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Thread: Waking Up from Religion . . .

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quark View Post
    That's the official number of the really good guys, the chosen few as it were according to the Jehovah Witnesses.
    Ahhh. The extra book guy.
    The Progressives have become full blown NAZIs, to thwart a Hitler that doesn't exist...since that is the only way they can express, and self justify, their fascism.

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    Jesus said as much,”Few there’ll be who find it....” I actually agree with most of what he says.They are all Bible based beliefs.There’s one or two I have a problem with but I won’t go into that.
    @patrickt @Quark and whoever else here are non believers in God.That’s your right not to believe just as believing in Him is my right and I will conduct myself accordingly. I like you guys or I wouldn’t even bother responding to you.Just a little mutual respect and civility is all I ask.
    The true Church belongs to Jesus Christ.Those who pervert it are worse off in the end than those who don’t believe in it at all.
    Last edited by East of the Beast; 12-07-2017 at 05:37 AM.



    For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any two edged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart...Heb.4:12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knightkore View Post
    Good. Christianity.....following Jesus is not religion.
    The philosophy (God's written word) passed down to mankind by it's Creator, and Son Jesus is sacrosanct! Any departure is of man's creation through his religions (et al), as inspired by Satan to deceive, contradict and challenge God's Sovereignty. (2 Cor. 4:4)
    Last edited by S-N-A-F-U; 12-07-2017 at 06:44 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by S-N-A-F-U View Post
    The philosophy (God's written word) passed down to mankind by it's Creator, and Son Jesus is sacrosanct! Any departure is of man's creation through his religions (et al), as inspired by Satan to deceive, contradict and challenge God's Sovereignty. (2 Cor. 4:4)
    Faith based on faith based on yet more faith. And infallible besides. I wonder why Jesus didn't just wave his hand and have everything he ever said written down on granite slabs instead of leaving it up to men, much later, to write what they imagined their god was telling them to write?

    Well, that would have defeated the glory of faith built on faith built on yet more faith.

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    I have several issues with the concepts of this thread... which i see as a polemical one promoting a phony narrative about Christianity, rather than having any philosophical insight into the human condition.


    1. The narrative is, 'Religion is bad! Atheistic Naturalism is loving & peaceful!
    2. 'Religion' and 'Christianity' are used synonymously. If the author wants to bash christianity, why not just address it directly? That would be a more honest approach.
    3. 'Religion' is a loaded term, that has fluid definitions.. that is why it is a favorite term for progressives & the atheistic left. In the context of this article, it just means, 'Christianity!!'
    4. 'Religion', is any philosophical belief or opinion about the nature of God, Man, & the universe. It is not just Christianity. Even agnosticism is a 'religion'. So, if the author wishes to address the decline of christianity, or organized denominations, they should make that case. But 'religion' is alive & well in every human being.
    5. I would be happy to debate the philosophical & logical issues around this subject, but find that religious hysteria from militant atheists & progressives drown out any rational discussion, so it is usually best to avoid the topic, which is presented ad nauseum to promote the phony narrative. It is a propaganda meme, not a rational topic of discussion.

    How is any belief/opinion/theory about the nature of the universe NOT a 'religious' belief/opinion/theory? Is there any scientific proof of atheistic naturalism? Of course not. Yet it is taught as the State Religion, & indoctrinated into the people as if it was proven fact. IMO, that is the main reason for the increase of atheism in the west. It is not like there have been any scientific advancements that have proved the naturalistic beliefs.. they have just been indoctrinated by constant repetition into the Mainstream Religion of the day.

    So the whole notion that 'religion is dying!' is absurd. The religion is just changing, from a God-centered ideology, with roots in the reformation, the Enlightenment, & the American Founders, to one of man-centered humanism, with marxist & darwinist ideology permeating the worldview.

