. This isn't the first time I've heard of this type of thing happening either and the article does mention that it's happened previously. They assure us that it's an "extremely rare complication", but they've said that about serious Covid vaccine adverse events as well...
> 
> 
> **
> 09 September 2021
> 
> 
> A man's persistently runny nose following a COVID-19 test wasn't caused by allergies as he suspected, but rather cerebrospinal fluid leaking from his brain, according to a new report.
> 
> ...



They do shove that thing up there!

----------

phoenyx (09-12-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> Actually the cause of the man's problem was whoever clumsily administered the test. And I'm amazed someone medical could be that clumsy.
> 
> I've only done the PCR test once, and the swabbing was done by me. I'm not medical, but I can figure out the necessary limits.


You may well be right, in that the only time this happens is when the person administering the test doesn't know what they're doing. Unfortunately, I have a strong feeling that there are a fair amount of people who are doing this who have little idea on how to do it properly.

----------


## phoenyx

> Don't forget... they put poisons on that nasal swab too.  I'm sure   @QuaseMarco posted a video showing that.
> 
> I'll look for it.


CmI, your jests are getting far too transparent :-p.

----------


## phoenyx

> People flinch.  I've watched those tests.  No f'ing way that thing is going up my nose!


At this point, I'm not sure one can avoid it if travelling by air in the U.S.. My brother actually decided to skip a U.S. airport to avoid a covid test, but if you -live- in the U.S., that's not exactly an option.

----------

dinosaur (09-12-2021)

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## phoenyx

> 14-TIME WORLD CHAMPION WRESTLER GETS SMACK DOWN BY VAXXX INDUCED HHHEART ATTACK
> 
> 
> He got the Jab April 14th 2021, heart attack Sept. 9th 2021


Man :-/.

----------

WarriorRob (09-12-2021)

----------


## Dan40

> People flinch.  I've watched those tests.  No f'ing way that thing is going up my nose!


Since Covid Cooties can fly 6 feet,  why do they need to stick the stick 2 feet up your nose.  I had the test,  it was as unpleasant as you imagine.

----------

dinosaur (09-12-2021),phoenyx (09-12-2021)

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## phoenyx

> Since Covid Cooties can fly 6 feet,  why do they need to stick the stick 2 feet up your nose.  I had the test,  it was as unpleasant as you imagine.


Reminds me of the japanese conducting anal swabs to the chinese back in world war 2. Supposedly it was for health reasons, but I remember reading in a book that it seemed more to humiliate the chinese. Fun fact, the chinese apparently remembered and decided to do the same to foreigners during these Covid times. As can be imagine, they weren't happy about the turnaround. I think they've stopped after an outcry, but I'm not 100% sure. Here's an excerpt from an news article on this:

**
China has made anal COVID-19 swabs mandatory for all foreign travelers arriving in the country, a report said Wednesday.
The government has claimed that such tests provide a higher degree of accuracy than other screening methods for the virus, the Times UK reported.
As part of the new travel requirement, there will be testing hubs in Beijing and Shanghai airports, the outlet reported.
Li Tongzeng, a respiratory disease medic, said the anal swabs are better because virus traces stay in fecal samples longer than they do in the nose or throat, state media reported.

**



Source:
China makes COVID-19 anal swabs mandatory for foreigners

----------


## QuaseMarco

> Since Covid Cooties can fly 6 feet,  why do they need to stick the stick 2 feet up your nose.  *I had the test,  it was as unpleasant as you imagine.*


Have you seen them giving that test to little kids............ it's child abuse.

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> CmI, your jests are getting far too transparent :-p.


