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Thread: Pray For America Unity

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    Quote Originally Posted by S-N-A-F-U View Post
    Hardly! There has never been an "end to this system of things." That only happens once!


    "The End Of All Things Is Near." 1 Pet. 4:7

    "But know this, that in the last days critical times hard to deal with...." 2 Ti
    m. 3:1-4

    That means exactly what it says.

    Biblically speaking, things have had a tendency to repeat themselves as precursor leading to the final event. However, when Scripture speaks of the end times, or the end of all things it speaks with finality with Armaggedon highlighting that culmination when all earthly govts will be destroyed along with the evil that pervades this earth once and for all!

    Stay tuned....










    When was there a time when men WEREN'T "lovers of themselves, lovers of money, proud, boastful," etc.?

    That's not much of a PROPHESY is what I'm saying...
    "If you think they hate Trump now, wait till his policies start working." (Dennis Miller)

    "Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who kept their swords." (Benjamin Franklin)


    "Tolerance is the last virtue of a dying society." ​(Aristotle)

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    Quote Originally Posted by S-N-A-F-U View Post
    Hardly! There has never been an "end to this system of things." That only happens once!


    "The End Of All Things Is Near." 1 Pet. 4:7

    "But know this, that in the last days critical times hard to deal with...." 2 Ti
    m. 3:1-4

    That means exactly what it says.

    Biblically speaking, things have had a tendency to repeat themselves as precursor leading to the final event. However, when Scripture speaks of the end times, or the end of all things it speaks with finality with Armaggedon highlighting that culmination when all earthly govts will be destroyed along with the evil that pervades this earth once and for all!

    Stay tuned....










    According to the bible, we were ALREADY in the "last days" when this was written. What do the scriptures mean by "NEAR"? If "near" can be over 1900 years away, how would they say "near" if they meant only a few years? (i.e. - "Oh, I meant "near" as in many centuries from now, not "near" as in, REALLY "near" ) It is pretty obvious that the intent of the writers of these "almost at the door" passages were telling those that read it that they themselves would see the fulfillment of it, if they lived long enough. When that didn't happen, "near" had to be "spiritualized" to pertain to ANY length of time so that no one could say the passages were not fulfilled. When things don't go the way you thought they would, "move the goalposts back". That's what they did, doctrinally.
    Last edited by SharetheHedge; 05-15-2018 at 09:22 PM.
    "If you think they hate Trump now, wait till his policies start working." (Dennis Miller)

    "Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who kept their swords." (Benjamin Franklin)


    "Tolerance is the last virtue of a dying society." ​(Aristotle)

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    Quote Originally Posted by SharetheHedge View Post
    According to the bible, we were ALREADY in the "last days" when this was written. What do the scriptures mean by "NEAR"? If "near" can be over 1900 years away, how would they say "near" if they meant only a few years? (i.e. - "Oh, I meant "near" as in many centuries from now, not "near" as in, REALLY "near" ) It is pretty obvious that the intent of the writers of these "almost at the door" passages were telling those that read it that they themselves would see the fulfillment of it, if they lived long enough. When that didn't happen, "near" had to be "spiritualized" to pertain to ANY length of time so that no one could say the passages were not fulfilled. When things don't go the way you thought they would, "move the goalposts back". That's what they did, doctrinally.
    Whoa...

    Chapter 24 of Matthew answers many of these questions, in that many things had to take place over the centuries before the "end."

    Many folks in the world are mesmerized by current events.-- Not to mention, the explosive depravity and debauchery taken place around us and being ignored.

    Many knew that the end would come according to prophecy. And yes, many through history asserted themselves prematurely ignoring certain prophecies that must prevail first.

    A number of events have occurred in the past as warnings of eminent destruction. Two of which were the destruction of Babylon and Sodom and Gomorrah for sinful practices that God had condemned -- "These people are a stench in my nostrils, an acrid smell that never goes away." (Isa. 65)

    It's not the first time that depraved man has again stuck their metaphorical thumb in God's eye with the advent of homosexual marriages starting to be condoned by many nations. The murder of one's prodigy for convenience sake. The wanton murder of Christians on the increase in certain parts of the world -- No one should be naive in believing that God will let this stand

    As a warning, natural phenomena has increased exponentially over the last few decades as one of God's instruments of destruction for an unrepentant man.

