# Stuff and Things > Guns and Self Defense >  W.Va. student, school at odds over NRA T-shirt

## garyo

The PC bullshit is becoming overwhelming.

CHARLESTON, W.Va. (AP)  A West Virginia student was charged with causing a disruption at a middle school when he refused to remove a T-shirt that displayed the National Rifle Association's logo and hunting rifle.

 Jared Marcum, 14, said the shirt did not violate Logan Middle School's dress code policy.
 "I was surprised. It shocked me  that the school didn't know their own dress code and their own policy. I  figured they would have known not to call me out on that shirt because  there was nothing wrong with it," Marcum said in a telephone interview.
 Marcum's stepfather, Allen Lardieri,  said the youth was waiting in line in the school cafeteria Thursday  when a teacher ordered the eighth-grader to remove the T-shirt or to  turn it inside out.
 Marcum said was sent to the office where he again refused the order.
 "When the police came, I was still talking and telling them that this was wrong, that they cannot do this, it's not against any school policy.  The officer, he told me to sit down and be quiet. I said, 'No, I'm  exercising my right to free speech.' I said it calmly," he said.

http://news.yahoo.com/w-va-student-s...221912044.html

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## usfan

That is bullshit.  They'll let kids wear obama shirts, or chavez shirts, or democratic party shirts, or just about any liberal cause you can think of.  But someone wears a shirt defending one of our constitutional amendments, & the anti liberty bigots come out & try to intimidate us.  Kudos to the 14 yr old for sticking to his.. pardon the pun.. guns.

As much as i hate all the litigation going on, i wouldn't care if the kid or parents sued the school for violating his constitutional rights.. it should be a civil rights issue, too.  This is bigotry, & hate speech.  Use their pet laws against them.









BTW, good find.. better than looking for B&W actresses to bone...   :Cool20:

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Perianne (06-28-2013)

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## garyo

It's all subjective and the PC Idiots are in control.

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## Calypso Jones

I heard it was a female teacher of sorts that started the whole thing.    That's a woman for ya...and especially a liberal woman.    This boy must be made to give up his maleness.  He must be shut down and eventually forced to conform.

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## garyo

That teacher needs to be humiliated as she did to this child, I'd horse fuck her for the cause.

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## Roadmaster

They need to get together and get this teacher removed.

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## garyo

> They need to get together and get this teacher removed.


I think a good humiliation on the square would suffice.

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## zelmo1234

> That teacher needs to be humiliated as she did to this child, I'd horse fuck her for the cause.


No you have her go to the local shopping center with a sandwich board that says,  I tried to take away my students right to free speach and expression, please spit on me!  and have her do a few weekends!

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## Taxcutter

What makes this remarkable is that it occurred in West Virginia which is a VERY gun-friendly state.

I'd say the teacher, the principal, the school superintendent, and the local law enforcement people better retain counsel.

Heads are gonna roll.

The NRA and Tea party will be on this like a coat of paint.   Americans are rubbed raw by the attempted Obama gun grab and are not gonna tolerate anything like this.

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## Trinnity

> *W.Va. Teen Arrested After 'Almost Inciting Riot' Wearing NRA Shirt to School*
> 
> A West Virginia teen arrested and accused of nearly inciting a riot  after a confrontation with a teacher over his National Rifle Association  t-shirt has inspired dozens of students across his county to wear  similar apparel in solidarity. Jared Marcum, 14, had a confrontation Thursday with a Logan Middle School teacher over his NRA t-shirt, which bears the organization's logo, along with an image of a hunting rifle and the phrase, "Protect your right."  Marcum's lawyer, Ben White, said that when the teen was told to remove the shirt or turn it inside out, he attempted to engage the teacher in a debate. *"Jared respects firearms and has training to use them, and believes in  the Second Amendment," White told ABCNews.com. "He believes it's being  threatened by current legislation. He wore [the shirt] as an expression  of political speech and the need to protect the Second Amendment." * 
> 
> White said that Marcum  had been wearing the shirt without causing any problems from homeroom  at the beginning of the school day through fifth period, and was  confronted by one of the school's teachers while getting his lunch. When  Jared refused to remove or reverse the shirt, the teacher began to  raise his voice, and it caught the attention of students eating their  lunch, White said. Marcum was eventually arrested and taken away by police after refusing  to remove the shirt. White said that when police told the teen they were  going to arrest him, he stuck his hands out and said, "Fine."  
> 
> Logan City Police Chief E.K. Harper told ABCNews.com that Marcum was not  arrested for wearing a t-shirt, but for "disrupting the school  process. His conduct in school almost incited a riot," Harper said. *White said that charges being filed against Marcum are pending the  prosecutor's office's review of the evidence. But he insisted that it  was the teacher who caused the issue by confronting the teen, and that  video gathered from the school will prove it. "I believe the teacher was acting beyond the scope of his employment,"  he said. "What the video shows is that students did step up on the  benches to the tables in the lunchroom when they were escorting Jared  out of building. Kids jumped up, clapping.*
> 
> Logan county schools' dress code prohibits clothing and accessories that display profanity, violence,  discriminatory messages or sexual language, along with ads for alcohol,  tobacco or drugs. There is no mention of the NRA or guns.  "My belief is that if the teacher could have applied some common sense  and say, 'I think that violates the dress code. Let me check with the  dress code,'" White said.  
> ...