You doubt me. I can't find the post in the forum but here is the FEAR MONGERING that it had in it. 
Stop COVID Testing Immediately: PCR And Quick Test Swabs May Be Cancer-Causing  Truth Unmuted

----------

phoenyx (09-12-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> You doubt me. I can't find the post in the forum but here is the FEAR MONGERING that it had in it. 
> Stop COVID Testing Immediately: PCR And Quick Test Swabs May Be Cancer-Causing  Truth Unmuted



I did. Thank you for the article. I thought it was a joke, but looks like it's true. Just when you thought the world couldn't get any darker, it slaps you in the face and says, "surprise!" :-/. From the original article:

**
_Not only has covid testing become a US$ 100 billion business, it is also potentially a “deadly business”. PCR and Quick Test swabs are sterilized with the carcinogen Ethylene Oxide._According to the Government of Canada, as well as the “What do They Know” the PCR test swabs are sterilized by ethylene oxide which is described by the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) as a carcinogen. In other words, a potentially cancer-causing chemical toxin.In essence, EPA says the following about the carcinogen Ethylene Oxide:“EPA classified ethylene oxide as a human carcinogen in December 2016. Studies of workers show that their exposures to ethylene oxide are associated with an increased risk of cancers of the white blood cells (the infection-fighting cells of the immune system). Studies also showed an increased risk of breast cancer in females.”
“Evidence in humans indicates that long-term exposure to ethylene oxide increases the risk of cancers of the white blood cells, including non-Hodgkin lymphoma, myeloma, and lymphocytic leukemia. Studies also show that long-term exposure to ethylene oxide increases the risk of breast cancer in females.”
“EPA, as well as the International Agency for Research on Cancer and the National Toxicology Program, classifies ethylene oxide as carcinogenic to humans. Evidence in humans indicates that exposure to ethylene oxide by inhalation increases the risk of lymphohematopoietic cancers (including non-Hodgkin lymphoma, myeloma, and lymphocytic leukemia) and, for females, breast cancer.
EtO is mutagenic (i.e., it can change the DNA in a cell). Children may be more susceptible to the harmful effects of mutagenic substances.”For the full EPA text, see this.**
Full article here:
Stop COVID Testing Immediately: PCR and Quick Test Swabs May be Cancer-Causing | globalresearch.ca

----------


## dinosaur

> At this point, I'm not sure one can avoid it if travelling by air in the U.S.. My brother actually decided to skip a U.S. airport to avoid a covid test, but if you -live- in the U.S., that's not exactly an option.





> Since Covid Cooties can fly 6 feet,  why do they need to stick the stick 2 feet up your nose.  I had the test,  it was as unpleasant as you imagine.


 :Smiley ROFLMAO:   Maybe Covid Cooties can fly, but dinosaur is retired.  That means I am no longer required to fly anywhere, at any time.  And that means I no longer fly anywhere, at any time.

Yeah, I see all those people on TV flinching and crying and wincing.  I think I would pass out.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-12-2021),phoenyx (09-12-2021)

----------


## Call_me_Ishmael

> I did. Thank you for the article. I thought it was a joke, but looks like it's true. Just when you thought the world couldn't get any darker, it slaps you in the face and says, "surprise!" :-/. From the original article:
> 
> **
> _Not only has covid testing become a US$ 100 billion business, it is also potentially a “deadly business”. PCR and Quick Test swabs are sterilized with the carcinogen Ethylene Oxide._According to the Government of Canada, as well as the “What do They Know” the PCR test swabs are sterilized by ethylene oxide which is described by the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) as a carcinogen. In other words, a potentially cancer-causing chemical toxin.In essence, EPA says the following about the carcinogen Ethylene Oxide:“EPA classified ethylene oxide as a human carcinogen in December 2016. Studies of workers show that their exposures to ethylene oxide are associated with an increased risk of cancers of the white blood cells (the infection-fighting cells of the immune system). Studies also showed an increased risk of breast cancer in females.”
> “Evidence in humans indicates that long-term exposure to ethylene oxide increases the risk of cancers of the white blood cells, including non-Hodgkin lymphoma, myeloma, and lymphocytic leukemia. Studies also show that long-term exposure to ethylene oxide increases the risk of breast cancer in females.”
> “EPA, as well as the International Agency for Research on Cancer and the National Toxicology Program, classifies ethylene oxide as carcinogenic to humans. Evidence in humans indicates that exposure to ethylene oxide by inhalation increases the risk of lymphohematopoietic cancers (including non-Hodgkin lymphoma, myeloma, and lymphocytic leukemia) and, for females, breast cancer.
> EtO is mutagenic (i.e., it can change the DNA in a cell). Children may be more susceptible to the harmful effects of mutagenic substances.”For the full EPA text, see this.**
> Full article here:
> Stop COVID Testing Immediately: PCR and Quick Test Swabs May be Cancer-Causing | globalresearch.ca


Yes. You are supposed to *FEAR* now.

