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Thread: Were the laws of thermodynamics broken on 9/11 in addition to the laws of physics?

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustPassinThru View Post
    We might as well argue about religion.

    I don't see the question. It's pretty self-evident to me.

    It has become a religion to the easily fooled and the gullible losers who want a cause to believe in.

    They're little different than the Climate Change whacks and the Socialist True Believers.

    I wish they would find Jesus instead. The Jesus Freaks aren't as annoying.
    Freedom Takes "I Won't". - Eric Frank Russell

    We the People DID NOT vote in a majority Rodent Congress, they stole it via election fraud.

    1 out of 2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2

    = 1/4,194,304
    = "Heads, Always Heads, Heads Every Time"
    = "Rodents Cheating"

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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan40 View Post
    Read up on exoskeleton construction rather than central core construction. The floor were hung on the outside steel frame, not built out from a central core. This was done to allow wide interior spaces with no support columns.

    Went the top floors came down they pushed the outside frame out and loose. That is also why the towers went down faster and faster but NEVER approached or exceeded terminal velocity.
    Strictly speaking, the fires on the impacted floors caused those stringers to expand, introducing severe displacements and consequent bending moments in the columns, thus turning the compression members into compression members carrying significant moment, the standard beam-column that can be so sensitive to bucking and crippling loads.

    Compounding the beam-column loads, the intense heat of the fire reduced the rivet shear strength by at least 50%, and...rivets totally suck as tension fasteners.

    Shall I point out how the expanding floor stringers forced the structural columns outwards, thereby ...introducing tension loads on rivets intended for shear-only applications?

    The rivets popped, the floors came down.

    Not complicated at all. I fail to understand why people refuse to accept this.

    A building was attacked by an airplane.

    Both lost.
    Freedom Takes "I Won't". - Eric Frank Russell

    We the People DID NOT vote in a majority Rodent Congress, they stole it via election fraud.

    1 out of 2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2x2

    = 1/4,194,304
    = "Heads, Always Heads, Heads Every Time"
    = "Rodents Cheating"

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  5. #33
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    I'm just here to stir the pot....



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    Quote Originally Posted by JustPassinThru View Post
    Inertia.

    The trusses in the floors above, let go. Those were stamped steel and steel rods, riveted together. They let go with the heat, and the concrete came down like a pancake slid off the spatula.

    WITH them, they took EVERYTHING ABOVE them. So half the building started sliding downward, thanks to gravity and the failed supports midway up.

    And they didn't just stop when they came to the first non-involved floor, 15 feet lower. No, the sudden impact of all that weight, and all of it destabilized...welds and fasteners letting go...like a snow avalanche, they just kept on going. Right to the ground level.
    The definition of inertia doesn't jive with your explanation,

    in·er·tia

    /iˈnərSHə/

    noun


    • 1.a tendency to do nothing or to remain unchanged:"the bureaucratic inertia of government"
    • 2.a property of matter by which it continues in its existing state of rest or uniform motion in a straight line, unless that state is changed by an external force.




    Last edited by East of the Beast; 02-11-2019 at 03:20 AM.



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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Rivers View Post
    All the floors were suspended and "hung" from the outer walls. They came down like a literal house of cards.

    Believe me...I read the entire PRIVATE brief done with building engineers and consulting scientists. If there was something there...that law firm full of Jews and Wops would have been suing every which way from Sunday.

    Arabs flew jets into the buildings. That's what happened.
    I guess I'm not making myself clear.I said I was NOT a conspiracy guy but only wondered why the towers fell as they did.Your last 2 sentences are the truth.



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    I cannot go too much for the 911 "truthers" debate equating to a debate about religion. At least the people that are religious were consoled some by their faith, as they laid to rest their loved ones post 911. These same 911 survivors while reading these "truther" debates IMO, will just get the feeling akin to a knife running through their gut. Not a feeling I have ever endured, when sparring with anyone about my religious beliefs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by East of the Beast View Post
    The definition of inertia doesn't jive with your explanation,

    in·er·tia

    /iˈnərSHə/

    noun


    • 1.a tendency to do nothing or to remain unchanged:"the bureaucratic inertia of government"
    • 2.a property of matter by which it continues in its existing state of rest or uniform motion in a straight line, unless that state is changed by an external force.