God bless him. Kids like this give me hope.

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## Calypso Jones

I notice no one in here defending his first amendment rights.    It's all relative isn't it.

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Trinnity (04-23-2013)

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## BleedingHeadKen

> I notice no one in here defending his first amendment rights.    It's all relative isn't it.


You're right. If he had been wearing  a "I'm in favor of gay marriage" T-Shirt and had been arrested under the same circumstances, the progressives would be out in force. I'd say that they'd be "up in arms" but that might be a terroristic threat  :Smile:

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Calypso Jones (04-23-2013),Gemini (06-18-2013),St James (04-24-2013)

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## garyo

> You're right. If he had been wearing  a "I'm in favor of gay marriage" T-Shirt and had been arrested under the same circumstances, the progressives would be out in force. I'd say that they'd be "up in arms" but that might be a terroristic threat


Bullseye.

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Calypso Jones (04-23-2013)

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## Trinnity

<moral relativism>

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## Maximatic

It's a problem because of were he was. He has as much say over what may be said in a _public_ school  as any cop or teacher. Once we say that something is owned equally, by everyone,  we can't then turn around and say that some people have a greater claim  on that thing than anyone else. Those two statements contradict each  other. They can't both be true. 

So who owns the school? If the agents of government are the ones with the  ultimate claim on it and say over what happens in it, then it is not a  public school, it is a government school.

If it really is owned equally, by everyone, then how do we adjudicate  disputes over it? By vote? Then it's not owned equally, by everyone, but  by the biggest group that agrees on some policy regarding it.

Saying that something is owned equally, by everyone is stupid. I'm not  even sure it's coherent. It's definitely a recipe for conflict.

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## Maximatic

> Logan City Police Chief E.K. Harper told ABCNews.com that  Marcum was not  arrested for wearing a t-shirt, but for "disrupting the  school  process. His conduct in school almost incited a riot," Harper  said.


They should have arrested the teachers who started the confrontation.

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## Maximatic

All my other post in the thread about the man with the nasty tshirt are are responses to arguments in favor of his having been arrested. Without that kind of arguments here, my responses wouldn't make much sense.

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## St James

> They should have arrested the teachers who started the confrontation.


...everyone is equal. Some are more equal than others   _Animal Farm_

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## patrickt

The kid was an idiot. Does the First Amendment give free speech any where, any time, with no regard to private property? No, it doesn't. The exact same argument that allowed the park officials to say the dickhead's sexually harassing t-shirt would not be worn in the park would apply to the school officials saying this t-shirt will not be worn in their school. The fact that you agree with or don't agree with the t-shirt is totally irrelevant.

The kid was not arrested for wearing a t-shirt. Read the article. With luck he might grow up to be a patriot. It would seem to be a long shot but it's possible.

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## Guest

> I notice no one in here defending his first amendment rights.    It's all relative isn't it.


I was arguing about this on the other forum...what's good for the goose is good for the gander.  If he wore a "Gay and Lesbian" alliance tshirt progressives would be fighting for his right to wear it.

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## Guest

> The kid was an idiot. Does the First Amendment give free speech any where, any time, with no regard to private property? No, it doesn't. The exact same argument that allowed the park officials to say the dickhead's sexually harassing t-shirt would not be worn in the park would apply to the school officials saying this t-shirt will not be worn in their school. The fact that you agree with or don't agree with the t-shirt is totally irrelevant.


^^^ I disagree emphatically with your opinion on this, but @patrickt I will give YOU props for being consistent.  Consistently wrong, but at least you're proving my point to @Trinnity and @Calypso.