----------


## Conservative Libertarian

> People flinch.  I've watched those tests.  No f'ing way that thing is going up my nose!


I've done the self-test. It's uncomfortable and caused my eyes to water but I managed to get through it.  Came up negative.

I take measurements for a living but not usually like this.

But, then again, I give myself shots twice per day too.

----------

dinosaur (09-12-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> Yes. You are supposed to *FEAR* now.


Lol :-p. Reminds me of that old saying: "Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you!"

And ofcourse who can forget this classic:
Conspiracy-theories-Are-not-always-wrong_131014387021.jpg

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-13-2021),Quark (09-16-2021)

----------


## phoenyx

> Have you seen them giving that test to little kids............ it's child abuse.


Agreed. So hard to get out of this nightmare :-/.

----------


## Wilson2

> I've done the self-test. It's uncomfortable and caused my eyes to water but I managed to get through it.  Came up negative.
> 
> I take measurements for a living but not usually like this.
> 
> But, then again, I give myself shots twice per day too.


Self test?   Then I wouldn’t push that swab so far, just an inch and be done with it.

----------

Conservative Libertarian (09-15-2021)

----------


## Dan40

> Maybe Covid Cooties can fly, but dinosaur is retired.  That means I am no longer required to fly anywhere, at any time.  And that means I no longer fly anywhere, at any time.
> 
> Yeah, I see all those people on TV flinching and crying and wincing.  I think I would pass out.


I had to test negative before back surgery.  The back pain trumped the test pain.  Flying today is torture for normal sized people.  For people my size its all but impossible.  I flew about 100, times a year in the old working days.  Now that 'they' have shrunk the space between seats,, it wouldn't be possible.  Funny the thing I miss most being retired is the travel.  New cities, new places, new people nearly every week.

----------

dinosaur (09-13-2021),phoenyx (09-12-2021)

----------


## YellowRose

Very difficult to know if it was directly caused by the vaccine. 

There apparently IS a correlation between the vaccine (or the virus) and vascular complications, so I guess it's possible, but I would have expected a heart attack, directly caused by the vaccine, to have happened much sooner after the vaccine was given.

----------

WarriorRob (09-12-2021)

----------


## Quark

> 14-TIME WORLD CHAMPION WRESTLER GETS SMACK DOWN BY VAXXX INDUCED HHHEART ATTACK
> 
> 
> He got the Jab April 14th 2021, heart attack Sept. 9th 2021


Extreme athletes are most in danger of heart attacks because they are usually down in vitamins and minerals especially zinc because of their heavy workouts. The military is having the same problems with extreme combat troops. It is said that this vaccine could have serious affects on troop readiness. This may explain why troops had to be yanked out of Afghanistan so fast. This may also explain the new and improved "woke" military.

----------

WarriorRob (09-12-2021)

----------


## WarriorRob

> Extreme athletes are most in danger of heart attacks because they are usually down in vitamins and minerals especially zinc because of their heavy workouts. The military is having the same problems with extreme combat troops. It is said that this vaccine could have serious affects on troop readiness. This may explain why troops had to be yanked out of Afghanistan so fast. This may also explain the new and improved "woke" military.


He did get the jab in April and had a heart attack in Sept., maybe it takes longer in some people, we don't know anything about this experimental crap, heard the animal trials they had, all animals died or had to be put down :Dontknow:

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Quark (09-16-2021)

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## WarriorRob

CHOOSE YOUR COVID POISON [mirrored]


Pretty good video at what's really going on with these poisonous vaccines.