    They had the right idea, just the wrong word.

    Definition of momentum



    1 : a property (see property sense 1a) of a moving body that the body has by virtue of its mass (see mass entry 2 sense 1c) and motion and that is equal to the product of the body's mass and velocity broadly : a property of a moving body that determines the length of time required to bring it to rest when under the action of a constant force or moment

    2 : strength or force gained by motion or by a series of events The wagon gained momentum as it rolled down the hill.


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    Some notes on FIREPROOFING of Steel Members (Beams, Columns, and, if need be, metal decking)

    (And yes, this IS something I know about, as that is part of what we do, in my business)

    #1. When metal heats, it starts to drastically lose it's tensile strength. It often starts to bend and buckle, on it's own.

    #2. A PASSIVE Fireproofing system involves "spraying" a sprayed-on fireproofing which will give the structure what is called an "hourly rating." This is how long the fireproofing can be expected to deflect the heat away from steel. Note that this is a LIMITED time, as the fireproofing itself degenerates in order to "sink" the heat away from steel.

    #3. IF there is a "gap" in this system, the heat can effectively bypass the fireproofing to a large degree, as the heat will be absorbed and passed through the steel.

    #4. The fireproofing from the Two Towers was likely dated, and, probably needed some touch up. BUT, it was designed for typical fires, not the sort of intense heat from a Passenger Jet, full of Jet Fuel.

    #5. Each tower was "rated" for "One Hour." If you look at the time line, despite all the other issues, each tower lasted for approximately 1 hour.

    #6. I know, that at least with one of the towers, we can actually SEE the top of the building start to "twist." Once that happens, it is coming down. You have tons and tons of weight, pushing down on steel that is becoming "soft." ALL IT TAKES is for a few of these members to start failing, and you get a catastrophic failure of the system.

    While I have NOT personally inspected the site (and, I wouldn't know exactly what to look for if I had), I can say this as someone who works in the field of Fireproofing:

    EVERYTHING acted and appeared as one would expect, under such intense heat.

    INCLUDING the "1 hour" fire rating to which it was built.

    Simple physics
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    Quote Originally Posted by East of the Beast View Post
    I'm no conspiracy guy but I always wondered why the whole buildings collapsed.I can understand why the floors above the point of attack would collapse but how would that affect the floors below? It would seem to me that the weight of the floors above the attack did not change or add any additional weight or structural stress to the floors below.

    But there are people that are way smarter than me who know all the determining factors which I'm not privy to....just my feeble observation
    #1. The above floors, "fell" on to the lower floors. Not only was their weight added, the energy from each floor falling to the one below was added.

    #2. Skyscrapers are built in such a manner, that the structure ABOVE a floor, may, in fact, help stabilize/strengthen that floor...) When the upper floors fell, they fell in a disorganized, chaotic manner, putting stress and weight unevenly, further stressing the structure.

    #3. Under intense heat, steel starts to lose TENSILE strength, with can cause it to "twist," even as it loses strength. ALL of this is a "system," so, when parts of the structure begin to fail to such a large degree, the whole system starts to unravel.
    Al Swearengen: What's your partner so mad about all the time?
    Sol Star: He's not mad.
    Al Swearengen: He's got a mean way of being happy.



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    Quote Originally Posted by East of the Beast View Post
    The definition of inertia doesn't jive with your explanation,

    in·er·tia

    /iˈnərSHə/

    noun


    • 1.a tendency to do nothing or to remain unchanged:"the bureaucratic inertia of government"
    • 2.a property of matter by which it continues in its existing state of rest or uniform motion in a straight line, unless that state is changed by an external force.




    Ask Mr Newton. He knows.
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