 :Big Grin: 




> The kid was not arrested for wearing a t-shirt. Read the article. With luck he might grow up to be a patriot. It would seem to be a long shot but it's possible.


He was wearing the tshirt in a public school paid for by tax dollars.  The courts have ruled in several times over that you do not lose your first amendment right in a public space like a school.

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## patrickt

Are you really an attorney? A school is a public space? So, members of the public can go in and out of the school on a whim. And, no one connected with the schools can made any rules about behavior, clothing, or anything else.

A school is no more a public space than is a courthouse or a jail. It is a public building existing for a specific purpose. 

And, the First Amendment right is, according to you, the right to say what you want, when you want, and where you want. Sadly, neither to courts nor the Constitution have agreed with you.

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## patrickt

Are you really an attorney? A school is a public space? So, members of the public can go in and out of the school on a whim. Students from the high school can come and hang out at the junior high. Bums can come in and shower in the gym facilities. Amazing. And, no one connected with the schools can made any rules about behavior, clothing, or anything else. It's a public space like a jail or the courthouse or Public Defenders Office.

The police were called to remove a couple of people from the Public Defenders office one day. I'm shocked that none of those attorneys had your view of public space and the First Amendment.

A school is no more a public space than is a courthouse or a jail. It is a public building existing for a specific purpose. It has management who are allowed to make rules for the building and the people using it.

And, the First Amendment right is, according to you, the right to say what you want, when you want, and where you want. Sadly, neither to courts nor the Constitution have agreed with you. 

You apparently slept through the classes on public versus private and what it means. Here's a hint. A shopping center is a public place that is privately owned with a plethora of rules. In our town, there was a downtown street that was turned into a pedestrian mall. Clearly a public space and is owned by the city but they appointed an association of business people to administer the area and there are as many rules as an indoor mall.

Sorry, Rina, but I can't praise your consistency, logic, or legal education.

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## Guest

> Are you really an attorney? A school is a public space? So, members of the public can go in and out of the school on a whim. And, no one connected with the schools can made any rules about behavior, clothing, or anything else.


Actually, I'm a cop.  You can tell because I just beat the crap out of someone who asked me why I needed to see their ID this morning.

393.US. 503 1969  Look it up.  When you're done I've got 20 more.

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## Trinnity

> Actually, I'm a cop.  You can tell because I just beat the crap out of someone who asked me why I needed to see their ID this morning.
> 
> 393.US. 503 1969  Look it up.  When you're done I've got 20 more.


Okay, I did.


> *Tinker v. Des Moines Independent Community School District* 			 			 			 								 				From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
>  				 								 				 				 																 				 					Jump to:					navigation, 					search 
> Tinker v. Des Moines Independent Community School District
> 
> 
> *Supreme Court of the United States*
> 
> Argued November 12, 1968
> Decided February 24, 1969
> ...

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## usfan

didn't we work on this topic here?

http://thepoliticsforums.com/threads...er-NRA-T-shirt

IMO, sometimes it is better to merge some threads that have the exact same topic.. that way all the thoughts are in the same place, & are not being repeated in different threads.. but that just imo..

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## JohnAdams

> The kid was an idiot. Does the First Amendment give free speech any where, any time, with no regard to private property? No, it doesn't. The exact same argument that allowed the park officials to say the dickhead's sexually harassing t-shirt would not be worn in the park would apply to the school officials saying this t-shirt will not be worn in their school. The fact that you agree with or don't agree with the t-shirt is totally irrelevant.
> 
> The kid was not arrested for wearing a t-shirt. Read the article. With luck he might grow up to be a patriot. It would seem to be a long shot but it's possible.


Yes it actually does. 

According to the U.S. supreme court free speech, particularly free political speech, is protected speech no matter where you are in the United States. (note the period liberals)

Even in jail you have the right, in the U.S. to say whatever the hell you want to say politically without fear of reprisal by someone in government. (Which is what a teacher is, a government employee)

And thanks for proving the point Ken and others make about libs and free speech.

Funny how when it comes to some issues (abortion, gay rights, pro-gun control, pro-obammy anything) liberals are the first in line to yell about free political speech, but when it comes to something like this, they all shut up and try to pretend that free speech for some made up reason suddenly no longer applies.