    Jesus instructed his disciples on the "End Times."

    "As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. "Tell us," they said, "when will this happen [end-times], and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" Jesus answered: "Watch out that no one deceives you. For many will come in my name, claiming,'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many. You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginning of birth pains. Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me." (Mat 24:3-9)

    As brought out previously, Armageddon is only mentioned once in the Bible as a prophetic picture of what will happen in the future, but on a much larger cataclysmic scale that will encompass the whole earth. No, that war won't be fought entirely in the M.E. per se, we're already there. The battles of Meggetto of the past is unimportant -- and reference to Armageddon is only symbolic in God's scheme of things. (Rev. 16:16; Jer. 25:32-34; Ezek. 39:17-20)

    The battle of Armageddon refers to the final war between human governments and God. These governments and their supporters oppose God even now by refusing to submit to his rulership. (Psalm. 2:2) The battle of Armageddon will bring human rulership to an end. ~ Daniel 2:44

    Based on societal decay, depravity and wholesale corruption in every part of the world -- that realization is not to far off. The above Scriptures bring that reality into focus.
    Last edited by S-N-A-F-U; 05-16-2018 at 06:50 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by S-N-A-F-U View Post
    Whoa...

    Chapter 24 of Matthew answers many of these questions, in that many things had to take place over the centuries before the "end."

    Many folks in the world are mesmerized by current events.-- Not to mention, the explosive depravity and debauchery taken place around us and being ignored.

    Many knew that the end would come according to prophecy. And yes, many through history asserted themselves prematurely ignoring certain prophecies that must prevail first.

    A number of events have occurred in the past as warnings of eminent destruction. Two of which were the destruction of Babylon and Sodom and Gomorrah for sinful practices that God had condemned -- "These people are a stench in my nostrils, an acrid smell that never goes away." (Isa. 65)

    It's not the first time that depraved man has again stuck their metaphorical thumb in God's eye with the advent of homosexual marriages starting to be condoned by many nations. The murder of one's prodigy for convenience sake. The wanton murder of Christians on the increase in certain parts of the world -- No one should be naive in believing that God will let this stand

    As a warning, natural phenomena has increased exponentially over the last few decades as one of God's instruments of destruction for an unrepentant man.

    Jesus instructed his disciples on the "End Times."

    "As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. "Tell us," they said, "when will this happen [end-times], and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" Jesus answered: "Watch out that no one deceives you. For many will come in my name, claiming,'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many. You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come. Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places. All these are the beginning of birth pains. Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me." (Mat 24:3-9)

    As brought out previously, Armageddon is only mentioned once in the Bible as a prophetic picture of what will happen in the future, but on a much larger cataclysmic scale that will encompass the whole earth. No, that war won't be fought entirely in the M.E. per se, we're already there. The battles of Meggetto of the past is unimportant -- and reference to Armageddon is only symbolic in God's scheme of things. (Rev. 16:16; Jer. 25:32-34; Ezek. 39:17-20)

    The battle of Armageddon refers to the final war between human governments and God. These governments and their supporters oppose God even now by refusing to submit to his rulership. (Psalm. 2:2) The battle of Armageddon will bring human rulership to an end. ~ Daniel 2:44

    Based on societal decay, depravity and wholesale corruption in every part of the world -- that realization is not to far off. The above Scriptures bring that reality into focus.

    You didn't address my points? Why would the bible describe events as "near" if they were to be over 1900 years in the future? What would "near" mean to those who heard it back then? The context of the "Coming of the Son of Man" is that it would happen within the lifetimes of at least some of those who heard Jesus say this, or read it soon after it was first written down, still in the first century.

    Matthew 16:27-28 (NKJV) "For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. 28 "Assuredly, I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."