    So, if you want to say that 'Christianity is dying!', go right ahead. You will not be the first, or last, to make that prediction. But it is not like there is some great turn toward Scientific Reality, that has contradicted any theistic beliefs about God, Man, & the universe. It is just Naturalistic humanism, promoted by the progressive education system, that has become the State Religion. It is a belief, only, and has the backing of the state systems to promote it with religious fervor & exclusivity.





    Dewey was the founder of modern education.. a hero of the progressive movement, which only had a brief setback during WW2, & then picked up steam to become the unofficial State Religion, as it is now. Every post war student has been indoctrinated into this ideology, and only exposure to history, facts, & individual thinking can break the grip of this social brainwashing. Not too many can do this, which explains threads like this.
    Rather than love, than money, than fame, give me truth. ~Henry David Thoreau

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    Quote Originally Posted by East of the Beast View Post
    Jesus said as much,”Few there’ll be who find it....” I actually agree with most of what he says.They are all Bible based beliefs.There’s one or two I have a problem with but I won’t go into that.
    @patrickt @Quark and whoever else here are non believers in God.That’s your right not to believe just as believing in Him is my right and I will conduct myself accordingly. I like you guys or I wouldn’t even bother responding to you.Just a little mutual respect and civility is all I ask.
    The true Church belongs to Jesus Christ.Those who pervert it are worse off in the end than those who don’t believe in it at all.

    When I was in college a student studying to be a preacher said he wanted to prove to me, logically and rationally, that there is a god. I agreed and met him in his dorm room.

    He started by picking up his Bible and saying, "Surely you will agree the Bible is the word of God."
    I laughed and said, "You want to convince me, logically and rationally, the a god exists by starting with me agreeing a god authored a book?"

    I apologize if I'm sometimes rude but frustration and insults does thatWhy would anyone who sees no evidence of any gods and doesn't believe in magic listen to nonsense about what a god said or what angels and demons and devils and witches are supposedly doing. Why would anyone support the killing of witches, but just the real ones, and regret more people weren't killed in the massacre in Orlando? Why would people who say these things claim to represent a religion of peace and a god of love?

    There is always an escape hatch for Christians. Reminds me of Barack Obama. The two great escapes, Houdini-like, are "it's in the Bible" and "he's not a real Christian". And, again like Barack Obama, the god gets credit for everything good like the hurricane missed your town and someone else gets the blame for everything bad like the town the hurricane leveled.

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  13. #37
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    @usfan

    I have no small inkling, that some of the animosity round these parts...has an odd source.

    You like bullets and numbers (so do I)

    1. Atheists on political forums have always "stung" Christians about their "religion" and about "believing" in God. The ridiculing snark comments produced something from Christians over time. This forum never really had much of that, but many others did and do.

    2. Christians started pushing a ridiculous meme of sorts that atheists are "religious" and have a belief system in a "non deity".

    3. The above (by design) was done in direct response to the ridiculing snark of No.1. It was basically done to say to the atheist, you are a believer, and you are religious...with the intent to get under the skin with such a preposterous allegation.

    4. This makes a loop.

    5. This loop becomes increasingly filled with ridiculing, snark infested waters, from both sides.

    So my friend...let's make a start. I will not engage in any ridiculing of your belief in a deity, and you stop trying to say that, as an atheist...I am religious and have a belief system that is just like a believers.

    Yeah, yeah I know. It won't stop subterfuge threads/posts of duplicitous intent by some, from both sides of this coin...however, a start always has be made to get out of a loop.

    BTW...I really do enjoy coming out of left field with stuff like this to you...heh. Breaks the monotony.
    Last edited by Canadianeye; 12-07-2017 at 09:26 AM.
    The Progressives have become full blown NAZIs, to thwart a Hitler that doesn't exist...since that is the only way they can express, and self justify, their fascism.

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    Let's dispense with the term 'religion!' as it has become so fluid it has no meaning or common definition.

    How about we call the belief/opinion/theory about the Nature of Man, the Supernatural, & the Universe... Fred.

    So, everyone has a Fred. Your Fred is a belief/opinion/theory that there is no supernatural intervention in the universe, but that everything has happened by natural processes. Origins of matter, energy, life, & species are all natural processes, with no supernatural involvement.