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## JohnAdams

> Are you really an attorney? A school is a public space? So, members of the public can go in and out of the school on a whim. Students from the high school can come and hang out at the junior high. Bums can come in and shower in the gym facilities. Amazing. And, no one connected with the schools can made any rules about behavior, clothing, or anything else. It's a public space like a jail or the courthouse or Public Defenders Office.
> 
> The police were called to remove a couple of people from the Public Defenders office one day. I'm shocked that none of those attorneys had your view of public space and the First Amendment.
> 
> A school is no more a public space than is a courthouse or a jail. It is a public building existing for a specific purpose. It has management who are allowed to make rules for the building and the people using it.
> 
> And, the First Amendment right is, according to you, the right to say what you want, when you want, and where you want. Sadly, neither to courts nor the Constitution have agreed with you. 
> 
> You apparently slept through the classes on public versus private and what it means. Here's a hint. A shopping center is a public place that is privately owned with a plethora of rules. In our town, there was a downtown street that was turned into a pedestrian mall. Clearly a public space and is owned by the city but they appointed an association of business people to administer the area and there are as many rules as an indoor mall.
> ...


And you apparently slept through social studies when they covered what the bill of rights are, and why we have them in the first place. 

There is a reason the very first amendment to the Constitution was an amendment ensuring the right of free speech. 

Most liberals alive today, are walking talking examples of that reason too.

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## Guest

> And you apparently slept through social studies when they covered what the bill of rights are, and why we have them in the first place. 
> 
> There is a reason the very first amendment to the Constitution was an amendment ensuring the right of free speech. 
> 
> Most liberals alive today, are walking talking examples of that reason too.



He just hates attorneys.  I could say that the sky is blue and he'd say that it was red.  If I could prove it was blue he'd say an attorney painted it that way.

A tshirt is not an adequate disruption of public space.  The courts define public space as that which is publicly owned--hence why we also cannot discriminate when it comes to public space.

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## usfan

> That is bullshit.  They'll let kids wear obama shirts, or chavez shirts, or democratic party shirts, or just about any liberal cause you can think of.  But someone wears a shirt defending one of our constitutional amendments, & the anti liberty bigots come out & try to intimidate us.  Kudos to the 14 yr old for sticking to his.. pardon the pun.. guns.
> 
> As much as i hate all the litigation going on, i wouldn't care if the kid or parents sued the school for violating his constitutional rights.. it should be a civil rights issue, too.  This is bigotry, & hate speech.  Use their pet laws against them.


It IS a free speech issue, imo.  The student did not violate school policy, by wearing profane, vulgar, gang related, or even spamming messages.  IF it is ok for students to wear gay rights shirts, or pro choice shirts, which you know it is, how can discriminating against someone wearing someone celebrating the 2nd amendment be tolerated?  

Only in the leftist world of indoctrination & redefinition..

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## Trinnity

> didn't we work on this topic here?
> 
> http://thepoliticsforums.com/threads...er-NRA-T-shirt
> 
> IMO, sometimes it is better to merge some threads that have the exact same topic.. that way all the thoughts are in the same place, & are not being repeated in different threads.. but that just imo..


I didn't see the other one. Thanks for the heads up.

Threads merged

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## Trinnity

Eighth-Grader Who Refused to Remove NRA Shirt Could Face Year in Prison

Perhaps a suddenly firearm-friendly President Obama can put in a good word for Jared Marcum. In April, Marcum, an eighth-grader at Logan Middle School in Logan, W. Va., was arrested when he refused to take off his NRA t-shirt. The New York_ Daily News_ reports:

The clothing kerfuffle began when Marcum wore a shirt bearing the NRA’s logo and a hunting rifle. As he stood in line in the cafeteria, a teacher ordered him to either change shirts or turn it inside out.

Marcum declined and was sent to the office, where an officer was dispatched after he again refused to comply with the school’s request.
Cops arrested him and charged him with disrupting the educational process and obstructing an officer.

Late last week Marcum “appeared before a judge and was officially charged with obstructing an officer,” reports Fox News. If convicted, he could face up to a $500 fine or a year in prison. He will be back in front of the judge on July 11 if his attorney cannot get the charge dismissed before then.
One can understand this sort of silliness across the border in Maryland (as we have chronicled here and here) — but in West Virginia? This is, after all, the state whose senator’s campaign ad featured him shooting Obama's cap and trade bill. Ah, those were the days.