    No, this was NOT referring to the "Transfiguration". That is a very weak and desperate explanation to reconcile the fact that those standing there, at that time, did NOT live to "see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom". (unless you accept the Preterist view) The whole context of the previous passage is about his full return and the end of the age, and he did NOT return "with his angels" at what has become known as the Transfiguration.
    "If you think they hate Trump now, wait till his policies start working." (Dennis Miller)

    "Those who beat their swords into plowshares usually end up plowing for those who kept their swords." (Benjamin Franklin)


    "Tolerance is the last virtue of a dying society." ​(Aristotle)

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    Quote Originally Posted by SharetheHedge View Post
    You didn't address my points? Why would the bible describe events as "near" if they were to be over 1900 years in the future? What would "near" mean to those who heard it back then? The context of the "Coming of the Son of Man" is that it would happen within the lifetimes of at least some of those who heard Jesus say this, or read it soon after it was first written down, still in the first century.

    Matthew 16:27-28 (NKJV) "For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. 28 "Assuredly, I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."


    No, this was NOT referring to the "Transfiguration". That is a very weak and desperate explanation to reconcile the fact that those standing there, at that time, did NOT live to "see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom". (unless you accept the Preterist view) The whole context of the previous passage is about his full return and the end of the age, and he did NOT return "with his angels" at what has become known as the Transfiguration.
    There was a bit of confusion on this with the early church. The Christians that were talking with Paul were asking him if they missed the second coming. He explained that they didn't.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SharetheHedge View Post
    You didn't address my points? Why would the bible describe events as "near" if they were to be over 1900 years in the future? What would "near" mean to those who heard it back then? The context of the "Coming of the Son of Man" is that it would happen within the lifetimes of at least some of those who heard Jesus say this, or read it soon after it was first written down, still in the first century.
    Matthew 16:27-28 (NKJV) "For the Son of Man will come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and then He will reward each according to his works. 28 "Assuredly, I say to you, there are some standing here who shall not taste death till they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom."


    No, this was NOT referring to the "Transfiguration". That is a very weak and desperate explanation to reconcile the fact that those standing there, at that time, did NOT live to "see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom". (unless you accept the Preterist view) The whole context of the previous passage is about his full return and the end of the age, and he did NOT return "with his angels" at what has become known as the Transfiguration.
    In the book The Last Days Are Here Again, Professor Richard Kyle writes that “sudden change and social chaos create an atmosphere conducive to predictions of the end of the world. That is especially the case when the change and chaos seem hard to explain." Indeed it does!

    However, the Bible prophets who spoke about the end were not trying to explain baffling events of their day. Instead, they were inspired by God to describe conditions that would indicate an imminent end of the world. Consider some of those prophecies and decide for yourself whether they are being fulfilled in our time. Wars, famines, earthquakes, and epidemics of deadly disease.--Matt. 24:7; Luke 21;11.

    Significant increase in crime.--Matt. 24:12.

    The ruining of the earth by mankind--Rev. 11:18.

    People who love themselves, money, and pleasures but do not love God.--2 Tim. 3:2,4.

    The breakdown of the family.--2 Tim. 3:2-3.

    General apathy toward the evidence of the approaching end.--Matt. 24:37-39.

    The preaching of the good news of God’s Kingdom worldwide.--Matt. 24:14.

    In a comparative sense with the past the conditions we now experience has magnified exponentially on a world scale.
    As Jesus said, seeing “all these things” lets us know that the end of the world is near. Matt. 24:33

    Mistaken expectations by some think the end will never come.

    THE BIBLE’S ANSWER (concerning world societies): “Whenever it is that they are saying: ‘Peace and security!’ then sudden destruction is to be instantly upon them just as the pang of distress upon a pregnant woman; and they will by no means escape.”-- 1 Thess. 5:3.

    ‘If the sign that we are near the end is so obvious,’ one might ask, ‘why do so many people fail to recognize it?’ The Bible shows that when the end is near, many will belittle the evidence. Rather than acknowledge the fundamental changes during the last days, they would scoff: “From the day our forefathers fell asleep in death, all things are continuing exactly as from creation’s beginning.” (2 Pet. 3:3-4)
    IOW, the sign of the last days is clear, but many will ignore it. --Matt. 24:38-39

    Regarding the question of Transfiguration...

    Luke 9:27 says, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God." See also Matthew 16:28 and Mark 9:1 for the parallel quotes. In each of the synoptic Gospels, the next event immediately after this promise from Jesus is the transfiguration. Rather than interpreting Jesus' promise as referring to His coming to establish His kingdom on earth, the context indicates that Jesus was referring to the transfiguration. The Greek word translated "kingdom"¯ can also be translated "royal splendor,"¯ meaning that the three disciples standing there would see Christ as He really is, which occurred in the transfiguration.