----------

OneDumbBlonde (09-13-2021),phoenyx (09-13-2021),Quark (09-16-2021)

----------


## donttread

> Don't forget... they put poisons on that nasal swab too.  I'm sure   @QuaseMarco posted a video showing that.
> 
> I'll look for it.


They have a special area where they hide the bodies of the 10% of the vaccinated who die instantly upon vaccination. ALL media sworn to secrecy

----------


## phoenyx

> They have a special area where they hide the bodies of the 10% of the vaccinated who die instantly upon vaccination. ALL media sworn to secrecy


Aw c'mon donttread, you gotta be more creative with your sarcasm, that one's too obvious :-p. I gotta hand it to Ishmael though, that one about the nasal swabs, thinking he was joking and then, bam, turns out it's true, he really got me that time -.-

----------


## Conservative Libertarian

> Self test?   Then I wouldn’t push that swab so far, just an inch and be done with it.


It just needs to go in about that far--yo the area where the nostrils get smaller. You move it around each nostril firmly 5 times and then insert it into thing that shows lines for about 15 minutes.

----------


## Trinnity

> i have seen studies that show the minorities are much more affected by the virus than the white folks .. with blacks leading the way. in some cases the blacks are 5 times more likely to die from covid than the whites. you won't hear this from CNN or NBC.


It's diet and health related. Plus, they tend to distrust the vaccine (and who can blame them (((Tuskegee Institute anyone?))) ?)

Blacks don't trust the govt, but they vote democrat...boggles the mind...

----------

Quark (09-16-2021),QuaseMarco (09-17-2021),RET423 (09-15-2021),Wildrose (12-06-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

Big Bird (09-26-2021),JustPassinThru (09-17-2021),Knightkore (09-17-2021),Kodiak (09-25-2021),phoenyx (10-10-2021),Quark (09-16-2021),RET423 (09-17-2021)

----------


## Quark

> CHOOSE YOUR COVID POISON [mirrored]
> 
> 
> Pretty good video at what's really going on with these poisonous vaccines.


Sounds about right to me. No vaccine should be given to anybody except those who really need the vaccine. This blanket vaccine crap has to stop.

----------

QuaseMarco (09-17-2021),WarriorRob (09-16-2021)

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## WarriorRob

> Sounds about right to me. No vaccine should be given to anybody except those who really need the vaccine. This blanket vaccine crap has to stop.


I was wondering where that thread went to, trinnity is combining them. I thought it was one of the best videos I've seen on Covid Vaccines :Thumbsup20:

----------

Quark (09-16-2021),QuaseMarco (09-17-2021),RET423 (09-21-2021)

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## QuaseMarco

> Sounds about right to me. No vaccine should be given to anybody except those who really need the vaccine. This blanket vaccine crap has to stop.


It's having the same type of result as overuse of antibiotics.  
WHERE IS THE SCIENCE???

----------

RET423 (09-21-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

Big Bird (09-26-2021),phoenyx (09-26-2021),RET423 (09-26-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

Knightkore (09-30-2021)

----------


## QuaseMarco



----------

Knightkore (09-30-2021)

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## QuaseMarco



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phoenyx (10-28-2021)

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## QuaseMarco



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Knightkore (12-07-2021),phoenyx (11-22-2021),RET423 (12-07-2021)

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## Wildrose

> It's diet and health related. Plus, they tend to distrust the vaccine (and who can blame them (((Tuskegee Institute anyone?))) ?)
> 
> Blacks don't trust the govt, but they vote democrat...boggles the mind...


They also tend to be in the highest risk groups do to preexisting comorbid conditions.

Bad combination.

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## Dan40

I think this has been asked before, but not answered.  Since the unvaxxed are avoiding the vax and the booster, it follows they are also avoiding testing.  So where are all the positive tests coming from?

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## Oceander

> I think this has been asked before, but not answered.  Since the unvaxxed are avoiding the vax and the booster, it follows they are also avoiding testing.  So where are all the positive tests coming from?


Why would it follow that the unvaccinated are avoiding testing?  That doesn't follow.

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## JustPassinThru

> Why would it follow that the unvaccinated are avoiding testing?  That doesn't follow.