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## Roadmaster

> You're right. If he had been wearing  a "I'm in favor of gay marriage" T-Shirt and had been arrested under the same circumstances, the progressives would be out in force. I'd say that they'd be "up in arms" but that might be a terroristic threat


people would have come out of the woodwork to stand behind that one. Show by example, bring friends like they do and ask for the teachers resignation. Threaten to sue for not protecting his rights and show example of other kids shirts. They may settle but let your precedence be known that the child is not alone, then some will think twice signaling out certain students.

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Trinnity (06-17-2013)

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## garyo

The PC loons are making a criminal out of a 14yr old child to satisfy their agenda.  :Angry20: 

The West Virginia  eighth-grader who was suspended and arrested in late April after he  refused to remove a t-shirt supporting the National Rifle Association appeared in court this week and was formally charged with obstructing an officer.
 As CBS affiliate WTRF reports, 14-year-old Jared Marcum now faces a $500 fine and a maximum of one year in prison.
 The boys father, Allen Lardieri, is not pleased.
 Me, Im more of a fighter and so is Jared and eventually were going  to get through this, Lardieri told WTRF.  I dont think it should  have ever gotten this far.
 Every aspect of this is just totally wrong, Lardieri added.  He  has no background of anything criminal up until now and it just seems  like nobody wants to admit theyre wrong.
 Officials at Logan Middle School in Logan County, West Va. maintain that Marcum,  who has since completed eighth grade, was suspended for one day because  he caused a disruption after a teacher asked him to remove a shirt  emblazoned with a hunting rifle and the statement protect your right.

http://news.yahoo.com/14-old-kid-arr...071819724.html

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## Trinnity

*Threads merged*

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## hoytmonger

:Glasses7: The kid is obviously not taking to his indoctrination and must be moved to a re-education camp. Counselors should be made available to the other students to be sure they haven't been infected by this serious breech of protocol. Maybe mind altering pharmaceuticals should be mixed in with the students meat free lunches and Michael Moore films should be shown every day for a month to reinforce the state's agenda. :Glasses6:

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## BleedingHeadKen

> The PC loons are making a criminal out of a 14yr old child to satisfy their agenda. 
> 
> The West Virginia  eighth-grader who was suspended and arrested in late April after he  refused to remove a t-shirt supporting the National Rifle Association appeared in court this week and was formally charged with obstructing an officer.
>  As CBS affiliate WTRF reports, 14-year-old Jared Marcum now faces a $500 fine and a maximum of one year in prison.
>  The boy’s father, Allen Lardieri, is not pleased.
>  “Me, I’m more of a fighter and so is Jared and eventually we’re going  to get through this,” Lardieri told WTRF.  “I don’t think it should  have ever gotten this far.”
>  “Every aspect of this is just totally wrong,” Lardieri added.  “He  has no background of anything criminal up until now and it just seems  like nobody wants to admit they’re wrong.”
>  Officials at Logan Middle School in Logan County, West Va. maintain that Marcum,  who has since completed eighth grade, was suspended for one day because  he caused a disruption after a teacher asked him to remove a shirt  emblazoned with a hunting rifle and the statement “protect your right.”
> 
> http://news.yahoo.com/14-old-kid-arr...071819724.html



Well, if he gets out of this, he should get out of the prisons that are the school system and either be home schooled, learn on his own, or go to a private school. He obviously doesn't belong in one of the state's indoctrination centers and the earlier he gets out, the better.

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garyo (06-18-2013),Gemini (06-18-2013)

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## Guest

A class/ First degree Misdemeanors all have the potential for up to one year in prison.  Do people spend that year on a first offense?  No.

That said, I think its absolute bullshit and more police state garbage but I guarantee if Rand Paul tried to produce legislation against this type of crap like maybe three people would stand up with him.

This country sucks.

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BleedingHeadKen (06-18-2013)

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## Gemini

> This country sucks.


No.  This country's government sucks.  Country has flaws for sure.  But even with all of its flaws it is still the best one out there to my knowledge.

Although that appears to be rapidly changing.

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## Gemini

> That teacher needs to be humiliated as she did to this child, I'd horse fuck her for the cause.


Um...yuck.  You shouldn't ever make a horse do something so disgusting.

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## garyo

I apologize to horses everywhere.

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Gemini (06-18-2013)

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## Calypso Jones

I read today that a judge dropped the charges.   Finally some sanity.

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## garyo

It was pressure, not sanity.

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Gemini (06-28-2013)

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## Trinnity

Yes, it was from public pressure and bad PR. YAY!!!

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