    The "transfiguration"¯ refers to the event described in the above cited passages when Jesus took Peter, James, and John to the top of the mountain, where He met with Moses and Elijah—representing the Law and the Prophets of the Old Testament—and spoke with them. The disciples saw Jesus in all His glory and splendor, talking with a glorified Moses and Elijah. This is a glimpse of what will occur in Jesus' kingdom. The disciples were dumbstruck at the sight and "fell on their faces"¯ (Matthew 17:6).

    It seems most natural to interpret this promise in Matthew 16:28; Mark 9:1; and Luke 9:27 as a reference to the transfiguration, which "some" of the disciples would witness only six days later, exactly as Jesus predicted. In each Gospel, the very next passage after this promise from Jesus is the transfiguration, which shows Jesus in all His glory which will be seen again in the Kingdom of God. The contextual links make it very clear that this is the proper interpretation.


    'Nuff said! In view of becoming repetitive...
    Last edited by S-N-A-F-U; 05-17-2018 at 07:08 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by S-N-A-F-U View Post
    In the book The Last Days Are Here Again, Professor Richard Kyle writes that “sudden change and social chaos create an atmosphere conducive to predictions of the end of the world. That is especially the case when the change and chaos seem hard to explain." Indeed it does!

    However, the Bible prophets who spoke about the end were not trying to explain baffling events of their day. Instead, they were inspired by God to describe conditions that would indicate an imminent end of the world. Consider some of those prophecies and decide for yourself whether they are being fulfilled in our time. Wars, famines, earthquakes, and epidemics of deadly disease.--Matt. 24:7; Luke 21;11.

    Significant increase in crime.--Matt. 24:12.

    The ruining of the earth by mankind--Rev. 11:18.

    People who love themselves, money, and pleasures but do not love God.--2 Tim. 3:2,4.

    The breakdown of the family.--2 Tim. 3:2-3.

    General apathy toward the evidence of the approaching end.--Matt. 24:37-39.

    The preaching of the good news of God’s Kingdom worldwide.--Matt. 24:14.

    In a comparative sense with the past the conditions we now experience has magnified exponentially on a world scale.
    As Jesus said, seeing “all these things” lets us know that the end of the world is near. Matt. 24:33

    Mistaken expectations by some think the end will never come.

    THE BIBLE’S ANSWER (concerning world societies): “Whenever it is that they are saying: ‘Peace and security!’ then sudden destruction is to be instantly upon them just as the pang of distress upon a pregnant woman; and they will by no means escape.”-- 1 Thess. 5:3.

    ‘If the sign that we are near the end is so obvious,’ one might ask, ‘why do so many people fail to recognize it?’ The Bible shows that when the end is near, many will belittle the evidence. Rather than acknowledge the fundamental changes during the last days, they would scoff: “From the day our forefathers fell asleep in death, all things are continuing exactly as from creation’s beginning.” (2 Pet. 3:3-4)
    IOW, the sign of the last days is clear, but many will ignore it. --Matt. 24:38-39

    Regarding the question of Transfiguration...

    Luke 9:27 says, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God." See also Matthew 16:28 and Mark 9:1 for the parallel quotes. In each of the synoptic Gospels, the next event immediately after this promise from Jesus is the transfiguration. Rather than interpreting Jesus' promise as referring to His coming to establish His kingdom on earth, the context indicates that Jesus was referring to the transfiguration. The Greek word translated "kingdom"¯ can also be translated "royal splendor,"¯ meaning that the three disciples standing there would see Christ as He really is, which occurred in the transfiguration.

    The "transfiguration"¯ refers to the event described in the above cited passages when Jesus took Peter, James, and John to the top of the mountain, where He met with Moses and Elijah—representing the Law and the Prophets of the Old Testament—and spoke with them. The disciples saw Jesus in all His glory and splendor, talking with a glorified Moses and Elijah. This is a glimpse of what will occur in Jesus' kingdom. The disciples were dumbstruck at the sight and "fell on their faces"¯ (Matthew 17:6).