Why would they bother testing?

If they're obsessed with this China virus, they'd already have gotten the Majik Jab and however many "boosters" are recommended now.

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## Oceander

> Why would they bother testing?
> 
> If they're obsessed with this China virus, they'd already have gotten the Majik Jab and however many "boosters" are recommended now.


Why?  For a myriad of reasons.  For example, because they were exposed to someone who tested positive for covid and they want to know if they got it.  Or because they have to show a negative test result for work.  Etc, etc, etc.

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## Dan40

> Why?  For a myriad of reasons.  For example, because they were exposed to someone who tested positive for covid and they want to know if they got it.  Or because they have to show a negative test result for work.  Etc, etc, etc.


The jabbed are the people getting tested because they know the vaccines FAILED  When people are told they have immunity.  Then told no immunity just MAYBE not so sick.  Then  they get a booster as told.  Then they're told people are still dying in droves from the weaker variants.  Of course these "true believers" will  be getting tested as often as possible.

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## East of the Beast

My brother and his wife are ate up with this excrement. My brother is double vaxed,his wife is boosted and so is their entire family. Yet, they are scared to death of the Omicron. They are not having any family gatherings for the holidays. It's insane. I've learned you can't reason with people who have a deep seated fear like this. It just causes hard feelings.So, all I can say is, "I love ya bro and have a Merry Christmas".

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## Knightkore

“Vaccines offer strong protection from serious illness, even if they don’t always prevent a mild infection.” These kind of statements don’t even make sense.

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## Knightkore

> Why?  For a myriad of reasons.  For example, because they were exposed to someone who tested positive for covid and they want to know if they got it.  Or because they have to show a negative test result for work.  Etc, etc, etc.


It's mainly the work issue.

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## QuaseMarco

*After firing all unvaccinated doctors and nurses, Ontario orders hospitals and clinics to CANCEL non-urgent surgeries due to lack of staff*


Ontarios Chief Medical Officer of Health Dr. Kieran Moore has announced that all non-urgent surgeries are being canceled throughout the province due to an overload of sick patients and not enough medical staff.


Because all unvaccinated nurses and doctors were recently let go from their jobs due to Canadas Wuhan coronavirus (Covid-19) vaccine mandates, there are now not enough bodies on-site to handle the influx of sick patients, many of whom are fully vaccinated.


Effective Jan. 5, anyone needing a surgery that the Canadian government deems to be not that important will have to wait indefinitely to receive medical care. The rule applies to both hospitals and independent health clinics throughout Ontario.

*Read More SOURCE:* https://www.naturalnews.com/2022-01-...ted-fired.html

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Big Bird (01-10-2022),Knightkore (01-10-2022)

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## Dan40

> “Vaccines offer strong protection from serious illness, even if they don’t always prevent a mild infection.” These kind of statements don’t even make sense.


What does about Covid and/or vaccines?

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Knightkore (01-10-2022)

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## Knightkore

> What does about Covid and/or vaccines?


What does what?

You have ivermectin & hydroxy.  You also have the fact we still forget that the virus is the flu is the virus is the flu.....

https://www.globalresearch.ca/manufa...vid-19/5707781

They never could & still don't have a test that specifically tell one strain from the next.  We have been lied to on all counts.

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Big Bird (01-10-2022),OneDumbBlonde (02-01-2022)

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## Knightkore



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Big Bird (01-10-2022),JustPassinThru (01-10-2022),OneDumbBlonde (02-01-2022)

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## Knightkore



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OneDumbBlonde (02-01-2022)

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## Knightkore

https://alethonews.com/2021/12/30/as...is-telling-us/


By comparing the vaccination status of those infected, the researchers found a vaccine effectiveness against the Omicron variant of minus-76.5% for Pfizer and minus-39.3% for Moderna three months after double vaccination (see chart above), meaning the double-vaccinated were considerably more likely to be infected than the unvaccinated.