    That is your Fred. It is not a religion, it is Fred.

    My opinion/belief/theory is that a Supreme Being was the First Cause of all things. He created matter, energy, & life, & all things have their origins from a Supernatural First Cause.

    This is not a 'religion!' either. It is my Fred.

    So nobody is 'waking up!' from anything. Our opinions/beliefs/theories about origins, the nature of the universe, man, & life have just changed Freds. Some have had naturalistic freds & have changed to supernatural ones. Some have gone the other way. Some don't know, some don't care. It is all fred to me.

    It seems to me that too many atheists pretend to take some kind of intellectual high road, & claim they have no beliefs/opinions/theories about the nature of man & the universe. That is absurd. Of course they do. Why pretend otherwise, other than to try to take a intellectually superior position, & claim victory by definition? There are no facts for this belief, just fred.
    Rather than love, than money, than fame, give me truth. ~Henry David Thoreau

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    Quote Originally Posted by usfan View Post
    Let's dispense with the term 'religion!' as it has become so fluid it has no meaning or common definition.

    How about we call the belief/opinion/theory about the Nature of Man, the Supernatural, & the Universe... Fred.

    So, everyone has a Fred. Your Fred is a belief/opinion/theory that there is no supernatural intervention in the universe, but that everything has happened by natural processes. Origins of matter, energy, life, & species are all natural processes, with no supernatural involvement.

    That is your Fred. It is not a religion, it is Fred.

    My opinion/belief/theory is that a Supreme Being was the First Cause of all things. He created matter, energy, & life, & all things have their origins from a Supernatural First Cause.

    This is not a 'religion!' either. It is my Fred.

    So nobody is 'waking up!' from anything. Our opinions/beliefs/theories about origins, the nature of the universe, man, & life have just changed Freds. Some have had naturalistic freds & have changed to supernatural ones. Some have gone the other way. Some don't know, some don't care. It is all fred to me.

    It seems to me that too many atheists pretend to take some kind of intellectual high road, & claim they have no beliefs/opinions/theories about the nature of man & the universe. That is absurd. Of course they do. Why pretend otherwise, other than to try to take a intellectually superior position, & claim victory by definition? There are no facts for this belief, just fred.
    No, you have a Fred and you want to believe everyone does. I don't deny there is a god, goblins, witches, fairies, demons, and so forth. I simply say there is no evidence to support such beliefs. Don't make the mistake of assuming others have beliefs as you do. I have a few beliefs that are quite different than yours. I believe most people are basically good and are doing the best they can. I understand some believe people are inherently evil at birth and have to be saved by being washed in he blood of the lamb. For me, that's a disgusting image but then I don't believe people are inherently evil and need to be "saved".

    I believe nothing concerning gods or other magical ideas. I'm happy to wait for evidence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by patrickt View Post
    Faith based on faith based on yet more faith. And infallible besides. I wonder why Jesus didn't just wave his hand and have everything he ever said written down on granite slabs instead of leaving it up to men, much later, to write what they imagined their god was telling them to write?

    Well, that would have defeated the glory of faith built on faith built on yet more faith.
    Firstly..."So Jesus said to them, “When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am he, and that I do nothing on my own authority, but speak just as the Father taught me." ~ John 8:28

    Secondly...."So you see, faith by itself isn't enough. Unless it produces good deeds, it is dead and useless." ~ James 2:17

    And of course....

    "We also have the message of the prophets, which has been confirmed beyond doubt. And you will do well to pay attention to this message, as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. Above all,you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture comes from the prophet’s own interpretation. For no prophecy was ever brought about through human initiative, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.…" ~ 2 Pet. 1:19-21

    And for us to get there, one must gain knowledge, and be able to separate the Literal, Figurative and Symbolic language of the Bible, all with God's blessing.
    .
    Last edited by S-N-A-F-U; 12-07-2017 at 02:28 PM.

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