    It seems most natural to interpret this promise in Matthew 16:28; Mark 9:1; and Luke 9:27 as a reference to the transfiguration, which "some" of the disciples would witness only six days later, exactly as Jesus predicted. In each Gospel, the very next passage after this promise from Jesus is the transfiguration, which shows Jesus in all His glory which will be seen again in the Kingdom of God. The contextual links make it very clear that this is the proper interpretation.


    'Nuff said! In view of becoming repetitive...

    The only reason to interpret the transfiguration as the event described in those previous passages is that there is a big problem if you DON'T. Again, he did not come "with the angels" at the transfiguration, and what sense does it make to say some of you will not taste death until this happens if it's going to happen only a few days later? It makes more sense that the trans was added to those gospels LATER to try provide another event that could be construed as possibly fulfilling the "shall not taste of death" prophecy. In order to consider the common sense of that explanation though, you would have to be objective and not necessarily believe that the NT we have is identical to the original copies, which we don't have, that there were no significant changes made down through the many years of recopying by "who knows who". All very tenuous.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knightkore View Post
    There was a bit of confusion on this with the early church. The Christians that were talking with Paul were asking him if they missed the second coming. He explained that they didn't.

    What were those believer's understanding of the second coming before Paul answered them? It was about 20 years (?) after Christ at this point and the gospels had not been written yet. Did they know anything (other than the death and resurrection) of what would later be compiled in the gospels? If even Paul knew anything else, he didn't reference it in all those epistles? What I'm getting at is how do we know most of the events and words that Jesus had supposedly did and spoke were not just manufactured by later gospel writers? There was no one who was control of this that could have prevented such "creative license" - you just have to use faith to even believe the transmission of the scriptures itself was miraculous, not only the events therein?
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    Quote Originally Posted by SharetheHedge View Post
    The only reason to interpret the transfiguration as the event described in those previous passages is that there is a big problem if you DON'T. Again, he did not come "with the angels" at the transfiguration, and what sense does it make to say some of you will not taste death until this happens if it's going to happen only a few days later? It makes more sense that the trans was added to those gospels LATER to try provide another event that could be construed as possibly fulfilling the "shall not taste of death" prophecy. In order to consider the common sense of that explanation though, you would have to be objective and not necessarily believe that the NT we have is identical to the original copies, which we don't have, that there were no significant changes made down through the many years of recopying by "who knows who". All very tenuous.

    These "prophets of old" were specially selected to act as God's secretaries if you will. They were guided by God to set forth the principles as they were imbued to do. They were free of the machinations of man or the influence of evil spirits. That is not to say that there weren't other prophets with evil intent to confuse and mislead as Satan's acolytes. If one stays close to God's written word as the final arbiter one can ferret out the imposters. God does protect his word.


    "And we also thank God continually because, when you received the word of God, which you heard from us, you accepted it not as a human word, but as it actually is, the word of God, which is indeed at work in you who believe." -- 1 Thess. 2:13


    "Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet’s own interpretation of things.For prophecy never had its origin in the human will, but prophets, though human, spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit." -- 2 Pet. 1:20-21

    "God spoke through the mouth of his holy prophets of old time." -- Acts 3:21
    Last edited by S-N-A-F-U; 05-17-2018 at 10:52 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by S-N-A-F-U View Post
    These "prophets of old" were specially selected to act as God's secretaries if you will. They were guided by God to set forth the principles as they were imbued to do. They were free of the machinations of man or the influence of evil spirits. That is not to say that there weren't other prophets with evil intent to confuse and mislead as Satan's acolytes. If one stays close to God's written word as the final arbiter one can ferret out the imposters. God does protect his word.


    "And we also thank God continually because, when you received the word of God, which you heard from us, you accepted it not as a human word, but as it actually is, the word of God, which is indeed at work in you who believe." -- 1 Thess. 2:13


    "Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet’s own interpretation of things.For prophecy never had its origin in the human will, but prophets, though human, spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit." -- 2 Pet. 1:20-21

    "God spoke through the mouth of his holy prophets of old time." -- Acts 3:21

    I don't see how your responses have anything to do with what I've been saying

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