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JustPassinThru (02-01-2022),OneDumbBlonde (02-01-2022)

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## Dan40

I hear that Oregon and Washington State are rehiring health care workers that ARE infected, but vaccinated.  But will not rehire health care workers that ARE NOT infected, but not vaccinated.  The woke are beyond insane!

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Knightkore (02-02-2022),OneDumbBlonde (02-01-2022)

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## Knightkore



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## Dubler9

DELTA OMICRON
MEDIA CONTROL ...... ???

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Knightkore (02-07-2022)

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## Knightkore



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phoenyx (02-17-2022)

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## phoenyx

> 


I doubt that the document states that the test is being used to create the covid narrative. However, here's what the FDA document does state:
**
*Detection of viral RNA may not indicate the presence of infectious virus or that 2019-nCoV is the causative agent for clinical symptoms.*

...


*This test cannot rule out diseases caused by other bacterial or viral pathogens.*
**

Source:
https://www.fda.gov/media/134922/download

The text is at the top part of page 39.

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Knightkore (02-17-2022),RET423 (03-26-2022)

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## Knightkore

> I doubt that the document states that the test is being used to create the covid narrative. However, here's what the FDA document does state:
> **
> *Detection of viral RNA may not indicate the presence of infectious virus or that 2019-nCoV is the causative agent for clinical symptoms.*
> 
> ...
> 
> 
> *This test cannot rule out diseases caused by other bacterial or viral pathogens.*
> **
> ...


Which matches up with the first article I printed & saved on this whole plandemic lie:

https://www.globalresearch.ca/manufa...vid-19/5707781

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phoenyx (02-17-2022),RET423 (03-26-2022)

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## phoenyx

> Which matches up with the first article I printed & saved on this whole plandemic lie:
> 
> https://www.globalresearch.ca/manufa...vid-19/5707781


I have found Global Research to be a good source of information. Other articles that basically get to the same point:

Evidence of Global Fraud | Off Guardian

Misinterpretation VIRUS II (2) by Dr. Stefan Lanka - Beginning and End of the Corona Crisis - Yummy.Doctor Holistic Health Education

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Knightkore (02-17-2022)

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## Dubler9

*Triple vaccinated mum, 40, dies of Covid with friends and family left to support young children*

This in UK yesterday. She also had the boosters.

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Knightkore (03-25-2022),phoenyx (03-25-2022)

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## Knightkore

> *Triple vaccinated mum, 40, dies of Covid with friends and family left to support young children*
> 
> This in UK yesterday. She also had the boosters.


At BEST the shots do absolutely nothing against an already harmless cold/flu at a 99.8 percent recovery rate, especially when you consider natural immunity is at minimum four times better than the shots efficacy.  But at worst the shots actually deplete the immune system leaving a person vulnerable.

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Dubler9 (03-25-2022)

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## Dan40

> It just needs to go in about that far--yo the area where the nostrils get smaller. You move it around each nostril firmly 5 times and then insert it into thing that shows lines for about 15 minutes.


YOU do, I don't!

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Knightkore (03-25-2022)

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## Dan40

Here is what the government/authorities say/admit now.  None of the various vaccines prevent covid infections. --------- None of the various vaccines effect the continued spread of covid. --------  None of the various tests for covid are reliable. -------- None of the vaccines manufacturers are liable for side effects damages.  That is what  "the experts/liars" have told us so far.  This should help you, whoever you are, make an intelligent decision about covid and vaccines. -----------------------------------Or not.

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Knightkore (03-25-2022),phoenyx (03-25-2022),RET423 (03-26-2022)

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## phoenyx

> At BEST the shots do absolutely nothing against an already harmless cold/flu at a 99.8 percent recovery rate, especially when you consider natural immunity is at minimum four times better than the shots efficacy.  But at worst the shots actually deplete the immune system leaving a person vulnerable.


If only that was truly the worst they could do...

COVID-19 Vaccine Related Fatalities Updated | precisionvaccinations.com

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Knightkore (03-25-2022)

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## Dubler9

I have heard that Trumps son won his court case in the Supreme Court? Against the vaccine implementation.

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Knightkore (03-25-2022)

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